The United States(!) of A

Sweet @ Southern
Cheers and yes I reckon you’ve always got me wrong. I’m not into explaining myself either.
I was down your way or close by 2 weeks ago I think and it’s the sort of place to reflect but also recharge oneself. Count your blessings, I didn’t want to go home.

sypkan wrote:

(you know what they say about religion and politics... don't talk about it! ...yet here on the net, it takes full dominance... strange times...)

doesn't have to be strange times, on this here surf site. Sure this stuff is topical, it is everyone's front and centre atm, it's what people hear and see when they turn on anything that glows blue.. and, sure, this thread calls for it. But there's so much opportunity for people to not become known as the weirdos who ONLY comment on stoopid global machinations that we have no influence on.. how's the kids getting yelled at for fishing in the suburbs y'all?

Cheers @seeds. Nah starting to understand ya. Probably the residual from past clashes clouds my judgement. Thanks heaps and yeah, it's rad down here but also can be tough. The real journey is always within. Trying to match fire with fire down here is futile. Getting there. Glad you got to experience the power of the place. Catchya on your next swing down this way mate.

southernraw wrote:

You know why i'll never be an expert on Iran, Israel, Gaza, Ukraine.....etc.
Because i've never been there.
How could you ever begin to understand a place and it's people and culture if you've never stepped foot inside that country nor ever spent time with the people living there.
Something to think about for self proclaimed podcast experts that post on here.

Im not an expert on Israel or Gaza but my knowledge of the history and politics and current events is almost always from people & sources who live there and study the history and politics and i follow current events and those who are experts and living it daily from many different sources, i agree its probably not healthy but i quite literally consume hours a day of information on the issue if not current events past events

Yet my knowledge on the history is still about 20% my knowledge on the politics is about 5% both are extremely complex. (thats an understatement)

Everyone else here is at about 1% or less, with a knowledge and understanding often from sources that are truely antisemite and yes almost always from people who have never steeped foot in Israel or Gaza or from extremely anti Jewish, Anti Israel pro Arab, pro muslim sources.

Thats why i avoided Andys previous question's, each question & answer is a huge discussion in itself that to even talk about you need a decent grasp of the history and politics, both ancient history, history of the last 100 years and history and politics of the last 30 years, if talking about Gaza you need a very good knowledge of the 2005 to now period and the politics of that period.

BTW. It is true that Bibi tried to keep the PLO and Hamas separated rather than PLO become more powerful politically, but again this issue is so complex, you have to know and understand the huge mistakes of the past that lead to the situation like 2005 handing over of Gaza and past Israeli politics of that time and now, way too complex to discuss here especially in a thread that is not about the area, go onto somewhere like Quora and see the debate from both sides from people often more knowledgeable than us if you have an interest in it

… its probably not healthy

… this issue is so complex

& Something to think about

Supreme dear (tender) leader…

On her way to work one morning
Down the path ‘longside the lake
A tender-hearted woman saw a poor half-frozen snake
His pretty colored skin had been all frosted with the dew
“Oh well,” she cried, “I’ll take you in and I’ll take care of you”
“Take me in, tender woman
Take me in, for heaven’s sake
Take me in, tender woman,” sighed the snake

She wrapped him up all cozy in a comforter of silk
And laid him by thе fireside with some honеy and some milk
She hurried home from work that night, and soon as she arrived
She found that pretty snake she’d taken in had been revived
“Take me in, tender woman
Take me in, for heaven’s sake
Take me in, tender woman,” sighed the snake

She clutched him to her bosom, “You’re so beautiful,” she cried
“But if I hadn’t brought you in, by now you might have died”
She stroked his pretty skin again and kissed and held him tight
Instead of saying thanks, that snake gave her a vicious bite
“Take me in, tender woman
Take me in, for heaven’s sake
Take me in, tender woman,” sighed the snake

“I saved you,” cried the woman
“And you’ve bitten me, but why?
And you know your bite is poisonous and now I’m gonna die”
“Oh shut up, silly woman,” said the reptile with a grin
“You knew damn well I was a snake before you took me in”
“Take me in, tender woman
Take me in, for heaven’s sake
Take me in, tender woman,” sighed the snake
“Take me in, tender woman,” sighed the snake
“Take me in, tender woman,” sighed the snake

Waiting for the updated ‘10/10 Art of the Deal strategic genuis’ explanations for the latest tariff exemptions. It’ll take a day or two but once they’re cleared the usual suspects will roll them out here I’m sure.

indo-dreaming][quote=southernraw wrote:

Yet my knowledge on the history is still about 20% my knowledge on the politics is about 5% both are extremely complex. (thats an understatement)

Everyone else here is at about 1% or less, with a knowledge and understanding often from sources that are truely antisemite and yes almost always from people who have never steeped foot in Israel or Gaza or from extremely anti Jewish, Anti Israel pro Arab, pro muslim sources.

@occupy-dreaming, I gotta say, for someone with the most odious opinions, one sided views, and factually incorrect bumsplatters, this shows a level of hubris that is so lacking in self-awareness, that I'm actually gobsmacked. Gobsmacked, but fucken entertained. For you to think, let alone state to real human people, that your knowledge towers over everyone else's, and that most every other news source other than the ones you lick off the boots of oppressors is antisemitic and false, despite the fact you've proven repeatedly that you obtusely refuse to acknowledge the difference between antisemitism and anti-zionism, or even antisemittism and anti-massacring/displacing ten of thousands of innocent people, well, I think that makes you a bit of a pill. A very, very, astonishly deluded pill.

If you ever get diagnosed with the ASD that you think you might have, you might also ask if the shrink can see where you fit on narcissism spectrum while you're there.

p.s: You haven't responded to my response about Mahmoud Khalil, unconstitutional behaviour, and FASCISM. sad.

I’ve said it before but he’s the most condescending cunt going around.

Pig headed germ of a human.

You’d be forgiven for thinking it’s a piss take if it hadn’t been going on for so long.

Cleanser post

Moonah wrote:

Cleanser post

'Preciate it.

etarip wrote:

Waiting for the updated ‘10/10 Art of the Deal strategic genuis’ explanations for the latest tariff exemptions. It’ll take a day or two but once they’re cleared the usual suspects will roll them out here I’m sure.

A week or so ago, it was hard to see where he was going with thing's, was he going to try to pull off something huge like a full reset based on Mar-a-Lago Accord idea for example?

Or stick to the tariffs set across the board at rates applied?

But dont you think his approach is starting to look more likely now?

To me it's starting to look like his typical "door in the face" approach.

Go for a big crazy demand first, then work down from there getting what you really wanted, that you wouldn't have got if you had started low or with a more reasonable offer and the other side often feeling like they got a good deal.

Seems like he is now negotiating with China on seperate things or giving exemptions (phones & PC's), maybe he might negotiate in all kinds of different areas or right across the board.? (or maybe not)

Regarding all the other countries on a 90 day pause, maybe he wanted to see what countries came ready to negotiate and will treat those first or differently than those that didn't, that's assuming that after the 90 day pause he starts negotiating with all countries, which i think is fair to assume otherwise why the pause.

The question is, was this his original plan or did he change course when things weren't looking as he had hoped?

Sure i think that is possible, but who knows, Trump isn't exactly predictable and all this has only helped reinforce that unpredictable thing he has going, which probably only helps when negotiating on other things like say Iran nuclear deal for instance.

So, you don’t know, he doesn’t know, no one knows.

He went for the big flex and it didn’t work. He blinked. But in the meantime he fucked the economy; but more significantly the perception of the USA as a safe and stable place to do business. The dollar’s position. The futures bonds. The list goes on. You really think businesses with long lead times are going to onshore manufacturing when Trump could just drop the tariffs next week? Or not even implement them at all?

That’s my point. There’s no method in the madness. There’s no strategy. It’s throwing shit at the wall and seeing what sticks.

Helluva a way to govern.

I think Trump liked tariffs because it seemed like legal cheating to him. He’s found out it’s a bit more complex.

Maybe Trump was simply trying to make a few bucks to pay off his fraud debt . Only 1/2 billion $ , small change for the greatest deal maker of all time . https://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-new-york-fraud-debt-500-million/

'if you look at a spider having a fit for long enough, I'm sure you can convince yourself that you understand what it's trying to do.'
(helps, too, if you have a surfeit of free online support 24/7 no-matter what your theory..)

indo-dreaming wrote:

Seems like he is now negotiating with China on seperate things or giving exemptions (phones & PC's), maybe he might negotiate in all kinds of different areas or right across the board.? (or maybe not)

That just showed the level of thinking (hint none) about consequences concerning certain products stupidity at its highest.

indo-dreaming wrote:

Regarding all the other countries on a 90 day pause, maybe he wanted to see what countries came ready to negotiate and will treat those first or differently than those that didn't, that's assuming that after the 90 day pause he starts negotiating with all countries, which i think is fair to assume otherwise why the pause.

Nope the bond market forced the pause, Trump would have had people screaming the world will end if the 10 year note keeps rocketing up.

BTW it retraced then resumed its upward move the pause may not be enough.

I don’t think he’s negotiating with China at all. China has gone fully game on mole and someone in Trump’s shit show has had some ability to make him see a little sense.

Trump's execution of his global fiscal management plan,
summed up in 3 and a half minutes. Hang on kids!
.

Making america great and then (great again)
- the playbook of playing both sides to suit the changing tides.

Then.

And now.

What will become of Meta ? Zuck possibly guilty of perjury to congress. https://www.npr.org/2025/04/13/nx-s1-5358434/ftc-meta-antitrust-trial https://instagram.com/p/DIZXKORgnv2/

etarip wrote:

So, you don’t know, he doesn’t know, no one knows.

He went for the big flex and it didn’t work. He blinked. But in the meantime he fucked the economy; but more significantly the perception of the USA as a safe and stable place to do business. The dollar’s position. The futures bonds. The list goes on. You really think businesses with long lead times are going to onshore manufacturing when Trump could just drop the tariffs next week? Or not even implement them at all?

That’s my point. There’s no method in the madness. There’s no strategy. It’s throwing shit at the wall and seeing what sticks.

Helluva a way to govern.

Here's and idea lets let things unfold first and judge things on the end result be it 6 months time or a year or whatever and not two weeks into a process that is only starting to show signs of possibly going in a certain direction.

If he is going to negotiate with all countries it will take time, but you would expect USA will only come out of things with far better deals, and you would expect negotiations wont be just about tarrifs but he will use the leverage of tariffs to get whats better for the USA in other areas, like military cooperation or geopolitical issues.

Who knows some countries might even see tarrif free arrangements going both ways, some might still end up with higher tarrifs.

In regard to bringing manufacturing back you would expect there will be certain industries that they aim to do this, ones you would expect USA cant do without if a war breaks out or ones USA can do competitively.

For instance i doubt USA has any interest in making all the cheap crap China does but something like medicine or hospital equipment etc they might

But yeah i get it that Trumps approach and strategy isn't to everyones liking.

BTW. Yes i am just assuming Trump is going to negotiate on things because he is giving exemptions to China in certain areas, but maybe im (and others that ive listened too) are wrong and he wont, again we will just have to wait and see.

So you don’t know, he doesn’t know, no one knows.

What we do know is America's proven history of allowing corporations and big business to make money at the expense of genocide and war. Technology and military advances go hand in hand and strategic alliances often do not have any regard for international law when profit trumps all…

Lessons of the past or history repeating.

https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/0609607995?ref_=mr_referred_us_au_au

https://www.abc.net.au/listen/programs/pm/investigations-show-ibm-had-te...

“ IBM has proven that some corporations can get away with murder and still function with impunity.

To peer into our perilous future, we need only look back and see what IBM helped Hitler do during the Holocaust, in the era before computers existed. Now is the time to ask what could a Hitler-type regime do today and how quickly with today’s high-speed hand-held technology? But first pause to ask why IBM would ever engage in this genocide? The still bloodcurdling answer: It was never about the Nazism; it was never about the antisemitism—it was always about the money. Business was its middle name.”

https://www.jns.org/spotlight/ibm-and-the-holocaust-twenty-years-of-corp...

tearymasseuse wrote:

So you don’t know, he doesn’t know, no one knows.

What we do know is America's proven history of allowing corporations and big business to make money at the expense of genocide and war. Technology and military advances go hand in hand and strategic alliances often do not have any regard for international law when profit trumps all…

Lessons of the past or history repeating.

https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/0609607995?ref_=mr_referred_us_au_au

https://www.abc.net.au/listen/programs/pm/investigations-show-ibm-had-te...

“ IBM has proven that some corporations can get away with murder and still function with impunity.

To peer into our perilous future, we need only look back and see what IBM helped Hitler do during the Holocaust, in the era before computers existed. Now is the time to ask what could a Hitler-type regime do today and how quickly with today’s high-speed hand-held technology? But first pause to ask why IBM would ever engage in this genocide? The still bloodcurdling answer: It was never about the Nazism; it was never about the antisemitism—it was always about the money. Business was its middle name.”

https://www.jns.org/spotlight/ibm-and-the-holocaust-twenty-years-of-corp...

Tearymasseuse. Hi pal, hope ya cruisin. Good post ^

It’s always about the money with the US, it’s like it’s indoctrinated into their psyche.

Let’s not forget either, that many other companies continued trading with Hitler whilst the war was in progress.
Rockefeller and Standard Oil, General Motors etc, with most of the supply coming up and through Spain before reaching final destinations.

I’ve experienced this obsession with work and money on a few occasions whilst visiting the US.
On one particular occasion my wife , son and I were visiting friends of ours from Melbourne who were both teaching at the University of Arizona in Phoenix.
We were all in our 40’s at the time and what I experienced at a bbq one evening surprised and shocked me.
The weather in that city is pretty fine nearly every day of the year, especially the evenings.
Our friends had made a friendship with a lovely couple Mike and I’ve forgotten her name, real welcoming people not over the top, fake or anything like that
Mike and his wife hosted Pot Luck every Wednesday evening at their place, anyone could drop in at dinner time, rule was you must bring a dish to share and your own drinks.
It was a way for the whole suburb of Tempe to mix and engage with people they didn’t know. It was totally inclusive, including a heap of Mexican nationals who lived nearby, Mike and his wife made everyone welcome. I loved it.
Well, until a heap of people I gradually met started to reveal the true them.
Almost entirely every person I spoke to all asked me the same thing, what’s your job, how much do you earn annually, are you married (which I was ).
Every conversation ended up talking about money.
Another surprising observation was the age of many of these attendees, mid twenties and already a CEO of a company or the boss of medium to large businesses.
Mike and I spoke to each other about a lot of stuff, he was a hands on geologist and when he walked into his house after being two hours away working in 45c heat, covered in dust , helmet on , he said ,‘I recognise a few regulars now, many of them come with two beers and drink ten, I do not miss a thing’
Albeit, he remarked to me he loved the Mexican neighbours more than the rest.

If you ever get the chance to visit Arizona , do it, the landscape is amazing, Saguaro cactus ( Carnegia gigantea) towering in the desert etc. Spectacular. AW

Teary, I’m currently reading a book called “ the Devils Chess Board”. It’s about the corporate dealings of Wall Street and the Nazi’s. Centred around the Dulles brothers and the transition of the OSS into the CIA. Lots of collaboration with the Nazi executive and Wall Street. Very similar objectives. Also covers the origins of the Wests strong anti-communist rhetoric and the main players of the early stages of the Cold War.

Not sure if this thread is interested in mainstream sources but Fareed Zakaria makes some useful and concerning points here.

Since a globalised world is a peaceful one (because of trade-based mutually assured destruction should it all fall apart, as opposed to the arms-based mutually assured destruction of the cold war), trump has increased the likelihood of China invading Taiwan.

Another insightful pair of long-ish interviews, though a couple of months old now, are from Ezra Klein. The first is Fareed Zakaria again, where he outlines the foreign affairs impacts of trumps changes. This kind of sets the scene for a really interesting discussion with Gillian Tett, who analyses the aims of the factions within the trump administration, including their economic and foreign policy goals. Maybe these are old news to you all or too left/mainstream but I found Tett's analysis really compelling and helpful to understand the mania from the white house.

Ezra Klein and Fareed Zakaria

Ezra Klein and Gillian Tett

Hi AW, hope you are well… I’ve been to Joshua tree and spent some time with a mate outside LA toward the desert probly twenty years ago now (been back and down the coast to San Diego again) since then… beautiful landscapes - my mate runs a permaculture farm (he’s a nida graduate but of course all actors are multi skilled). All his neighbourhood is Mexican and decked out with mad old Cadillacs and boosted up old cars, the backyard bbqs etc. are amazing.

I’ll have to consider Arizona next time, cheers. (Also look into light hindu squats for your knee - go nice and slow, start with gentle reps of 10 and slowly build up to a hundred at a time over a week or two… they’re the goods)

And @soggy, I’ll suss out that book… sounds interesting. I’ve always been intrigued by this Cold War Pepsi info. It’s wild ;)

“ In 1989, Pepsi, through a joint venture, acquired a Soviet naval fleet, including 17 submarines, a cruiser, a frigate, and a destroyer. This deal was part of a larger arrangement where the Soviet Union bartered warships for Pepsi syrup and other goods, a way to circumvent the non-convertible rouble and obtain much-needed hard currency. Pepsi never used the fleet for its intended purpose but instead sold it to a Swedish scrap company, becoming a short-lived "sixth largest navy" on paper. ”

“We will not have peace in this region until we have public diplomacy that is based on real diplomacy, not on CIA operations.”

(It has been fun though arming militias non stop and providing endless weapons to ‘enhance’ security, peace and stability. The only thing we keep forgetting is the security, peace and stability bit.)

tearymasseuse wrote:

Hi AW, hope you are well… I’ve been to Joshua tree and spent some time with a mate outside LA toward the desert probly twenty years ago now (been back and down the coast to San Diego again) since then… beautiful landscapes - my mate runs a permaculture farm (he’s a nida graduate but of course all actors are multi skilled). All his neighbourhood is Mexican and decked out with mad old Cadillacs and boosted up old cars, the backyard bbqs etc. are amazing.

I’ll have to consider Arizona next time, cheers. (Also look into light hindu squats for your knee - go nice and slow, start with gentle reps of 10 and slowly build up to a hundred at a time over a week or two… they’re the goods)

And @soggy, I’ll suss out that book… sounds interesting. I’ve always been intrigued by this Cold War Pepsi info. It’s wild ;)

“ In 1989, Pepsi, through a joint venture, acquired a Soviet naval fleet, including 17 submarines, a cruiser, a frigate, and a destroyer. This deal was part of a larger arrangement where the Soviet Union bartered warships for Pepsi syrup and other goods, a way to circumvent the non-convertible rouble and obtain much-needed hard currency. Pepsi never used the fleet for its intended purpose but instead sold it to a Swedish scrap company, becoming a short-lived "sixth largest navy" on paper. ”

Tearymasseuse. Hi mate.

Thanks for your interesting reply.
How good is Joshua Tree ( Yucca brevifolia) National Park , camped a few nights en route to surf in SoCal and a few nights upon our return to Phoenix.
Coyotes howling, desert rodents congregated near us around a fire. Great plant life, freezing overnight, 35c by 8.00am.

Thank you so much for the advice regarding exercises for my knee, very much appreciated.
I’m onto that right now. All the best and thanks. AW

This one’s for indo. And Jeff in a way..

Ha ha with the grand kids too.