The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices
Aboriginal occupation - 60k+ years
Settler descended occupation - 235 years
Constitution - 122 years
Dreamings/Law - Millennia
Yes - possibilities
No - Treaty time
burleigh wrote:basesix wrote:^ tryin to work out if that is you in the gimp mask, subverting from within, or in the fedora taking the foo selfie ; )
I'm 99% sure its harryCoopr
That's me in the trucker cap
Northern Territory Chief Minister copped a sidewinder pie on the sly...
Ok! If ya see ya just deserts comin'...this one looked a little more personal!
Like as if she was friendly with...or at least knew her Pie Smearer!
Note how the Chick Forces the Leader's face Into the Pie...that's no laughing matter...pretty full on!
Intention was to smear her face into the Plate not just a Smoosh but forceful Squishing of her face!
Reckon that's next level but Minister has put on a brave face & is calmly holdin' fire...!
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-09-24/nt-chief-minister-natasha-fyles-a...
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nt-chief-minister-allegedly-attacked-nea...
indo-dreaming wrote:There you go, i knew you could do it, you hadn't run out of insults.
Each to their own but i kind of find the whole insult thing at bit pointless, it totally loses any effect when over used, IMHO its best saved for rare occasions when you really might need it to make a point.
Plus i think the whole insult, negativity towards people, hate thing, is worse for the persons mental health giving it than receiving it, it's just eats people up, you see it here sometimes people burn themselves out
I never let that happen to me, most of the time i can seperate differences in opinion to the people giving the opinion.
20 more days of this, so don't forget to pace yourself.
Dipshit
There are ways to work together ;)
https://m.
faaark me, tbb, thanks for the heads up, what an insight, watching a rep from a particular generation of privilege (the k-man grew up an eastern suburbs Kings College adelaide boy) slowly think this through.. and loving hearing himself say things about things to people... Geebers..
Yeah he’s informed now that its not 40 billion or 30 billion or as KBW said 33 billion but 4.5 billion, fark me he sounded like he’d had a few sherry’s .
Fact finding for pants shitters ;)
https://m.
How to grow up in front of an Oz TV Audience..many soapie stars brag 'bout this chore!
Watch how the coolest of Oz dudes just aged 10 years on one Sunday Nite!
Post Worst interview of his career!
Hamish : "Yeah & Maybe also Journalists in programs & people in programs & people that are informing have a job to make sure that wot we put on Telly or in Newspapers is Factually sound and correct, obviously everyone has opinions!"
tbb did inform that Murdoch's slave boy Kamahl...only ever acted as if he was crazed Aboriginal killer!
https://www.swellnet.com/forums/wax/521681?page=100
Hamish: "Like why did none of you dopey fuckwits check out that loose unit before we went live..."
"You! You! & You! Are all dead to me...you can all join Lisa on the Psych Couch / bench woteva!"
Fuck yeah! tbb had given up on Sunday Telly...just woke the fuck up...Like Wow! Wipeout!
Never dreamed it could be Adversarial or even woteva that meant...
That is shit hot...thanks for the replay...base six...Sunday Nite Gold Logie right there...got tbb's Vote!
Kamahl :
I got a lonely feeling that I'm hearin' the Sounds of Goodbye!
Just gotta backtrack to NT Chief Minister's "Assault"
Only coz this is yet another Vid & story that can't possibly ring true...defies all logic!
All news are runnin' this event took place Today "Sunday" at 11:40 @ Nightcliff 'Markets!'
Ok! So it kind sounds Ok if ya close yer eyes to everything & ignore the Assault
1. All see NT Leader is exiting from a Community Bank with Security Cams overseeing the assault.
2. Nightcliff Community Bank doesn't open on Sundays...(However!)
On this particular Sunday in Question the Bank celebrated it's 15th Anniversary (10:30-12:00)
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=786343026828044&set=a.499356145526735
Meaning her attacker planned the Assault to time with Leader's Invited speech at The Bank.
Incident was timed as Minister exited Bank Celebrations and is captured on Camera...
That is if... if it was actually operating on a Sunday & if any tellers & banking was done...Doubtful!
Check for yerselves...8:30 am morning in question is all decked out for Minister's Speech with seating
Balloons & Closed Teller's counter! Clock & Post time as one for eve of celebration! All is Perfect!
https://www.facebook.com/communitybanknightcliff/
Also Perfect for her Attacker as 11:00 Formal Proceeding Time was posted on facebook!
Attacker rocks up & awaits for Minister to finish Speech & the very second she exits...
It's pie time...Too Easy thanx to the Bank! No security!
tbb thinks perhaps the Bank's Entry Camera was turned off as usual on Sundays...
None thought to up security for a 1 & half hour party...
Meaning the Bank Cam was down as usual for a Sunday then...
Bank can't identify her attacker...all we see is a presumed woman's back from her own team's Vid !
Reckon the Media were sent Vid from the Pie Squad & bank has got nuthin' to ID the Grubs.
Also looks like a bad wig on that Chick...possible funny face disguise...hence the Minister's Smile!
Yep! Reckon this rates as creepy with Bank timing & assault!
Minister is stuck with no proof of ID of attacker...
Reckon the bank are embarrassed about major Security Lapse during #1's Invitation.
Hence the MEDIA were instructed to run with the Market Story...nothing to see here!
Media has the Grubby Vid with no identity given & Bank has no Security footage of Minister's assault.
Minister has presser tomorrow...soon find out if the Bank has security cam ID of doorstep assault.
Noting at this stage with no Cam footage it's still an alleged assault!
This all looks funny but is rather sinister by design...well planned & executed like a hit.
No spirited prank in amongst the crowd for a laugh...(Nope!) This was an isolated hit for online viewers!
Also note it was next level physical assault with pressing her Shoulder into the other hand on her face!
The vid was a well crafted hit with minimal witnesses for online power damage of the minister!
Almost follows those Global protest hit squads...this oozes online renegades with a vendetta!
Guessin' the Minister would very much instruct Police to track who's responsible! Looks rather Nasty!
Sorry but tbb can't laugh at this...this hit squad were never after a laugh...that's evident to all!
basesix wrote:faaark me, tbb, thanks for the heads up, what an insight, watching a rep from a particular generation of privilege (the k-man grew up an eastern suburbs Kings College adelaide boy) slowly think this through.. and loving hearing himself say things about things to people... Geebers..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FSkWZB__0I
Kamal's a nice guy, but OMFG i thought his original reason for voting no was weird, he didn't understand it and then switch from No to Yes i was thinking is this some weird publicity thing for the yes camp or has he got some best hits album coming out or something, but now he has swung back its clearly not anything suss.
I 100% agree with him on the race thing, but i still dont think he seems educated on it all no matter his choice, and he should have just kept quiet until he actually completely understood things and knows all the info, he just looks silly swinging back and forth and not knowing the info he should.
BTW the 40 Billion figure is correct though, he just has it a little mixed up it's a complete government spending figure on indigenous people, not just a special targeted indigenous programs spending figure.
Whats more important is comparing government spending per person, indigenous to non indigenous, which the indigenous spending is a little more than double per person than non indigenous.
;)
https://m.
https://m.
On this day, September 25…
23 years ago ;)
https://m.
&pp=ygUfY2F0aHkgZnJlZW1hbiA0MDBtIHN5ZG5leSBmaW5hbA%3D%3D Is it ethical that non-Indigenous people get to decide on the Voice? Is it OK for one group to have rights others don't? An ethicist explains
And there is actually nothing unusual about citizens and their elected representatives making decisions about what rights and entitlements others have. This is the very nature of democracies.
But this raises a more fundamental tension within our liberal-democratic political system. The tension lies between the "liberal" element, which seeks to secure the rights and liberties of all individuals, and the "democratic" element, which seeks to enact self-rule by the people.
This tension generates a problem known as the "tyranny of the majority". This is where a democratic majority is able to violate the rights of a smaller minority.
In both the same-sex marriage and Voice votes, there is a large majority with the power to decide the rights of a minority.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-09-25/is-it-ethical-that-non-indigenous...
@info says “ … BTW the 40 Billion figure is correct though, he just has it a little mixed up it's a complete government spending figure on indigenous people, not just a special targeted indigenous programs spending figure.
Whats more important is comparing government spending per person, indigenous to non indigenous, which the indigenous spending is a little more than double per person than non indigenous.“
I’ve seen previous similar comments from you and others here @info but I’m puzzled as to why you think that it’s relevant or an important point to make, care to explain why
“ he should have just kept quiet until he actually completely understood things and knows all the info “
;);)
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I focus is spot on...
Less than half of First Nation are permitted to engage in The Voice.
40-50% are too Young, others are in prison + AEC never bothered to communicate to many.
Just 4 /250 Language groups were evenly & sufficiently informed with Voice Voting material.
This after blowing $450m or $25 a head for overindulged elites to attend their wake...nice one Oz!
UN would have something to say about leaving the future of First People open to chance!
Hedge a bet on [YES] or [NO] & wilfully exclude First Nation from the bet in & of their own land!
In 2023 how is that even possible ... let's just pretend to care by acknowledging the Voice Injustice!
tbb will here & now Apologize for locking First Nation outta their birth rite...just give it to them...FFS!
Jelly Flater wrote:;)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SDYJkmIaLWg
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=k8xgFEvSZu8
Who doesn’t love binge watching their way through Malcolm Douglas’ back catalogue.
… peter dutton ;)
GuySmiley wrote:@info says “ … BTW the 40 Billion figure is correct though, he just has it a little mixed up it's a complete government spending figure on indigenous people, not just a special targeted indigenous programs spending figure.
Whats more important is comparing government spending per person, indigenous to non indigenous, which the indigenous spending is a little more than double per person than non indigenous.“
I’ve seen previous similar comments from you and others here @info but I’m puzzled as to why you think that it’s relevant or an important point to make, care to explain why
Its relevant to todays comments because of Kamal's comments and the comments from the TV panel, both views of which are misleading.
Is it a surprise that people talk about the money side of things?
No not at all, it doesnt matter what issue you are talking about money almost always gets talked about especially tax payers money because its money people earn that they have no choice but to give to the government.
Money always get wasted by the government but this is an area where money wasted is a long term on going thing, a black hole that will always be there.
The problem now is there is a whole industry built around this money its called the Aboriginal industry, and its made up of a lot of grifters chasing the $$$.
What we really need is a full audit of the industry and a clean out and organisations made more accountable, IMHO money will never fix the issues, most issues need people to bring personal change themselves but it still wouldn't hurt ensuring money got to where its suppose to get too
BTW. The very fact you use to work in this industry but are obviously so clueless around Indigenous issues, to me is confirmation of how fucked up things are, i can only imagine that there is a hell of a lot of other Guys in this field.
“ but i still dont think he seems educated on it all “
& “ he just has it a little mixed up “
;)
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&pp=ygUdZGV2byBtb25nb2xvaWQgb3JpZ2luYWwgdmlkZW8%3D AlfredWallace wrote:Waveman. I DO NOT apologise to you one iota.. Your childish and single focused attack on FNP really highlights your lack of empathy and or understanding of really anything. Am i surprised, no, your I.Q probably matches your shoe size, i hear you’ve got very small feet and everything else. AW
Attack on FNP? No.
Noel Pearson’s been known to talk about responsibility. Seems like it is off limits around here though.
A lot of empathetic yes voters seem determined to repeat the mistakes of the past. Not allowed to even talk about them. Look what happens when you do. It’s a pile on.
Corruption, cronyism, nepotism are serious problems that need to be confronted, not concealed. It’s not uncaring to want these problems brought out in the open.
Aboriginal disadvantage persists because a lot of well intentioned people can’t bring themselves to confront past failings.
indo-dreaming wrote:GuySmiley wrote:@info says “ … BTW the 40 Billion figure is correct though, he just has it a little mixed up it's a complete government spending figure on indigenous people, not just a special targeted indigenous programs spending figure.
Whats more important is comparing government spending per person, indigenous to non indigenous, which the indigenous spending is a little more than double per person than non indigenous.“
I’ve seen previous similar comments from you and others here @info but I’m puzzled as to why you think that it’s relevant or an important point to make, care to explain why
Its relevant to todays comments because of Kamal's comments and the comments from the TV panel, both views of which are misleading.
Is it a surprise that people talk about the money side of things?
No not at all, it doesnt matter what issue you are talking about money almost always gets talked about especially tax payers money because its money people earn that they have no choice but to give to the government.
Money always get wasted by the government but this is an area where money wasted is a long term on going thing, a black hole that will always be there.
The problem now is there is a whole industry built around this money its called the Aboriginal industry, and its made up of a lot of grifters chasing the $$$.
What we really need is a full audit of the industry and a clean out and organisations made more accountable, IMHO money will never fix the issues, most issues need people to bring personal change themselves but it still wouldn't hurt ensuring money got to where its suppose to get too
BTW. The very fact you use to work in this industry but are obviously so clueless around Indigenous issues, to me is confirmation of how fucked up things are, i can only imagine that there is a hell of a lot of other Guys in this field.
Yeah yeah all well and good but why the comment about the money spent on Aboriginal people is double that of everyone else and especially so as you say it’s important to note?
indo-dreaming wrote:Is it a surprise that people talk about the money side of things?
No not at all, it doesnt matter what issue you are talking about money almost always gets talked about especially tax payers money because its money people earn that they have no choice but to give to the government.
Money always get wasted by the government but this is an area where money wasted is a long term on going thing, a black hole that will always be there.
The problem now is there is a whole industry built around this money its called the Aboriginal industry, and its made up of a lot of grifters chasing the $$$.
What we really need is a full audit of the industry and a clean out and organisations made more accountable, IMHO money will never fix the issues, most issues need people to bring personal change themselves but it still wouldn't hurt ensuring money got to where its suppose to get too
BTW. The very fact you use to work in this industry but are obviously so clueless around Indigenous issues, to me is confirmation of how fucked up things are, i can only imagine that there is a hell of a lot of other Guys in this field.
maybe we could have a long-term, FNP-run advisory body, that could help stop funding inefficiencies, and the rorting that they hate (nothing gives bad press to FNP in this country like monies wasted), and that targets issues that have failed to be addressed adequately.. not a funding body, just an advisory one. We'd have to trust this body, while monitoring their progress, and let them work out how it would function, sanctioned by the parliament of the day of course.. just an idea..
I can’t read this thread anymore thanks to Indo, for someone to be so concerned and so so worried about something that will never affect them really fucking irritates me for some reason.
Got to the point where every time I see the name on this thread I feel like screaming at my phone…
Every day the same negative shit coming out of his mouth.
It’s so tempting to really let you know what I think of you but it wouldn’t achieve anything obviously.
Easier to go hit a punching bag for 10 hours straight or scream at the sky or something.
life must be so fucking dull for you to spend every waking minute on this thread.
Yes I realise I have not contributed anything of substance on here but I still like reading it to get an idea of what people are thinking, you just smother the fuckin place though.
I need some swellnet free time for a while.
How can someone you don’t even know be so damn irritating! Ughhhhh
Time to log off for a bit
GuySmiley wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:GuySmiley wrote:@info says “ … BTW the 40 Billion figure is correct though, he just has it a little mixed up it's a complete government spending figure on indigenous people, not just a special targeted indigenous programs spending figure.
Whats more important is comparing government spending per person, indigenous to non indigenous, which the indigenous spending is a little more than double per person than non indigenous.“
I’ve seen previous similar comments from you and others here @info but I’m puzzled as to why you think that it’s relevant or an important point to make, care to explain why
Its relevant to todays comments because of Kamal's comments and the comments from the TV panel, both views of which are misleading.
Is it a surprise that people talk about the money side of things?
No not at all, it doesnt matter what issue you are talking about money almost always gets talked about especially tax payers money because its money people earn that they have no choice but to give to the government.
Money always get wasted by the government but this is an area where money wasted is a long term on going thing, a black hole that will always be there.
The problem now is there is a whole industry built around this money its called the Aboriginal industry, and its made up of a lot of grifters chasing the $$$.
What we really need is a full audit of the industry and a clean out and organisations made more accountable, IMHO money will never fix the issues, most issues need people to bring personal change themselves but it still wouldn't hurt ensuring money got to where its suppose to get too
BTW. The very fact you use to work in this industry but are obviously so clueless around Indigenous issues, to me is confirmation of how fucked up things are, i can only imagine that there is a hell of a lot of other Guys in this field.
Yeah yeah all well and good but why the comment about the money spent on Aboriginal people is double that of everyone else and especially so as you say it’s important to note?
Because it helps us create a better perspective on things and how much money is spent.
A complete figure of spending be it 400 million, 4 billion, 40 billion, 400 billion while hugely different amount's, to most us its hard to relate to what that figure really means its just big money
Its much easier for us to understand comparisons like comparing Indigenous spending to non indigenous spending, especially when given in figures we can relate too better.
For instance the figures per person from 2017 are roughly $20K non indigenous to $44K for indigenous.
We can understand these comparisons and figures much easier.
basesix wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:Is it a surprise that people talk about the money side of things?
No not at all, it doesnt matter what issue you are talking about money almost always gets talked about especially tax payers money because its money people earn that they have no choice but to give to the government.
Money always get wasted by the government but this is an area where money wasted is a long term on going thing, a black hole that will always be there.
The problem now is there is a whole industry built around this money its called the Aboriginal industry, and its made up of a lot of grifters chasing the $$$.
What we really need is a full audit of the industry and a clean out and organisations made more accountable, IMHO money will never fix the issues, most issues need people to bring personal change themselves but it still wouldn't hurt ensuring money got to where its suppose to get too
BTW. The very fact you use to work in this industry but are obviously so clueless around Indigenous issues, to me is confirmation of how fucked up things are, i can only imagine that there is a hell of a lot of other Guys in this field.
maybe we could have a long-term, FNP-run advisory body, that could help stop funding inefficiencies, and the rorting that they hate (nothing gives bad press to FNP in this country like monies wasted), and that targets issues that have failed to be addressed adequately.. not a funding body, just an advisory one. We'd have to trust this body, while monitoring their progress, and let them work out how it would function, sanctioned by the parliament of the day of course.. just an idea..
Firstly the people involved in this are also some of the people that have also overseen huge money wasted and failed programs, Noel Pearson and Cape York for instance (there is articles going back years on his failure and spending in this area)
Secondly its far far far more likely they voice would demand they need more money not less.
Thirdly With a voice you are adding in much more added cost, we havent been told if those with seats get paid or the budget if there is one for the voice, but you can be certain it will get big money and spend big money, especially if it takes any decsions to high court etc
Fourthly: There very own documents say they would love repratration payment's even in the form of percentage of GDP
The activist around the voice are the gravy train, they are the grifters, they want more $$$ not less.
man, you got 'em PEGGED. I didn't realise that is gonna be how it plays out. phew, sounds like we're gonna dodge a bullet man!
(thank you for your service re tax dollars)
waveman wrote:overthefalls wrote:“Translation of your post, i dont want people to see this(even paywalled) because its not good for the yes vote.”
No, most people will see it for what it is: a pathetic gotcha attempt.
Here’s Josephine Cashman summing it up - “Aboriginal affairs: state-sanctioned corruption”
https://onevoiceaustralia.com.au/blog/f/state-sanctioned-failure-corrupt...
well done waveman, at long last the truth.
goofyfoot wrote:I can’t read this thread anymore thanks to Indo, for someone to be so concerned and so so worried about something that will never affect them really fucking irritates me for some reason.
Got to the point where every time I see the name on this thread I feel like screaming at my phone…
Every day the same negative shit coming out of his mouth.
It’s so tempting to really let you know what I think of you but it wouldn’t achieve anything obviously.
Easier to go hit a punching bag for 10 hours straight or scream at the sky or something.
life must be so fucking dull for you to spend every waking minute on this thread.Yes I realise I have not contributed anything of substance on here but I still like reading it to get an idea of what people are thinking, you just smother the fuckin place though.
I need some swellnet free time for a while.
How can someone you don’t even know be so damn irritating! Ughhhhh
Funny how people have soo much trouble hearing views that don't align with theirs.
Most post on social/political issues on swellnet i dont agree with, big deal.
Anyway the reality is these things do affect us all, yeah sure its debatable to what extent, but thats why we get a say and a vote, because we get to decide the direction of our country.
If you want to hear from me less, maybe encourage any No voter mates to contribute here, so i can post less.
Ive actually enjoyed having some support in Burleigh & Sameaswas, its given me a little break at times.
...aaaaand, there goes goofy.
how them esky-beers indo?
this waterman's front bar gettin' empty.
I imagine it ending with you in an empty room,
then noticing burls nursing a chinotto in a short glass at the end of the bar.
He looks across to you and says in a drawl 'ever played david and goliath?'
Typically tbb struggled to be almost half right as usual...
NT assault was personal & vengeful & also no laughing matter.
Once the bank security or branch opened...reckon they could access the footage.
56 yr/old woman has since been charged with aggravated Assault
Also the initial accusation was indeed online > on Attacker's [facebook]
Posted that Minister had stopped her husband from having a Heart Operation.
This be why the just deserts were personal & assertive by nature so to speak.
Knowing the local set up & timetable of event & exact exit point
Quick isolated hit + Vid editing cleared the attacker to a point...
Once the Bank footage was obtained the Attacker was exposed...or...
We do see a witness (Perhaps a female youth) over to the right > gotta a good look!
NT Police Commissioner now backs Fed Police security concerns of NT Chief Minister.
NT Chief was also recently harassed during a running comp by Protesters!
Certainly no laughing matter when ya can't attend community events without being attacked.
Pretty sure all here wish the NT Minister well & a safe environment to simply live a life!
Noting the Vid was [Pre] labelled & tossed into tiktok's [ Voice - Bargain Vidz Loony Bin ]
[ One of those ] OMG! OMG! Make it so...Oh gee...Wot a Bummer! Nothin' to see here!
tbb apologizes for disrupting the Hate Campaign...goes with the Territory!
NT has Nothing to do with Voice...all know that!
https://www.google.com/search?q=calculator&oq=calculator&aqs=chrome..69i...
"The activist around the voice are the gravy train, they are the grifters, they want more $$$ not less."
They are activists Indo.
When it's more than one activist, they are called "activists".
When you punch down on FNP you should at least learn how to express yourself in English, otherwise you just come across as a fucking idiot, which you are.
how the hell do we not talk about money?
when people in oz still live like this...
despite all the money
this is the national shame!
White Gate is is one of about 20 town camps around Alice Springs, home to 1500 people, all of them Indigenous. The living conditions are squalid and shameful. Filmmaker Rachel Perkins wants people to see it: https://t.co/KAxqB6xM2d pic.twitter.com/43IMAW1Hcz
— The Australian (@australian) September 21, 2023
not aboriginal shame
all our shame
and embarrassment, especially for people who've worked in the 'industry' and not spoken up... who've ignored the waste...
because its uncomfortable
(which includes me)
you are uncomfortable waste, syp?
Tots, let's do something, start with Yes, and keeeep going!
indo-dreaming wrote:Secondly its far far far more likely they voice would demand they need more money not less.
They don't get to "demand" anything, you eternal pillock.
sypkan wrote:how the hell do we not talk about money?
when people in oz still live like this...
despite all the money
this is the national shame!
Yep. There has to be some serious money going missing. This needs to be investigated ASAP. This will do more for FNP that a nation dividing racist vote
goofyfoot wrote:I can’t read this thread anymore thanks to Indo, for someone to be so concerned and so so worried about something that will never affect them really fucking irritates me for some reason.
Got to the point where every time I see the name on this thread I feel like screaming at my phone…
Every day the same negative shit coming out of his mouth.
It’s so tempting to really let you know what I think of you but it wouldn’t achieve anything obviously.
Easier to go hit a punching bag for 10 hours straight or scream at the sky or something.
life must be so fucking dull for you to spend every waking minute on this thread.Yes I realise I have not contributed anything of substance on here but I still like reading it to get an idea of what people are thinking, you just smother the fuckin place though.
I need some swellnet free time for a while.
How can someone you don’t even know be so damn irritating! Ughhhhh
Time to log off for a bit
Go surf Goofy. This thread provides me entertainment only. If i ever felt like this i would have a break too.
indo-dreaming wrote:Ive actually enjoyed having some support in Burleigh & Sameaswas, its given me a little break at times.
I know you have often voiced your views on playing the man, not the ball, but because it's only a voice, not a forum rule, I don't have to listen. Politics aside, and I mean that, you, burleigh, and Sameaswas are EASILY the three dumbest cunts involved in this particular conversation.
Hiccups wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:Ive actually enjoyed having some support in Burleigh & Sameaswas, its given me a little break at times.
I know you have often voiced your views on playing the man, not the ball, but because it's only a voice, not a forum rule, I don't have to listen. Politics aside, and I mean that, you, burleigh, and Sameaswas are EASILY the three dumbest cunts involved in this particular conversation.
Living in Victoria makes you really bitter.
If anyone believes indigenous get $44,000 spent on them per person that would make a family of 5 having $220,000 per year . They must have a pretty good lifestyle with that sort of money spent on them . Reports of 20 people living in a 3 bedroom house must be bullshit then .
Supafreak wrote:If anyone believes indigenous get $44,000 spent on them per person that would make a family of 5 having $220,000 per year . They must have a pretty good lifestyle with that sort of money spent on them . Reports of 20 people living in a 3 bedroom house must be bullshit then .
So ask the real questions. Where is the money going?
Sorry! That don't add up does it...
Try this one...
https://www.news.com.au/national/northern-territory/nt-chief-minister-al...
Excuse : In between tbb's Car battery Concked Out & missed GP appointment.
Now gotta trek rest of the day on a buggered ankle to get / lug battery to start the car!
Why! Coz car is soon outta REGO & Qld transport refuse phone banking...gotta go to branch or PO.
Why the Sore Ankle....Sorry! [NO] Ankle Result after Ultrasound + X ray + CT.
Mum: " That's all useless shit son...you'll need one of them proper fancy expensive MRI "
Oh! And don't forget to ask for them to forget the Evil Chernobyl Dregz Fluro Dye...'Right Mum'!
GP [Telehealth] : "Yer gonna hav' ta fork out extra for MRI tbb!"...
Huh! (Think my Expert Mum already said that!) Goin' round to mum's for Some Chicken Soup +
Then go to bank to draw down Home Loan for Rego for the car that don't go + Money for MRI Poison.
tbb knows ya all know all about this shit as it happens to all everyday...(Altogether) "Suck it up tbb!"
Robot : "Life! Don't talk to tbb 'bout life!"
Supafreak wrote:If anyone believes indigenous get $44,000 spent on them per person that would make a family of 5 having $220,000 per year . They must have a pretty good lifestyle with that sort of money spent on them . Reports of 20 people living in a 3 bedroom house must be bullshit then .
Its an official government figure, but its an average spending figure per person, it includes all kinds of thing's from health to education, to infrastructure to things like wealth fare payments to Aboriginal targeted programs.
In reality the figure for indigenous people per person is far lower in city or built up areas where there is far less need for indigenous targeted programs and about 80% of aboriginal people live a standard of life no different to others, but it would also be far higher in remote areas that need more program's and where unemployment is high and where general cost to do most things is much higher.
So for that 20 people living a 3 bed house in a remote community in reality the total would be a lot more than 880K worth of spending.
you ever get subs in for jobs indo? delegate tasks to paid others on indo trips? if so you are gravy training. I hate the idea of middle-men, but they seem to keep gsco's grecian econo-urns in pillary glyphs.
Indo " to things like wealth fare payments to Aboriginal targeted programs."
"Wealth fare payments"
Are you right in the head?
For a guy that projects himself as an "expert" on FNP issues, you are just a fucking dumb gronk.
Why don't you piss off and do something else for a while, stop making a fool of yourself from dawn till late at night here every day.
adam12 wrote:Indo " to things like wealth fare payments to Aboriginal targeted programs."
"Wealth fare payments"
Are you right in the head?
For a guy that projects himself as an "expert" on FNP issues, you are just a fucking dumb gronk.
Why don't you piss off and do something else for a while, stop making a fool of yourself from dawn till late at night here every day.
Oh look another abusive yes voter. You're all the same and unfortunately doing more damage than good.
Yeah I really hate those bastards rorting the system and living in luxury in their mansions with their swimming pools in Kalkaringi, Yarabah, Hope Vale etc.
there’s no reason whatsoever that they can’t all stand on their own 2 feet.
Uni assignment i did a few years ago. This is my take on things. I'm sure this will ruffle many feathers. I hope so.
Love Blue Diamond x
The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices
Introduction – Compensatory Justice
Disparities between the standards of living of humans on this planet have long been a part of our history on this planet. From the wealthy nations of the West to the developing and undeveloped nations on this globe, the diversity in the quality of life when viewed from a moral standpoint are without a doubt grossly unfair.
In this paper I will look at why historic injustices do require some form of reparation. I take a strong stance that we are more obliged to solve current injustices than to provide reparation for every act of injustice in the past. In doing this I will first investigate the historic injustice of the Aboriginal people of Australia and I will look at the argument that they are entitled to some form of reparation and why.
I will incoroporate some interesting views from Jeremy Waldron, Robert Nozick and others which will help me slowly build to my conclusion that reparation should be in the form of Non Indigenous Australians surrendering some of our priveleges as a form of reparation.
Historic Injustices to Indigenous Australians:
Australia the continent was well inhabited for many years long before white settlement. It is commonly known that in 1788 Australia was colonised as a country under the rule of the British Empire, with total contempt for the fact that it was already inhabited by a native indigenous race of people.
The way the original inhabitants have been treated, including forced assimilation, execution, stolen families and not even allowed to be recognised as citizens for a large part of white Australia’s history are also well known facts. (Poole, 1999,pp114-142)
There exists now a situation where there is a large divide between Aboriginal and non Aboriginal Australian’s that can be traced back to the moment Australia was invaded by English settlers and the brutal and unfair treatment that has followed.
So at this point now, in 2013 what is the just and fair way to make amends for past actions?
I would argue that a moderate to large amount of reparation is overdue for this nation of people, the Aboriginal people. But there are many challenges to this view point especially that of how much reparation, and what sort of compensation.
Past injustices or present suffering?
One of the questions raised in an issue like this is whether it is better to provide compensation or reparation for past deeds, which have already been done in a previous generation and cannot be changed, or whether it is better to now provide assistance to those who are suffering in their current situations and consider that as a form of moral duty.
To understand this we need to delve a little deeper into this issue and hear some differing viewpoints.
Firstly we need to understand what the best way to provide reparation. How do we judge what is the best way of giving back and how much? Jeremy Waldron states “The historic record has a fragility that consists, …in the sheer contingency of what happened in the past” (Waldron,1992,p5 )
This is saying that we can’t trace every single injustice back to the original act therefore reparation for every act would be almost impossible because it would ultimately be guess work.
In this statement he has an objection from Robert Nozick who believes it is in fact possible to address this problem by “changing the present so that it resembles how the past would have looked had the injustice not taken place” (McKenzie, 2013)
This would be a way to ultimately provide maximum reparation, but is it the correct approach? I believe this is a fairly radical approach, although it does have some merits in the fact it would be working in a positive way for indigenous people, I don’t think it is entirely the right way to deal with these issues but it is on the right track.
Waldron argues that it is based on too many unknowns. “The status of counterfactual reasoning about the exercising of human reasoning of human freedom is unclear”(Waldron 1993,p10)
Which leaves the question somewhat open about the sort of reparation that is required, but provides one clear answer to the key question. Both agree that yes, reparation to some extent is required. But how much and in what form?
Another philosopher who leans more towards Waldron’s views is Kymlicka. He is somewhat more straightforward in his assessment that property rights in particular for Aboriginals would create “massive unfairness” and also he maintains the argument “Aboriginal rights must be grounded in concerns about equality and contemporary disadvantage. (McKenzie, 2013) I agree with both these views but I don’t think they provide any active solutions.
The Solution?
So if its not handing back all of Australia’s land to the original inhabitants that is the most appropriate way to deal with past injustices, then what is?
I look at the current country I grew up in, as a white Australian. I ask myself why I never had Aboriginal friends growing up, no understanding of Aboriginal culture and why my basic understanding of Indigenous Australians is mostly 200 years old. I look at our flag, a symbol of a nation that stole a country from its original inhabitants, with no recognition of the Indigenous people at all on it. I see that Australia considered Indigenous people as less than people until only 40 years ago and I see the way that Indigenous Australians live a completely separate life to the way of life I know as an Australian. I see that the only indigenous politician I am aware of is a former Olympian and it is because of this fact of her sporting status that I know this. I see no collective power or representation of Indigenous Australians and I see non Indigenous Australians,( a culture built on a history of stealing a land and mistreating its people) still taking, taking as much out of this land as they can, with little to no regard of sharing or giving to the original inhabitants. I see a government that says lots of words about ‘closing the gap’ and bringing the living standards of non- indigenous and indigenous Australians closer together, but apart from nice words, there is no conviction, no follow through, just assimilation , and all that still remains are injustices.
As stated by Sparrow, “Continuity gives rise to responsibility on part of present generations of Australians for our history”.(McKenzie,2013). Although deeds happened in the past beyond our control, what we do now to either ignore, or rectify these issues will reflect on us in history. So if we choose to do nothing, we are contributing to the history of the mistreatment of non- indigenous Australians. And this is simply unacceptable in my opinion.
Conclusion
So what is fair? I believe that the way forward is a surrendering of some of our privileges as non- indigenous Australians. The simple fact is it was morally wrong without a doubt what has happened in the past. And it is also morally wrong without a doubt to ignore these facts and not offer some form of reparation in the present. But how much?
I think that going back to Robert Nozick’s argument is a start. I think Nozick is wrong to make the present resemble the past in every aspect. But I do think that it would be reasonable to restore some aspects of the way things should be. The things that happened in the past were out of our control and we can’t go back to changing the way things were. But we could change the way things are.
For some examples. Why not give at least 50% of political power to indigenous people? It surely would be a fair thing to do considering this is their country. Media control. 50 percent. Industry. Realestate. The list goes on. Why do we not acknowledge the indigenous people on our flag, or better still use their flag? Why is Australia still a part of the Commonwealth when it serves little purpose to any of us and serves as a constant reminder to Indigenous Australians that they are still controlled by the original invaders. These to me are fairly simple reparations that would have minimal impact on Australia as a whole. Perhaps, it would alter the way we live but I think it is our responsibility, morally to forfeit some of our privileges for the greater good. Basically a little bit goes a long way.
In closing, it is a fact that a huge injustice occurred to the Indigenous population and suffering continues to this day. There is no easy solution to such a burden of pain. I believe the only solutions are for the non- Indigenous population to take responsibility and sacrifice our own way of life to bring about an overall equality. Sacrifice is not an easy word. But it all comes down to right and wrong. We are in a position to give, in this current generation. What are we so scared to lose, that was never ours in the first place??
Bibliography
McKenzie,C.”Prof” (2013), Lecture, Historic Injustices and Indigenous Rights, Macquarie University
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28
References
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28