The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices
southernraw wrote:overthefalls wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.I’ve got three adult kids who went to school with a lot of Aboriginal students. They told me they are voting yes, even before I told them my position on the issue. My eldest daughter and her boyfriend are currently managing a pub in a small town in the Riverina district (a long way from home!); she said most of the clientele are old farmers who vehemently oppose The Voice, some fearing that their land will get taken away from them one day!
Many of my colleagues are Aboriginal elders who are definitely voting yes. Most older crew (50+) who I surf with every morning are also voting yes.
Some of my older, city-dwelling relatives are voting no, which doesn’t surprise me because they are generally very conservative with very little, if any, experience or understanding of Aboriginal people.Thanks OTF. That's some extremely heartening reading in the current climate of fearmongering.
Much appreciated you sharing that.
LOL. it means nothing other than there has been plenty of paid advertising on social media platforms.
GuySmiley wrote:More ooops https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/nonsense-liberal-veteran-skew...
“When you actually strip away the straw men and the scarecrows, and just have a little bit of a think about what the proposal is, what the words are, how it’s going to work, you do wonder at some of the arguments and some of the divisions put by others……….but where are the DETAILS ? I WANT DETAILS ! …..but seriously now , the voice is very divisive, look what its done to JP & Wazza
indo-dreaming wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.It's no surprise at all we were all young and naive, i use to vote for the Greens, it comes down to a few things, lack of life experience and understanding of life and the fact the brain doesn't fully develop until the mid to late 20's.
Info, how many times must you remind us that you used to vote green cos you were "young and naive", or young and stupid. Dude, you're now middle aged, naive and stupid, so I don't see your point.
indo-dreaming wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.It's no surprise at all we were all young and naive, i use to vote for the Greens, it comes down to a few things, lack of life experience and understanding of life and the fact the brain doesn't fully develop until the mid to late 20's.
Speaking of kids
Making jokes about child abuse now indo #howlowcanindogo
@hiccups
Haha
But... but... changing political allegiances is representative of intelligence ;)
Some ppl do get dumber as they get older...
- and often more stubborn and bigoted;)
Hiccups wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.It's no surprise at all we were all young and naive, i use to vote for the Greens, it comes down to a few things, lack of life experience and understanding of life and the fact the brain doesn't fully develop until the mid to late 20's.
Info, how many times must you remind us that you used to vote green cos you were "young and naive", or young and stupid. Dude, you're now middle aged, naive and stupid, so I don't see your point.
My take on that is that he's easily led by others. Follows the herd, just to be accepted. Bleats it enough to get a pretty good read on it.
Indo, I reckon my kids have enough life experience and understanding of Aboriginal people to make informed decisions. Your labelling of them as naive (just because they don’t share your perspective) is most condescending.
burleigh wrote:southernraw wrote:overthefalls wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.I’ve got three adult kids who went to school with a lot of Aboriginal students. They told me they are voting yes, even before I told them my position on the issue. My eldest daughter and her boyfriend are currently managing a pub in a small town in the Riverina district (a long way from home!); she said most of the clientele are old farmers who vehemently oppose The Voice, some fearing that their land will get taken away from them one day!
Many of my colleagues are Aboriginal elders who are definitely voting yes. Most older crew (50+) who I surf with every morning are also voting yes.
Some of my older, city-dwelling relatives are voting no, which doesn’t surprise me because they are generally very conservative with very little, if any, experience or understanding of Aboriginal people.Thanks OTF. That's some extremely heartening reading in the current climate of fearmongering.
Much appreciated you sharing that.LOL. it means nothing other than there has been plenty of paid advertising on social media platforms.
Say's the guy who shares nothing but instagram posts...oh and Rumble.
Some people’s brains never fully develop ;)
burleigh wrote:southernraw wrote:overthefalls wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.I’ve got three adult kids who went to school with a lot of Aboriginal students. They told me they are voting yes, even before I told them my position on the issue. My eldest daughter and her boyfriend are currently managing a pub in a small town in the Riverina district (a long way from home!); she said most of the clientele are old farmers who vehemently oppose The Voice, some fearing that their land will get taken away from them one day!
Many of my colleagues are Aboriginal elders who are definitely voting yes. Most older crew (50+) who I surf with every morning are also voting yes.
Some of my older, city-dwelling relatives are voting no, which doesn’t surprise me because they are generally very conservative with very little, if any, experience or understanding of Aboriginal people.Thanks OTF. That's some extremely heartening reading in the current climate of fearmongering.
Much appreciated you sharing that.LOL. it means nothing other than there has been plenty of paid advertising on social media platforms.
Why do you assume that everybody is glued to social media platforms? You have a very bleak view of people’s capacity to think for themselves. Your smug comment also mocks the opinions of the Aboriginal elders I referred to in my post.
overthefalls wrote:burleigh wrote:southernraw wrote:overthefalls wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.I’ve got three adult kids who went to school with a lot of Aboriginal students. They told me they are voting yes, even before I told them my position on the issue. My eldest daughter and her boyfriend are currently managing a pub in a small town in the Riverina district (a long way from home!); she said most of the clientele are old farmers who vehemently oppose The Voice, some fearing that their land will get taken away from them one day!
Many of my colleagues are Aboriginal elders who are definitely voting yes. Most older crew (50+) who I surf with every morning are also voting yes.
Some of my older, city-dwelling relatives are voting no, which doesn’t surprise me because they are generally very conservative with very little, if any, experience or understanding of Aboriginal people.Thanks OTF. That's some extremely heartening reading in the current climate of fearmongering.
Much appreciated you sharing that.LOL. it means nothing other than there has been plenty of paid advertising on social media platforms.
Why do you assume that everybody is glued to social media platforms? You have a very bleak view of people’s capacity to think for themselves.
Sorry OTF. I'm sure your kids are awesome. It's great you’re defending them to online strangers.
sameaswas wrote:Jelly Flater wrote:Ummmm
its been revealed jacinta has billed Australian taxpayers $76000 for business class flights ;)
- is she truly representing the fnp, or just being another political snout in the trough good for nothing leach ?
Looking out for which people ;)
$370billion + $100mill from business council of oz + $34billion per annum for fnp beaurocracy's
land councils allocateing govt monies willynilly, all of em cronies..mates of marcia and co.
no accountability, secrecy.i saw a video of ken bloody oath ystrday, he said "34billion dollrs a year on fnp's and they want a voice!"..."it's not a voice they need it's a fuckin audit they need!!....hahaha he cracked up laughing, me too.
SameAsWasYesterdaysBullshit
Hi. Your opinion, definitely not mine.
As you are an Auditor General now, please save me the arduous and time consuming task of auditing the mega billions about to be put aside for Submarines and their weaponry, because if you look at its core intention, it is to blow the shit out of people from another nation.
Similarly, you are doing the same here.
What kind of positive outlook or economy is that ? Pretty poor for us with simply, a no return on investment.
You’ve helped me heaps with your comment, see Ive been compiling a list of Australia’s greatest vigilante tax payers, and to no surprise, you are the Captain of that Motley Crue.
An insanely high income awaits you at the ATO. , Business Class flights, car, credit card, accommodation, you are probably the kind of guy who raids the little shampoo, conditioner and soaps in motels. Petty government thief. But thats ok.
Get a grip, where’s your humanity. You’ve a voice of segregation fella or chick or whatever you are. Go back and read your efforts of late.
Proud ?
Why do you expect rife rorting in Aboriginal politics to be any different from Anglo politics, after all, as I’ve previously stated, THEY ARE JUST PEOPLE, just like you and me ?
It’s tiring and boring this whole monetary angle on this topic.
But i knew it would slowly rise to the surface as scum always show its face in the long run.
Looks like I’m just starting to get the answers to my initial question Supafreak, they’re a bit slow this NO mob.
When will clowns like you and others understand.
How do live in a country where you know so little about the people who live here, ignorance, id say.? AW
Jelly Flater wrote:Some people’s brains never fully develop ;)
100% true
You can see it in the age demographic stats, while most dont many still vote the way they would have when young.
Burleigh, my point wasn’t to defend my kids; it was to defend people who can and do think for themselves, without the influence of social media.
indo-dreaming wrote:Jelly Flater wrote:Some people’s brains never fully develop ;)
100% true
You can see it in the age demographic stats, while most dont many still vote the way they would have when young.
I don't think that graph proves what you think it does, big fella.
One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
southernraw wrote:Hiccups wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.It's no surprise at all we were all young and naive, i use to vote for the Greens, it comes down to a few things, lack of life experience and understanding of life and the fact the brain doesn't fully develop until the mid to late 20's.
Info, how many times must you remind us that you used to vote green cos you were "young and naive", or young and stupid. Dude, you're now middle aged, naive and stupid, so I don't see your point.
My take on that is that he's easily led by others. Follows the herd, just to be accepted. Bleats it enough to get a pretty good read on it.
That doesn't make sense, its actually the. complete opposite, as we can see here surfer's tend to lean left and other scenes ive spent time in like music lean even further left.
If i followed the heard id be the same.
Agreed OTF, but there's no way in hell, that after 200years of dominance that white Australia would allow Indigenous Australians to pave their own way and have a referendum for themselves. Can you imagine the outrage. Look at it on here and that's WITH being asked to participate in a vote.
Hence, the only possible way to make inroads is to offer a referendum for everyone to have a say...which was most likely doomed from the start.
We'll see. Might still be a generation away.
overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
@burleigh , if it was just blakfellas voting what do you truly believe the result would be ? Honest answer please .
indo-dreaming wrote:southernraw wrote:Hiccups wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:southernraw wrote:Interestingly most of the younger crew around here are all for yes.
Most older crew are hard no's.
I wonder if crew who have kids of voting age would b willing to share on here if their kids are voting y or n.It's no surprise at all we were all young and naive, i use to vote for the Greens, it comes down to a few things, lack of life experience and understanding of life and the fact the brain doesn't fully develop until the mid to late 20's.
Info, how many times must you remind us that you used to vote green cos you were "young and naive", or young and stupid. Dude, you're now middle aged, naive and stupid, so I don't see your point.
My take on that is that he's easily led by others. Follows the herd, just to be accepted. Bleats it enough to get a pretty good read on it.
That doesn't make sense, its actually the. complete opposite, as we can see here surfer's tend to lean left and other scenes ive spent time in like music lean even further left.
If i followed the heard id be the same.
Oh no, online you're a warrior info. Don't worry about that.
In real life, i have no doubt you'd be a pandering sniffling little turd that jumps at shadows and bends to the will of his peers.
overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
So does that also mean black fellas shouldn't get a say in non indigenous issues?
It should be exactly like it is, all Australians should have a say, its all our country, its all our constitution and its all out tax payers money.
overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
Why should only aboriginal Australians get to decide on amendments to the Australian constitution? What a strange thing to say. The Australian constitution is for all Australians, not just some.
“It's no surprise at all we were all young and naive, i use to vote for the Greens, it comes down to a few things, lack of life experience and understanding of life and the fact the brain doesn't fully develop until the mid to late 20's.”
https://m.
AlfredWallace wrote:sameaswas wrote:Jelly Flater wrote:Ummmm
its been revealed jacinta has billed Australian taxpayers $76000 for business class flights ;)
- is she truly representing the fnp, or just being another political snout in the trough good for nothing leach ?
Looking out for which people ;)
$370billion + $100mill from business council of oz + $34billion per annum for fnp beaurocracy's
land councils allocateing govt monies willynilly, all of em cronies..mates of marcia and co.
no accountability, secrecy.i saw a video of ken bloody oath ystrday, he said "34billion dollrs a year on fnp's and they want a voice!"..."it's not a voice they need it's a fuckin audit they need!!....hahaha he cracked up laughing, me too.
SameAsWasYesterdaysBullshit
Hi. Your opinion, definitely not mine.
As you are an Auditor General now, please save me the arduous and time consuming task of auditing the mega billions about to be put aside for Submarines and their weaponry, because if you look at its core intention, it is to blow the shit out of people from another nation.
Similarly, you are doing the same here.What kind of positive outlook or economy is that ? Pretty poor for us with simply, a no return on investment.
You’ve helped me heaps with your comment, see Ive been compiling a list of Australia’s greatest vigilante tax payers, and to no surprise, you are the Captain of that Motley Crue.
An insanely high income awaits you at the ATO. , Business Class flights, car, credit card, accommodation, you are probably the kind of guy who raids the little shampoo, conditioner and soaps in motels. Petty government thief. But thats ok.Get a grip, where’s your humanity. You’ve a voice of segregation fella or chick or whatever you are. Go back and read your efforts of late.
Proud ?Why do you expect rife rorting in Aboriginal politics to be any different from Anglo politics, after all, as I’ve previously stated, THEY ARE JUST PEOPLE, just like you and me ?
It’s tiring and boring this whole monetary angle on this topic.
But i knew it would slowly rise to the surface as scum always show its face in the long run.Looks like I’m just starting to get the answers to my initial question Supafreak, they’re a bit slow this NO mob.
When will clowns like you and others understand.
How do live in a country where you know so little about the people who live here, ignorance, id say.? AW
so you admit to the corruption then, remember atsic?
you should be asking the captains of the voice where all monies gone, but hey the silence is deafening.
indo-dreaming wrote:overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
So does that also mean black fellas shouldn't get a say in non indigenous issues?
It should be exactly like it is, all Australians should have a say, its all our country, its all our constitution and its all out tax payers money.
My point is that people who have limited practical experience and understanding of the unique issues faced by Aboriginal people should not be in a position to decide what is best for them. How would you feel about a hairdresser telling you how to hang gyprock?
Hiccups wrote:sameaswas wrote:piccaninny is not a racist slur if u want racism listen to "king billy"
Well, it is, and the whole rest of your comment was racist as well. You don't get to say something isn't racist because there's something else more racist.
woke.
sameaswas wrote:Hiccups wrote:sameaswas wrote:piccaninny is not a racist slur if u want racism listen to "king billy"
Well, it is, and the whole rest of your comment was racist as well. You don't get to say something isn't racist because there's something else more racist.
woke.
Geez you're even dumber than i gave you credit for sameaswas
waveman wrote:overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
Why should only aboriginal Australians get to decide on amendments to the Australian constitution? What a strange thing to say. The Australian constitution is for all Australians, not just some.
What’s wrong about them getting acknowledged in the constitution? I think it’s a small but powerful gesture of reconciliation.
southernraw wrote:sameaswas wrote:Hiccups wrote:sameaswas wrote:piccaninny is not a racist slur if u want racism listen to "king billy"
Well, it is, and the whole rest of your comment was racist as well. You don't get to say something isn't racist because there's something else more racist.
woke.
Geez you're even dumber than i gave you credit for sameaswas
More insults from Southernsook. nothing new
burleigh wrote:southernraw wrote:sameaswas wrote:Hiccups wrote:sameaswas wrote:piccaninny is not a racist slur if u want racism listen to "king billy"
Well, it is, and the whole rest of your comment was racist as well. You don't get to say something isn't racist because there's something else more racist.
woke.
Geez you're even dumber than i gave you credit for sameaswas
More insults from Southernsook. nothing new
It's called give respect to get respect.
Simple philosophy.
southernraw wrote:burleigh wrote:southernraw wrote:sameaswas wrote:Hiccups wrote:sameaswas wrote:piccaninny is not a racist slur if u want racism listen to "king billy"
Well, it is, and the whole rest of your comment was racist as well. You don't get to say something isn't racist because there's something else more racist.
woke.
Geez you're even dumber than i gave you credit for sameaswas
More insults from Southernsook. nothing new
It's called give respect to get respect.
Simple philosophy.
Here is another simple philosophy for you: The hardest thing to open is a closed mind.
Now go sit down and think about.
overthefalls wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
So does that also mean black fellas shouldn't get a say in non indigenous issues?
It should be exactly like it is, all Australians should have a say, its all our country, its all our constitution and its all out tax payers money.
My point is that people who have limited practical experience and understanding of the unique issues faced by Aboriginal people should not be in a position to decide what is best for them. How would you feel about a hairdresser telling you how to hang gyprock?
Almost all the issues faced in communities aren't unique, they are issues all humans face, housing, education, employment, health, medical care ect
BTW. As has been noted many times there is all kinds of bodies and organisation's, that already consult communities, but even then I still doubt very few if any are against a legislated voice.
The problem is about activist wanting the voice in the constitution.
overthefalls wrote:waveman wrote:overthefalls wrote:One thing we can agree on, Burleigh; it should be just Aboriginal people voting on this issue. The referendum essentially amounts to mostly white fellas deciding what’s best for black fellas.
Why should only aboriginal Australians get to decide on amendments to the Australian constitution? What a strange thing to say. The Australian constitution is for all Australians, not just some.
What’s wrong about them getting acknowledged in the constitution? I think it’s a small but powerful gesture of reconciliation.
You know full well, this isnt about constitutional recognition, we all know if it was only that or if it was a seperate question it would get up easily.
But there is zero money or power in constitutional recognition.
I think you'll find im open minded to anyone whos courteous and respectful.
I welcome all perspectives.
Dont tolerate personal shit aimed at me though and I'll come back ten times harder to thise that do.
That goes for offline too.
Simple way of living.
Im sure we can clean the slate and b respectful frim this point onwards burleigh?
@burleigh , look at all these white people gathering to vote no to the voice , do you feel the same rage as you did to the to the yes to the voice white people ? 
Supafreak wrote:@burleigh , look at all these white people gathering to vote no to the voice , do you feel the same rage as you did to the to the yes to the voice white people ?
Yes i do actually.
@burleigh thanks for answering, so what would the result be if only FNP voted ?
Supafreak wrote:@burleigh thanks for answering, so what would the result be if only FNP voted ?
I can't predict the future Supa. I have no idea what the result would be.
Had a nice surf... thought I'd check the day's offerings on here. Damn, still going in circles. Pointless engaging people who can't see reason... Well at least they understand now how the Constitution was written in the time of the White Australia Policy... how in '67 we voted in a ref to allow Aboriginal people to be counted as citizens and how, regardless of this refs outcome, the No boys on here will support the claims for Treaty and changing Australia Day.
sameaswas wrote:AlfredWallace wrote:sameaswas wrote:Jelly Flater wrote:Ummmm
its been revealed jacinta has billed Australian taxpayers $76000 for business class flights ;)
- is she truly representing the fnp, or just being another political snout in the trough good for nothing leach ?
Looking out for which people ;)
$370billion + $100mill from business council of oz + $34billion per annum for fnp beaurocracy's
land councils allocateing govt monies willynilly, all of em cronies..mates of marcia and co.
no accountability, secrecy.i saw a video of ken bloody oath ystrday, he said "34billion dollrs a year on fnp's and they want a voice!"..."it's not a voice they need it's a fuckin audit they need!!....hahaha he cracked up laughing, me too.
SameAsWasYesterdaysBullshit
Hi. Your opinion, definitely not mine.
As you are an Auditor General now, please save me the arduous and time consuming task of auditing the mega billions about to be put aside for Submarines and their weaponry, because if you look at its core intention, it is to blow the shit out of people from another nation.
Similarly, you are doing the same here.What kind of positive outlook or economy is that ? Pretty poor for us with simply, a no return on investment.
You’ve helped me heaps with your comment, see Ive been compiling a list of Australia’s greatest vigilante tax payers, and to no surprise, you are the Captain of that Motley Crue.
An insanely high income awaits you at the ATO. , Business Class flights, car, credit card, accommodation, you are probably the kind of guy who raids the little shampoo, conditioner and soaps in motels. Petty government thief. But thats ok.Get a grip, where’s your humanity. You’ve a voice of segregation fella or chick or whatever you are. Go back and read your efforts of late.
Proud ?Why do you expect rife rorting in Aboriginal politics to be any different from Anglo politics, after all, as I’ve previously stated, THEY ARE JUST PEOPLE, just like you and me ?
It’s tiring and boring this whole monetary angle on this topic.
But i knew it would slowly rise to the surface as scum always show its face in the long run.Looks like I’m just starting to get the answers to my initial question Supafreak, they’re a bit slow this NO mob.
When will clowns like you and others understand.
How do live in a country where you know so little about the people who live here, ignorance, id say.? AWso you admit to the corruption then, remember atsic?
you should be asking the captains of the voice where all monies gone, but hey the silence is deafening.
SameAsWas. Thanks for your reply.
Sorry, I must have misread your initial post. Was it your money that got misused ?
If so, we better get around SwNetters, we can’t have someone with the arse out of their pants, no food, violent on an empty stomach, may end up in jail (where have I heard of that before ) better organise a Go Fund Me page so you aren’t left on the streets, couldn’t have that now, you might meet a FNP.
Well you just highlighted your hollowness to all of us.
Of all of the Australian organisations past and present, the only one your minute pea brain is capable of remembering is ATSIC, funny about that.
Why is this so ? Have a think about it, I think you no the answer, begins with H and ends with D.
Proves my point wholeheartedly. You have have a personal agenda or hatred towards FNP, don’t worry , you won’t be lonely, there’s plenty like you. Cant wait for you and your kin to perish, you guys wouldn’t even make good compost.
How sad and bereft of any feeling towards people you must have.
How do you keep up the brave face and the tough exterior of an opposer ?
You wouldn’t fucking know what to say or how to behave in front of a FNP, that’s the root cause ensconced in this nation. AW
burleigh wrote:Supafreak wrote:@burleigh , look at all these white people gathering to vote no to the voice , do you feel the same rage as you did to the to the yes to the voice white people ?
Yes i do actually.
Look at all the old fucks... probably need to wait for Hanson and her generation to pass into oblivion b4 real change happens.
harrycoopr wrote:Look at all the old fucks... probably need to wait for Hanson and her generation to pass into oblivion b4 real change happens.
Its so funny when you lefties think like this, the aspect that you dont understand, is that while you might not have got wiser and more conservative as you grew up, naturally most people do, so it just doesn't work the way you think it does.
Like the old saying goes
"If You Are Not a Liberal at 25, You Have No Heart. If You Are Not a Conservative at 35 You Have No Brain"
harrycoopr wrote:burleigh wrote:Supafreak wrote:@burleigh , look at all these white people gathering to vote no to the voice , do you feel the same rage as you did to the to the yes to the voice white people ?
Yes i do actually.
Look at all the old fucks... probably need to wait for Hanson and her generation to pass into oblivion b4 real change happens.
@harry , I think you’re right , even if the yes vote gets up real change in attitudes is a generation away and that’s coming from 2 old fcks haha
indo-dreaming wrote:harrycoopr wrote:Look at all the old fucks... probably need to wait for Hanson and her generation to pass into oblivion b4 real change happens.
Its so funny when you lefties think like this, the aspect that you dont understand, is that while you might not have got wiser and more conservative as you grew up, naturally most people do, so it just doesn't work the way you think it does.
Like the old saying goes
"If You Are Not a Liberal at 25, You Have No Heart. If You Are Not a Conservative at 35 You Have No Brain"
https://m.
WTF is going on ? This is on sky news……https://x.com/jasonclaremp/status/1704403663115133334?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzXe... #howlowcanindogo in 3…2…1
Supafreak wrote:WTF is going on ? This is on sky news……https://x.com/jasonclaremp/status/1704403663115133334?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzXe...
Yikes!
southernraw wrote:Supafreak wrote:WTF is going on ? This is on sky news……https://x.com/jasonclaremp/status/1704403663115133334?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzXe...
Yikes!
Fellas... it's just typical rightwing fare... their insanity knows no limits
harrycoopr wrote:southernraw wrote:Supafreak wrote:WTF is going on ? This is on sky news……https://x.com/jasonclaremp/status/1704403663115133334?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzXe...
Yikes!
Fellas... it's just typical rightwing fare... their insanity knows no limits
I was sure I posted a twitter thread regarding the "Aussie Cossack" in here yesterday, but can't find it. Anyway, this is the foolish fool in question. Doesn't mind rubbing shoulders with literal Nazis. Top bloke, obviously. Head like a bulldog chewin' a wasp an' all. Furthermore, Rukshan Fernando. What a fucken joke.
That the same Aussie Cossack seen here sending messages to Neo Nazi Tom Sewell in encrypted messaging apps? https://t.co/a5W4hBVIPj
— Alternate Media Watchers (@AltMediaWatch) September 19, 2023
Yeh, you did Hiccups, yesterday 9:38pm : )
Hiccups wrote:harrycoopr wrote:southernraw wrote:Supafreak wrote:WTF is going on ? This is on sky news……https://x.com/jasonclaremp/status/1704403663115133334?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzXe...
Yikes!
Fellas... it's just typical rightwing fare... their insanity knows no limits
I was sure I posted a twitter thread regarding the "Aussie Cossack" in here yesterday, but can't find it. Anyway, this is the foolish fool in question. Doesn't mind rubbing shoulders with literal Nazis. Top bloke, obviously. Head like a bulldog chewin' a wasp an' all. Furthermore, Rukshan Fernando. What a fucken joke.
That the same Aussie Cossack seen here sending messages to Neo Nazi Tom Sewell in encrypted messaging apps? https://t.co/a5W4hBVIPj
— Alternate Media Watchers (@AltMediaWatch) September 19, 2023
@hiccups , yes I remember seeing your post . I was thinking about rukshan when the yes rally was on . Someone said he was unbiased and covered the news in a honest manner with real life accurate reporting but he hasn’t posted anything from the yes rallies around the country. Maybe he was covering the No campaign from parliament house in Melbourne . https://x.com/cookersozstyle/status/1703317001551401091?s=46&t=5RczxwAfz...
Yikes. This says more than any fake Russian news you guys are sharing.
Uni assignment i did a few years ago. This is my take on things. I'm sure this will ruffle many feathers. I hope so.
Love Blue Diamond x
The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices
Introduction – Compensatory Justice
Disparities between the standards of living of humans on this planet have long been a part of our history on this planet. From the wealthy nations of the West to the developing and undeveloped nations on this globe, the diversity in the quality of life when viewed from a moral standpoint are without a doubt grossly unfair.
In this paper I will look at why historic injustices do require some form of reparation. I take a strong stance that we are more obliged to solve current injustices than to provide reparation for every act of injustice in the past. In doing this I will first investigate the historic injustice of the Aboriginal people of Australia and I will look at the argument that they are entitled to some form of reparation and why.
I will incoroporate some interesting views from Jeremy Waldron, Robert Nozick and others which will help me slowly build to my conclusion that reparation should be in the form of Non Indigenous Australians surrendering some of our priveleges as a form of reparation.
Historic Injustices to Indigenous Australians:
Australia the continent was well inhabited for many years long before white settlement. It is commonly known that in 1788 Australia was colonised as a country under the rule of the British Empire, with total contempt for the fact that it was already inhabited by a native indigenous race of people.
The way the original inhabitants have been treated, including forced assimilation, execution, stolen families and not even allowed to be recognised as citizens for a large part of white Australia’s history are also well known facts. (Poole, 1999,pp114-142)
There exists now a situation where there is a large divide between Aboriginal and non Aboriginal Australian’s that can be traced back to the moment Australia was invaded by English settlers and the brutal and unfair treatment that has followed.
So at this point now, in 2013 what is the just and fair way to make amends for past actions?
I would argue that a moderate to large amount of reparation is overdue for this nation of people, the Aboriginal people. But there are many challenges to this view point especially that of how much reparation, and what sort of compensation.
Past injustices or present suffering?
One of the questions raised in an issue like this is whether it is better to provide compensation or reparation for past deeds, which have already been done in a previous generation and cannot be changed, or whether it is better to now provide assistance to those who are suffering in their current situations and consider that as a form of moral duty.
To understand this we need to delve a little deeper into this issue and hear some differing viewpoints.
Firstly we need to understand what the best way to provide reparation. How do we judge what is the best way of giving back and how much? Jeremy Waldron states “The historic record has a fragility that consists, …in the sheer contingency of what happened in the past” (Waldron,1992,p5 )
This is saying that we can’t trace every single injustice back to the original act therefore reparation for every act would be almost impossible because it would ultimately be guess work.
In this statement he has an objection from Robert Nozick who believes it is in fact possible to address this problem by “changing the present so that it resembles how the past would have looked had the injustice not taken place” (McKenzie, 2013)
This would be a way to ultimately provide maximum reparation, but is it the correct approach? I believe this is a fairly radical approach, although it does have some merits in the fact it would be working in a positive way for indigenous people, I don’t think it is entirely the right way to deal with these issues but it is on the right track.
Waldron argues that it is based on too many unknowns. “The status of counterfactual reasoning about the exercising of human reasoning of human freedom is unclear”(Waldron 1993,p10)
Which leaves the question somewhat open about the sort of reparation that is required, but provides one clear answer to the key question. Both agree that yes, reparation to some extent is required. But how much and in what form?
Another philosopher who leans more towards Waldron’s views is Kymlicka. He is somewhat more straightforward in his assessment that property rights in particular for Aboriginals would create “massive unfairness” and also he maintains the argument “Aboriginal rights must be grounded in concerns about equality and contemporary disadvantage. (McKenzie, 2013) I agree with both these views but I don’t think they provide any active solutions.
The Solution?
So if its not handing back all of Australia’s land to the original inhabitants that is the most appropriate way to deal with past injustices, then what is?
I look at the current country I grew up in, as a white Australian. I ask myself why I never had Aboriginal friends growing up, no understanding of Aboriginal culture and why my basic understanding of Indigenous Australians is mostly 200 years old. I look at our flag, a symbol of a nation that stole a country from its original inhabitants, with no recognition of the Indigenous people at all on it. I see that Australia considered Indigenous people as less than people until only 40 years ago and I see the way that Indigenous Australians live a completely separate life to the way of life I know as an Australian. I see that the only indigenous politician I am aware of is a former Olympian and it is because of this fact of her sporting status that I know this. I see no collective power or representation of Indigenous Australians and I see non Indigenous Australians,( a culture built on a history of stealing a land and mistreating its people) still taking, taking as much out of this land as they can, with little to no regard of sharing or giving to the original inhabitants. I see a government that says lots of words about ‘closing the gap’ and bringing the living standards of non- indigenous and indigenous Australians closer together, but apart from nice words, there is no conviction, no follow through, just assimilation , and all that still remains are injustices.
As stated by Sparrow, “Continuity gives rise to responsibility on part of present generations of Australians for our history”.(McKenzie,2013). Although deeds happened in the past beyond our control, what we do now to either ignore, or rectify these issues will reflect on us in history. So if we choose to do nothing, we are contributing to the history of the mistreatment of non- indigenous Australians. And this is simply unacceptable in my opinion.
Conclusion
So what is fair? I believe that the way forward is a surrendering of some of our privileges as non- indigenous Australians. The simple fact is it was morally wrong without a doubt what has happened in the past. And it is also morally wrong without a doubt to ignore these facts and not offer some form of reparation in the present. But how much?
I think that going back to Robert Nozick’s argument is a start. I think Nozick is wrong to make the present resemble the past in every aspect. But I do think that it would be reasonable to restore some aspects of the way things should be. The things that happened in the past were out of our control and we can’t go back to changing the way things were. But we could change the way things are.
For some examples. Why not give at least 50% of political power to indigenous people? It surely would be a fair thing to do considering this is their country. Media control. 50 percent. Industry. Realestate. The list goes on. Why do we not acknowledge the indigenous people on our flag, or better still use their flag? Why is Australia still a part of the Commonwealth when it serves little purpose to any of us and serves as a constant reminder to Indigenous Australians that they are still controlled by the original invaders. These to me are fairly simple reparations that would have minimal impact on Australia as a whole. Perhaps, it would alter the way we live but I think it is our responsibility, morally to forfeit some of our privileges for the greater good. Basically a little bit goes a long way.
In closing, it is a fact that a huge injustice occurred to the Indigenous population and suffering continues to this day. There is no easy solution to such a burden of pain. I believe the only solutions are for the non- Indigenous population to take responsibility and sacrifice our own way of life to bring about an overall equality. Sacrifice is not an easy word. But it all comes down to right and wrong. We are in a position to give, in this current generation. What are we so scared to lose, that was never ours in the first place??
Bibliography
McKenzie,C.”Prof” (2013), Lecture, Historic Injustices and Indigenous Rights, Macquarie University
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28
References
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28