The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices

bluediamond started the topic in

Sunday, 25 Jul 2021 at 1:26pm

Uni assignment i did a few years ago. This is my take on things. I'm sure this will ruffle many feathers. I hope so.
Love Blue Diamond x

Introduction – Compensatory Justice
Disparities between the standards of living of humans on this planet have long been a part of our history on this planet. From the wealthy nations of the West to the developing and undeveloped nations on this globe, the diversity in the quality of life when viewed from a moral standpoint are without a doubt grossly unfair.
In this paper I will look at why historic injustices do require some form of reparation. I take a strong stance that we are more obliged to solve current injustices than to provide reparation for every act of injustice in the past. In doing this I will first investigate the historic injustice of the Aboriginal people of Australia and I will look at the argument that they are entitled to some form of reparation and why.
I will incoroporate some interesting views from Jeremy Waldron, Robert Nozick and others which will help me slowly build to my conclusion that reparation should be in the form of Non Indigenous Australians surrendering some of our priveleges as a form of reparation.

Historic Injustices to Indigenous Australians:
Australia the continent was well inhabited for many years long before white settlement. It is commonly known that in 1788 Australia was colonised as a country under the rule of the British Empire, with total contempt for the fact that it was already inhabited by a native indigenous race of people.
The way the original inhabitants have been treated, including forced assimilation, execution, stolen families and not even allowed to be recognised as citizens for a large part of white Australia’s history are also well known facts. (Poole, 1999,pp114-142)
There exists now a situation where there is a large divide between Aboriginal and non Aboriginal Australian’s that can be traced back to the moment Australia was invaded by English settlers and the brutal and unfair treatment that has followed.
So at this point now, in 2013 what is the just and fair way to make amends for past actions?
I would argue that a moderate to large amount of reparation is overdue for this nation of people, the Aboriginal people. But there are many challenges to this view point especially that of how much reparation, and what sort of compensation.

Past injustices or present suffering?
One of the questions raised in an issue like this is whether it is better to provide compensation or reparation for past deeds, which have already been done in a previous generation and cannot be changed, or whether it is better to now provide assistance to those who are suffering in their current situations and consider that as a form of moral duty.
To understand this we need to delve a little deeper into this issue and hear some differing viewpoints.
Firstly we need to understand what the best way to provide reparation. How do we judge what is the best way of giving back and how much? Jeremy Waldron states “The historic record has a fragility that consists, …in the sheer contingency of what happened in the past” (Waldron,1992,p5 )
This is saying that we can’t trace every single injustice back to the original act therefore reparation for every act would be almost impossible because it would ultimately be guess work.
In this statement he has an objection from Robert Nozick who believes it is in fact possible to address this problem by “changing the present so that it resembles how the past would have looked had the injustice not taken place” (McKenzie, 2013)
This would be a way to ultimately provide maximum reparation, but is it the correct approach? I believe this is a fairly radical approach, although it does have some merits in the fact it would be working in a positive way for indigenous people, I don’t think it is entirely the right way to deal with these issues but it is on the right track.
Waldron argues that it is based on too many unknowns. “The status of counterfactual reasoning about the exercising of human reasoning of human freedom is unclear”(Waldron 1993,p10)
Which leaves the question somewhat open about the sort of reparation that is required, but provides one clear answer to the key question. Both agree that yes, reparation to some extent is required. But how much and in what form?
Another philosopher who leans more towards Waldron’s views is Kymlicka. He is somewhat more straightforward in his assessment that property rights in particular for Aboriginals would create “massive unfairness” and also he maintains the argument “Aboriginal rights must be grounded in concerns about equality and contemporary disadvantage. (McKenzie, 2013) I agree with both these views but I don’t think they provide any active solutions.

The Solution?
So if its not handing back all of Australia’s land to the original inhabitants that is the most appropriate way to deal with past injustices, then what is?
I look at the current country I grew up in, as a white Australian. I ask myself why I never had Aboriginal friends growing up, no understanding of Aboriginal culture and why my basic understanding of Indigenous Australians is mostly 200 years old. I look at our flag, a symbol of a nation that stole a country from its original inhabitants, with no recognition of the Indigenous people at all on it. I see that Australia considered Indigenous people as less than people until only 40 years ago and I see the way that Indigenous Australians live a completely separate life to the way of life I know as an Australian. I see that the only indigenous politician I am aware of is a former Olympian and it is because of this fact of her sporting status that I know this. I see no collective power or representation of Indigenous Australians and I see non Indigenous Australians,( a culture built on a history of stealing a land and mistreating its people) still taking, taking as much out of this land as they can, with little to no regard of sharing or giving to the original inhabitants. I see a government that says lots of words about ‘closing the gap’ and bringing the living standards of non- indigenous and indigenous Australians closer together, but apart from nice words, there is no conviction, no follow through, just assimilation , and all that still remains are injustices.
As stated by Sparrow, “Continuity gives rise to responsibility on part of present generations of Australians for our history”.(McKenzie,2013). Although deeds happened in the past beyond our control, what we do now to either ignore, or rectify these issues will reflect on us in history. So if we choose to do nothing, we are contributing to the history of the mistreatment of non- indigenous Australians. And this is simply unacceptable in my opinion.

Conclusion
So what is fair? I believe that the way forward is a surrendering of some of our privileges as non- indigenous Australians. The simple fact is it was morally wrong without a doubt what has happened in the past. And it is also morally wrong without a doubt to ignore these facts and not offer some form of reparation in the present. But how much?
I think that going back to Robert Nozick’s argument is a start. I think Nozick is wrong to make the present resemble the past in every aspect. But I do think that it would be reasonable to restore some aspects of the way things should be. The things that happened in the past were out of our control and we can’t go back to changing the way things were. But we could change the way things are.
For some examples. Why not give at least 50% of political power to indigenous people? It surely would be a fair thing to do considering this is their country. Media control. 50 percent. Industry. Realestate. The list goes on. Why do we not acknowledge the indigenous people on our flag, or better still use their flag? Why is Australia still a part of the Commonwealth when it serves little purpose to any of us and serves as a constant reminder to Indigenous Australians that they are still controlled by the original invaders. These to me are fairly simple reparations that would have minimal impact on Australia as a whole. Perhaps, it would alter the way we live but I think it is our responsibility, morally to forfeit some of our privileges for the greater good. Basically a little bit goes a long way.
In closing, it is a fact that a huge injustice occurred to the Indigenous population and suffering continues to this day. There is no easy solution to such a burden of pain. I believe the only solutions are for the non- Indigenous population to take responsibility and sacrifice our own way of life to bring about an overall equality. Sacrifice is not an easy word. But it all comes down to right and wrong. We are in a position to give, in this current generation. What are we so scared to lose, that was never ours in the first place??

Bibliography
McKenzie,C.”Prof” (2013), Lecture, Historic Injustices and Indigenous Rights, Macquarie University
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28

References
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28

waveman Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 2:53pm

harrycoopr wrote:
waveman wrote:
southernraw wrote:
Yep. Well said Harry. Especially about the farmer who's making coin off the land.
That's especially prevalent over here in the West. Got a few fb friends from my travels that own large properties throughout the state and they're doing the same 'bleating', posting that same narrative. Mostly in their 60s and 70s.
. Their farms are generational, passed down through the families so they're born into the asset, which more often than not, is rather juicy in dollar figures considering most of these farms are huge properties with high turnovers of grain or livestock.
Right back when indigenous crews land's were stolen off them by the original settlers starting these farms, indigenous people were criminalized, often with severe consequences, just for trying to get food off their traditional lands, which often could be the farmers cattle, as that was what remained on their lands.
I can imagine bad blood from the indigenous crew to this day for that, but from the fuckers that stole their land, it's disgusting.
It's the same as people like lowinfo. I think it's a guilt complex easier confronted by ignorance and shouting louder so as not to actually accept any responsibility for past injustices. The old 'i wasn't there so why should i be guilty' holds no substance when you have the ability right now, (especially with this upcoming vote) to make a postive change that, especially when viewed in history, can be seen as righting one of many wrongs.
Gotta start somewhere, and saying no is starting nowhere, and i'd say there's a deeper reason people want to vote no.

Yes voters now ridiculing farmers.

As for being born into an asset, have you heard of native title? Best estimates are that more than 50% of Australia’s land mass is indigenous owned or controlled. And farms don’t become profitable by accident. Here’s an example of what not to do - didn’t seem to get a lot of coverage at the time (mass cattle deaths on indigenous owned pastoral leases):

https://www.countryman.com.au/countryman/news/aboriginal-charity-and-eig...

Another moron... most native title land is desert and unfarmable... no good for whitey. The good land got stolen real quick with hunts and mass killings and all sorts of whitey fun.

It’s farmable if you know how. Majority of those cattle died of thirst.

AlfredWallace Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 3:19pm

waveman wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
waveman wrote:
southernraw wrote:
Yep. Well said Harry. Especially about the farmer who's making coin off the land.
That's especially prevalent over here in the West. Got a few fb friends from my travels that own large properties throughout the state and they're doing the same 'bleating', posting that same narrative. Mostly in their 60s and 70s.
. Their farms are generational, passed down through the families so they're born into the asset, which more often than not, is rather juicy in dollar figures considering most of these farms are huge properties with high turnovers of grain or livestock.
Right back when indigenous crews land's were stolen off them by the original settlers starting these farms, indigenous people were criminalized, often with severe consequences, just for trying to get food off their traditional lands, which often could be the farmers cattle, as that was what remained on their lands.
I can imagine bad blood from the indigenous crew to this day for that, but from the fuckers that stole their land, it's disgusting.
It's the same as people like lowinfo. I think it's a guilt complex easier confronted by ignorance and shouting louder so as not to actually accept any responsibility for past injustices. The old 'i wasn't there so why should i be guilty' holds no substance when you have the ability right now, (especially with this upcoming vote) to make a postive change that, especially when viewed in history, can be seen as righting one of many wrongs.
Gotta start somewhere, and saying no is starting nowhere, and i'd say there's a deeper reason people want to vote no.

Yes voters now ridiculing farmers.

As for being born into an asset, have you heard of native title? Best estimates are that more than 50% of Australia’s land mass is indigenous owned or controlled. And farms don’t become profitable by accident. Here’s an example of what not to do - didn’t seem to get a lot of coverage at the time (mass cattle deaths on indigenous owned pastoral leases):

https://www.countryman.com.au/countryman/news/aboriginal-charity-and-eig...

Another moron... most native title land is desert and unfarmable... no good for whitey. The good land got stolen real quick with hunts and mass killings and all sorts of whitey fun.

It’s farmable if you know how. Majority of those cattle died of thirst.

So Waveman. No non FNP farmer has ever lost cattle due to the lack of water. You must be from WA and having some type of hallucination.

WA- The privileged state, where we care about nothing but ourselves, just ask Twiggy. AW

AlfredWallace Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 3:31pm

waveman.

What about we frame it this way.

‘Mass Aboriginal deaths on pastoral (stolen Aboriginal) land’ , they probably never had access to water…..basic food, basic human rights.

I think we all (hope) value a persons life over a fucking environmentally unfriendly animal that should never have been proliferated on Australian soil. If you want to know why, just ask, but if you are a farmer, you wouldn’t be interested one iota, because you are still stuck in your own archaic ways from your father, his father and so on from the time FNP were evicted from their land. You lot make my blood boil. Please respond so i can show you photos of what farming is really like. AW.

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 3:33pm

harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Supafreak wrote:
Supafreak wrote:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cw4WjW_L0hI/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&...

Heres a quick clip of her @burleigh

She's that same one that you have shared before dissing Jacinta yeah.

All i can say is thank god we don't have smell O vision yet, i cant say ive ever been keen on the smell of dirty Nimbin type feral's.

And there u have it... indo shows his true worth. Ugly human.

ha ha coming from the guy that has a personal insult in ever post.

Very bland compared to the stuff the yes camp has spewed out over the years, Marcia has a history of it, here's one from a few years back.

This is the problem for those involved in the Yes camp, they have had very loose mouths in the past.

GuySmiley Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 3:38pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Supafreak wrote:
Supafreak wrote:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cw4WjW_L0hI/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&...

Heres a quick clip of her @burleigh

She's that same one that you have shared before dissing Jacinta yeah.

All i can say is thank god we don't have smell O vision yet, i cant say ive ever been keen on the smell of dirty Nimbin type feral's.

And there u have it... indo shows his true worth. Ugly human.

ha ha coming from the guy that has a personal insult in ever post.

Very bland compared to the stuff the yes camp has spewed out over the years, Marcia has a history of it, here's one from a few years back.

This is the problem for those involved in the Yes camp, they have had very loose mouths in the past.

What part of that is incorrect? Spot on

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:07pm

Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

AlfredWallace Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:14pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

Indo. Hi. How’s things ?

Come on, you can do better than that. That’s not your best work.
You’re normally very expansive on everything. Bit of fun. AW

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:16pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

No it ain't... if you're an arsehole u should be called out. All i have done is call you and burley out for the stupid fools u are... if you write stupid, comment stupid thenyou probably are stupid. Just the truth man... accept yr idiocy with grace.

andy-mac Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:24pm

Couple of colleagues of mine received unsolicited texts from Jacinta yesterday. They could not reply.
Now she is whinging her phone number got leaked and she is receiving unsolicited texts...
Fark me, the hypocrisy is mind blowing.

AlfredWallace Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:28pm

andy-mac wrote:
Couple of colleagues of mine received unsolicited texts from Jacinta yesterday. They could not reply.
Now she is whinging her phone number got leaked and she is receiving unsolicited texts...
Fark me, the hypocrisy is mind blowing.

Andy-Mac. Hi. Yep, i got one also, pissed me off, wouldn’t let me text a reply.
Fucking hate it when political figures of any persuasion make contact right about voting time. Desperate, all I can say.AW

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:40pm

andy-mac wrote:
Couple of colleagues of mine received unsolicited texts from Jacinta yesterday. They could not reply.
Now she is whinging her phone number got leaked and she is receiving unsolicited texts...
Fark me, the hypocrisy is mind blowing.

Argh i think its probably more the abusive text and actual death threats that are the issue.

Personally i dont like the unsolicited text thing, i dont think its a good strategy at all, more likely to turn people off

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:54pm

harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

No it ain't... if you're an arsehole u should be called out. All i have done is call you and burley out for the stupid fools u are... if you write stupid, comment stupid thenyou probably are stupid. Just the truth man... accept yr idiocy with grace.

Mate you are an A grade tosser, your double standard is a joke, claiming your offended by me calling some women a dirty feral, while you cant see anything wrong with a public figure wishing a slow and painful death on another public figure?

But its no surprise your first post here was some BS about no voters hating Indigenous people or something and every post since has just been as ridiculous rarely without insults at others who you dont agree with.

Your honestly the kind of person that helps the undecided, go with a No vote.

overthefalls Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:51pm

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/jactina-price-likens-indigenous-and-...

Quite a contentious opinion.

overthefalls Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 4:57pm

Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

burleigh Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 5:04pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
Your honestly the kind of person that helps the undecided, go with a No vote.

100% to this.

burleigh Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 5:05pm

overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

Why are you bringing her race into it? Indo didn't.

Not saying i agree with what Indo said, but why the race card OTF?

GuySmiley Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 5:12pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

Lower than the former PM who introduced but later denied responsibility for Robodebt which saw 100s of thousands of people being chased for debts they didn’t owe and some tragically killing themselves ? Lower than the former PM who is still suckling at the teat of a taxpayer funded position?

There is no depth @stu’s open minded and not blinded by ideology lil buddy will go to dredge up shit to hammer home a crass point for 1,000th time while ignoring the worst of politics and politicians this country has ever seen. You’re beyond wilfully ignorant

overthefalls Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 5:21pm

burleigh wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

Why are you bringing her race into it? Indo didn't.

Not saying i agree with what Indo said, but why the race card OTF?

No race card intended, but the whole point of her interview was that she was on the receiving end of racist abuse. I was surprised that her anecdote elicited an insult, rather than sympathy.

truebluebasher Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 6:41pm

Voicebox
11th Sept Monday Voice Postal Vote Applications
11th Sept Monday (AEC 20 Indigenous Languages Booklet Deadline) 97% Fail
12th Sept Tues ~ Wham! Bam! Jacinta's Spam!...Undecided Voters find their Voice!
18th Sept Monday (8:pm) Enrolment Compulsory - Deadline...(Locks out rush of blood Voting urges!)
25th Sept Monday (AEC Remote Indigenous Voting)
29th Sept Friday (AEC Voice Booklet Deadline) No AEC outbound Booklets after this date!
2nd Oct Monday Pre Poll ~ Tas / Vic / NT / WA
3rd Oct Tuesday Pre Poll ~ NSW / ACT / SA / Qld
11th Oct Wed (6:pm) Postal Vote Close
11th Oct Wed (6:pm) [Yes] to a Blackout > [No] more Whitewashing!
12th Oct Thurs (Red Hot Covid Outbreak) 20m Voters must Quarantine (Postal Votes closed..sorry!)
14th Oct Sat ~ Toto barks twice...AEC = That's a [YES] Toto gobbles up all 20m sausages!
Counting
14-27th Oct (AEC Motto : Right not Rushed)
If just one state is close then AEC may not call same day result!
We may have to wait until all postals come back to AEC...(13 days)
https://www.aec.gov.au/referendums/learn/the-count.html

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:19pm

overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

She's Aboriginal????

Mate i use to have dreads(semi's) and a nose ring, and a fkn hair braid thing with coloured beads in it, while living in a Kombi,(and a naive mind set almost the same as Southern Raw) i know feral trash when i see it, cause i use to be it.

Supa has shared post of hers before, dissing Jacinta but id never seen her pic or video, but all made sense when i saw her video.

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:18pm

GuySmiley wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

Lower than the former PM who introduced but later denied responsibility for Robodebt which saw 100s of thousands of people being chased for debts they didn’t owe and some tragically killing themselves ? Lower than the former PM who is still suckling at the teat of a taxpayer funded position?

There is no depth @stu’s open minded and not blinded by ideology lil buddy will go to dredge up shit to hammer home a crass point for 1,000th time while ignoring the worst of politics and politicians this country has ever seen. You’re beyond wilfully ignorant

Gee's clutching at straws today Guy

Surely you can see the false equivalence here????

Its about intent.

A policy like robodebt or the pink batts scheme sadly both resulted in deaths, but that was not the intention of either scheme.

While the intent of Marcias tweet is quite clear.

And she has shown a pattern of behaviour over a number of years, so when she makes comments like she did in the past week, it's of no surprise, no matter how she tries to paint things.

BTW. If i had said similar thing, you would have a melt down, and mention it for years to come

truebluebasher Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:22pm

Unanimous Oz Voice Vote (Declaring) Tuesday 12th Sept { Invasion Day }
Bully Jacinta infected Aussies with her poison.
Aussies can now spam each other on Sacred Big Chief Bully's Day!

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:32pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

No it ain't... if you're an arsehole u should be called out. All i have done is call you and burley out for the stupid fools u are... if you write stupid, comment stupid thenyou probably are stupid. Just the truth man... accept yr idiocy with grace.

Mate you are an A grade tosser, your double standard is a joke, claiming your offended by me calling some women a dirty feral, while you cant see anything wrong with a public figure wishing a slow and painful death on another public figure?

But its no surprise your first post here was some BS about no voters hating Indigenous people or something and every post since has just been as ridiculous rarely without insults at others who you dont agree with.

Your honestly the kind of person that helps the undecided, go with a No vote.

I just get frustrated by pure stupidity... my insults towards u are of a different species to yr putdowns of "ferals"... my insults are based in truth...u are stupid, u keep proving it everytime u post.
And yes I sympathise with Langton... the sooner the Pauline Hansens Mark Lathams John Howards Scott Morrisons etc etc of this world move on out the better... they are nothing but a blight in this world. This world really needs less idiots right now. But sadly, these morons continue to spout their idiocies... add Warren Mundine Jacinta Price to that list too...

overthefalls Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:37pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

She's Aboriginal????

Mate i use to have dreads(semi's) and a nose ring, and a fkn hair braid thing with coloured beads in it, while living in a Kombi,(and a naive mind set almost the same as Southern Raw) i know feral trash when i see it, cause i use to be it.

Supa has shared post of hers before, dissing Jacinta but id never seen her pic or video, but all made sense when i saw her video.

Speaking of Jacinta Price, what do you think about her comment today that Aboriginal people have not being disadvantaged by colonialism? I see that as a huge blunder for her campaign, as her comments will put off a lot of no voters who disagree with her. Kinda like shooting herself in the foot I reckon.

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:39pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

She's Aboriginal????

Mate i use to have dreads(semi's) and a nose ring, and a fkn hair braid thing with coloured beads in it, while living in a Kombi,(and a naive mind set almost the same as Southern Raw) i know feral trash when i see it, cause i use to be it.

Supa has shared post of hers before, dissing Jacinta but id never seen her pic or video, but all made sense when i saw her video.

Haha Absolutely Classic... Indo outs himself as an image generated shell of a human being. He's still struggling with a respectable persona... just cant find. No doubt yr a climate changer denier Trumpian also... sounds like is all.

Supafreak Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:52pm

https://x.com/blaktruthbeck/status/1702246746922098903?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzX....” Mundine repeating comments made last year.
He is against the voice, but if it succeeds, he wants to be on it.
Well Warren, I reckon that will be hard because the voice will be elected by Indigenous people. We will remember how you threw us under a bus to further your own ambition “……..seriously how many FNP follow JP & Wazza ?

andy-mac Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:46pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
GuySmiley wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

Lower than the former PM who introduced but later denied responsibility for Robodebt which saw 100s of thousands of people being chased for debts they didn’t owe and some tragically killing themselves ? Lower than the former PM who is still suckling at the teat of a taxpayer funded position?

There is no depth @stu’s open minded and not blinded by ideology lil buddy will go to dredge up shit to hammer home a crass point for 1,000th time while ignoring the worst of politics and politicians this country has ever seen. You’re beyond wilfully ignorant

Gee's clutching at straws today Guy

Surely you can see the false equivalence here????

Its about intent.

A policy like robodebt or the pink batts scheme sadly both resulted in deaths, but that was not the intention of either scheme.

While the intent of Marcias tweet is quite clear.

And she has shown a pattern of behaviour over a number of years, so when she makes comments like she did in the past week, it's of no surprise, no matter how she tries to paint things.

BTW. If i had said similar thing, you would have a melt down, and mention it for years to come

Comparing Robodebt to Pink Batts is the stupidest most disingenuous thing I have seen in this thread... If that needs an explanation, you are a lost cause. FFS Robodebt resulted in people (1000's) in a deliberate scheme taking their own life over illegal issued debts. Pink Batts had some dodgy tradespeople that resulted in deaths. Fark if you cannot see the difference you are not a very critical thinker or brain washed numpty.
Congratulations you win the most ignorant comment of the year!!!!

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 7:48pm

overthefalls wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

She's Aboriginal????

Mate i use to have dreads(semi's) and a nose ring, and a fkn hair braid thing with coloured beads in it, while living in a Kombi,(and a naive mind set almost the same as Southern Raw) i know feral trash when i see it, cause i use to be it.

Supa has shared post of hers before, dissing Jacinta but id never seen her pic or video, but all made sense when i saw her video.

Speaking of Jacinta Price, what do you think about her comment today that Aboriginal people have not being disadvantaged by colonialism? I see that as a huge blunder for her campaign, as her comments will put off a lot of no voters who disagree with her. Kinda like shooting herself in the foot I reckon.

These are the kind of stupidities I'm talking about!! Like burley and indo, give them enough rope and they fukup eventually... stupidity just breeds further stupidities... look at the last LNP government... at first it's stupid but then it becomes a farce
J Price is reeeling in the big bucks... she wont bite the hand that feeds her... but her comments today shows stupidity turning into farce before our very eyes... just another overpaid idiot...(blackfellas i know call her a coconut).. nut hey haha

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:12pm

overthefalls wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

She's Aboriginal????

Mate i use to have dreads(semi's) and a nose ring, and a fkn hair braid thing with coloured beads in it, while living in a Kombi,(and a naive mind set almost the same as Southern Raw) i know feral trash when i see it, cause i use to be it.

Supa has shared post of hers before, dissing Jacinta but id never seen her pic or video, but all made sense when i saw her video.

Speaking of Jacinta Price, what do you think about her comment today that Aboriginal people have not being disadvantaged by colonialism? I see that as a huge blunder for her campaign, as her comments will put off a lot of no voters who disagree with her. Kinda like shooting herself in the foot I reckon.

Did you watch the video clip in the article?

Article made it sound bad, but in the video i think she made good points and handled it well especially the ending

If i was her advisor id have told her not to go there as a controversial view and not one that would benefit the No camp at this stage, but i if it gets media attention i dont think it will make much difference.

This isn't an election we aren't voting on the person or party, people arent going to be put off by things the No camp say, which is a very broad church from Jacinta to the opposite end Lidia thorpe.

However it doesn't work the other way, people undecided or soft yes voters can be put off by the things the Yes camp say because the voice is their product and what they have created and what they are selling so you need to have some degree of trust in those behind it.

I think Marcia Langton comments this week are more likely to swing votes from soft yes to soft No's or fence sitters to No's.

And i think once they are No's its hard to go back to a Yes, while soft Yes's can swing more easily to No's

We still have exactly a month to go so maybe a little early to call things, but at this stage i have a feeling that Marcia's comments are the final nail in the coffin for the Yes camp.

Maybe im wrong but i cant see how they can come back now and i think the polls will continue to have the same pattern

I think the final result isnt going to be close i think it will be between 65-70% in favour of No and only one state will be Yes with a chance all states are No.

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:29pm

andy-mac wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
GuySmiley wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

Lower than the former PM who introduced but later denied responsibility for Robodebt which saw 100s of thousands of people being chased for debts they didn’t owe and some tragically killing themselves ? Lower than the former PM who is still suckling at the teat of a taxpayer funded position?

There is no depth @stu’s open minded and not blinded by ideology lil buddy will go to dredge up shit to hammer home a crass point for 1,000th time while ignoring the worst of politics and politicians this country has ever seen. You’re beyond wilfully ignorant

Gee's clutching at straws today Guy

Surely you can see the false equivalence here????

Its about intent.

A policy like robodebt or the pink batts scheme sadly both resulted in deaths, but that was not the intention of either scheme.

While the intent of Marcias tweet is quite clear.

And she has shown a pattern of behaviour over a number of years, so when she makes comments like she did in the past week, it's of no surprise, no matter how she tries to paint things.

BTW. If i had said similar thing, you would have a melt down, and mention it for years to come

Comparing Robodebt to Pink Batts is the stupidest most disingenuous thing I have seen in this thread... If that needs an explanation, you are a lost cause. FFS Robodebt resulted in people (1000's) in a deliberate scheme taking their own life over illegal issued debts. Pink Batts had some dodgy tradespeople that resulted in deaths. Fark if you cannot see the difference you are not a very critical thinker or brain washed numpty.
Congratulations you win the most ignorant comment of the year!!!!

Um it was not a comparison and you clearly missed the point, both policies intention was not to harm people.

While Marcias comments are wishing people are dead pretty twisted fucked up shit from a so called leader, she is clearly a nasty bitter person.

all about intent.

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:14pm

harrycoopr wrote:
Why vote No?

... don't like Aboriginal people
... don't accept Australian history
... don't want Aboriginal people to access any power
... don't want Aboriginal people to determine their own lives
... want to continue disrespectful and racist differences and structural disadvantage.

Any other poor reasoning???

My original post when i decided to weigh in...
Then got accused of playing the race card...
I'm still waiting for burley and indo to add reasons for no... no they resorted to stupidities... accusing me of daydrinking (lol).
These are simple reasons... id like to hear more... perhaps too close to home for some??

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:23pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
overthefalls wrote:
Hey indo, why would you refer to that Aboriginal woman in such a derogatory manner? Was it her dreads? Her nose ring?

She's Aboriginal????

Mate i use to have dreads(semi's) and a nose ring, and a fkn hair braid thing with coloured beads in it, while living in a Kombi,(and a naive mind set almost the same as Southern Raw) i know feral trash when i see it, cause i use to be it.

Supa has shared post of hers before, dissing Jacinta but id never seen her pic or video, but all made sense when i saw her video.

Speaking of Jacinta Price, what do you think about her comment today that Aboriginal people have not being disadvantaged by colonialism? I see that as a huge blunder for her campaign, as her comments will put off a lot of no voters who disagree with her. Kinda like shooting herself in the foot I reckon.

Did you watch the video clip in the article?

Article made it sound bad, but in the video i think she made good points and handled it well especially the ending

If i was her advisor id have told her not to go there as a controversial view and not one that would benefit the No camp at this stage, but i if it gets media attention i dont think it will make much difference.

This isn't an election we aren't voting on the person or party, people arent going to be put off by things the No camp say, which is a very broad church from Jacinta to the opposite end Lidia thorpe.

However it doesn't work the other way, people undecided or soft yes voters can be put off by the things the Yes camp say because the voice is their product and what they have created and what they are selling so you need to have some degree of trust in those behind it.

I think Marcia Langton comments this week are more likely to swing votes from soft yes to soft No's or fence sitters to No's.

And i think once they are No's its hard to go back to a Yes, while soft Yes's can swing more easily to No's

We still have exactly a month to go so maybe a little early to call things, but at this stage i have a feeling that Marcia's comments are the final nail in the coffin for the Yes camp.

Maybe im wrong but i cant see how they can come back now and i think the polls will continue to have the same pattern

I think the final result isnt going to be close i think it will be between 65-70% in favour of No and only one state will be Yes with a chance all states are No.

This is what I'm talking about... it's not a product "we're " selling... it's been ASKED for BY ABORIGINAL PEOPLE. Uluru Statement of the Heart.
Why are the right always so mean and nasty and selfish, and, yes, stupid while the left support humanitarian goals and justice? Oh the humanity.

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:31pm

harrycoopr wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
Why vote No?

... don't like Aboriginal people
... don't accept Australian history
... don't want Aboriginal people to access any power
... don't want Aboriginal people to determine their own lives
... want to continue disrespectful and racist differences and structural disadvantage.

Any other poor reasoning???

My original post when i decided to weigh in...
Then got accused of playing the race card...
I'm still waiting for burley and indo to add reasons for no... no they resorted to stupidities... accusing me of daydrinking (lol).
These are simple reasons... id like to hear more... perhaps too close to home for some??

Firstly they are NOT reasons ive ever seen or heard a no voter suggest(more than half of Australia), you are either brain dead or just trolling. (i think a little of both)

And i already gave you proper reasons.

indo-dreaming wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
burleigh wrote:
Hiccups wrote:
burleigh wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
Why vote No?

... don't like Aboriginal people
... don't accept Australian history
... don't want Aboriginal people to access any power
... don't want Aboriginal people to determine their own lives
... want to continue disrespectful and racist differences and structural disadvantage.

Any other poor reasoning???

Turn off the TV Harry. That’s embarrassing

Burleigh is such a simple fella, that he thinks everyone that he disagrees with gets all their opinions from television.

No hiccup, Harrys views on why people will vote no is exactly what the TV wants you to believe.

I'm voting No and it's NOTHING to do with race and not wanting indigenous people to thrive.

Ok Burleigh... why u voting no? At least Yes opens up possibilities...No just shuts everything down. And Dutton is the embarrassment here...what an idiot.
But please Burleigh... please enlighten us as to why u a no go... what logical reason am I missing? (Please give me some credit for my own critical thinking)

Firstly its not up to the No camp to provided a reason to vote against it, its up to the Yes camp to provide proper decent reasons to vote for it, and polls are showing they havent provided this.

A few reasons to vote No

1. The basic moral aspect of equality and not dividing us and rights based on race, a proper democracy has, one person=one vote=one influence on matters, not one vote for some and one vote, plus extra influence for others, especially through people that havent even been democratically elected.

2. There is zero reason for the voice to be in the constitution, it could be legislated as policy tomorrow, if it was nobody loses anything and it comes with no risk.

3. It's much more than just about voice, it's really a whole package no matter if Albo admits it or not, Voice-Treaty-So called truth telling, and its driven by activist some clearly full of hate wanting some weird type of revenge

I mean fuck just look at the lyrics from that clown above, its the same hate that people like Southernraw peddle.

Especially this lyric "Turn that flag to a noose, put a cease to your breathin"

Yeah sure he aint involved in this, but its the same mindset, you only have to listen to those like Thomas Mayo or Teela Reid dare i even say Marcia Langton to some extent.

4. Nothing should be put in the constitution unless its a 100% known improvement, and this is an unknown but what we do know is all previous federal advisory bodies have been problematic full of issues, putting something so unproven and untested in the constitution is down right crazy.

5. The complexity of it's reach politically and legally is disputed but it does come with unknown's and risk, all made much worse by it's poor structure and lack of detail, one thing for certain though having direct access to parliament pretty much unlimited funding with no fear of being removed and if it got up backed by the Aus public, means it would wield much political power, as Thomas Mayo says it would be a brave government that doesn't listen and he also said they will make politicians pay

BTW. Your other post today had to just be a troll, nobody could take that seriously, maybe there is some No voters somewhere voting for those reasons, but ive never heard those reasons before.

andy-mac Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:33pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
andy-mac wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
GuySmiley wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
Im not a fan of Latham, but even if you wanted to believe or argue the aspects are true, saying someone deserves a "slow painful death" even in a private setting is low,

But being somebody in the public eye like Marcia and putting it out there publicly including tagging the person in the post is pretty much as low as you can get.

Lower than the former PM who introduced but later denied responsibility for Robodebt which saw 100s of thousands of people being chased for debts they didn’t owe and some tragically killing themselves ? Lower than the former PM who is still suckling at the teat of a taxpayer funded position?

There is no depth @stu’s open minded and not blinded by ideology lil buddy will go to dredge up shit to hammer home a crass point for 1,000th time while ignoring the worst of politics and politicians this country has ever seen. You’re beyond wilfully ignorant

Gee's clutching at straws today Guy

Surely you can see the false equivalence here????

Its about intent.

A policy like robodebt or the pink batts scheme sadly both resulted in deaths, but that was not the intention of either scheme.

While the intent of Marcias tweet is quite clear.

And she has shown a pattern of behaviour over a number of years, so when she makes comments like she did in the past week, it's of no surprise, no matter how she tries to paint things.

BTW. If i had said similar thing, you would have a melt down, and mention it for years to come

Comparing Robodebt to Pink Batts is the stupidest most disingenuous thing I have seen in this thread... If that needs an explanation, you are a lost cause. FFS Robodebt resulted in people (1000's) in a deliberate scheme taking their own life over illegal issued debts. Pink Batts had some dodgy tradespeople that resulted in deaths. Fark if you cannot see the difference you are not a very critical thinker or brain washed numpty.
Congratulations you win the most ignorant comment of the year!!!!

Um you missed the point, both policies intention was not to harm people.

While Marcias comments are wishing people are dead pretty twisted fucked up shit from a so called leader, she is clearly a nasty bitter person.

all about intent.

No!! Robodebt was intentional, and the LNP govt knew people were killing themselves but carried on regardless and in fact doubled down on the scheme. If some do not go to jail for manslaughter, then it is a major miscarriage of justice. Won't happen I know, but in fair world, Morrison, Tudge and Robert and others would be looking at jail terms.
Wonder who has been named in sealed section?
Fark, you defend some dispicable people mate.

indo-dreaming Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:37pm

FFS.

truebluebasher Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:42pm

Jacinta loses her Voice at Press Club.
Can't answer any Taboo Questions...
[L] Voice Reffo
[L] Voice Constitution
[L] Voice Legislation
She never has answers only spews Venom...we all get that & none expected respect or substance!

However! None of this is the weirdest part of this Press Club gig...
Anyone pick the Major Anomaly!
Just wondering where & how Westpac sponsor the NO Ice Queen...

Westpac own sponsorship rights $3m or $1m/yr [W] Press Club Prized Lectern
Westpac also donate $2m [Yes] Voice

Pollies in Parliament & Westpac Showcases their $5m Voldemort's Viperess
tbb is not surprised...just wondering how a Bank bankrolls Peak Voice $5m to lead [NO] Leader.
Also wonderin' how none see this as News when [NO] camp skim the cream from [YES] Bank Vault.
Or maybe that was Westpac's Grand Plan!

Pretty good plan coz only a neutral tbb picks up this loose change = $5m [NO] Holy Grail gifted for free!
tbb checked : Every Media is relaying Peak Campaign $5m [W] = Price [NO]

Pause...
Price has her Jackboots on feeble [YES] throats...they can't breathe...
She waltzes into the YES Vault sits in their Throne & commands their ring tones & farts in their faces!

See That Gromz...see how these fuckin' stupid wealthiest Corps fall on the swords!
As said ...for $5m Jacinta got everything & gave nothing at all in return...

Now ask yerself crew...who outside of this forum would even notice, like forever & still be like...durr!
Also ask how #1 Oz Media units present can't stare at this for 30mins without bangin' their foreheads.
They're either all asleep / stupid or in on the game! (Well done crew...tbb agrees ~ All three!)

Really want tbb to say it...they're all too fuckin' stupid to vote...well, aren't they!
Qld Health banned tbb from Chair / Secretary / Voting...not of sound mind!
Where does that leave this lot of Press Club experts...Huh!

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 8:56pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
Why vote No?

... don't like Aboriginal people
... don't accept Australian history
... don't want Aboriginal people to access any power
... don't want Aboriginal people to determine their own lives
... want to continue disrespectful and racist differences and structural disadvantage.

Any other poor reasoning???

My original post when i decided to weigh in...
Then got accused of playing the race card...
I'm still waiting for burley and indo to add reasons for no... no they resorted to stupidities... accusing me of daydrinking (lol).
These are simple reasons... id like to hear more... perhaps too close to home for some??

Firstly they are NOT reasons ive ever seen or heard a no voter suggest(more than half of Australia), you are either brain dead or just trolling. (i think a little of both)

And i already gave you proper reasons.

indo-dreaming wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
burleigh wrote:
Hiccups wrote:
burleigh wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
Why vote No?

... don't like Aboriginal people
... don't accept Australian history
... don't want Aboriginal people to access any power
... don't want Aboriginal people to determine their own lives
... want to continue disrespectful and racist differences and structural disadvantage.

Any other poor reasoning???

Turn off the TV Harry. That’s embarrassing

Burleigh is such a simple fella, that he thinks everyone that he disagrees with gets all their opinions from television.

No hiccup, Harrys views on why people will vote no is exactly what the TV wants you to believe.

I'm voting No and it's NOTHING to do with race and not wanting indigenous people to thrive.

Ok Burleigh... why u voting no? At least Yes opens up possibilities...No just shuts everything down. And Dutton is the embarrassment here...what an idiot.
But please Burleigh... please enlighten us as to why u a no go... what logical reason am I missing? (Please give me some credit for my own critical thinking)

Firstly its not up to the No camp to provided a reason to vote against it, its up to the Yes camp to provide proper decent reasons to vote for it, and polls are showing they havent provided this.

A few reasons to vote No

1. The basic moral aspect of equality and not dividing us and rights based on race, a proper democracy has, one person=one vote=one influence on matters, not one vote for some and one vote, plus extra influence for others, especially through people that havent even been democratically elected.

2. There is zero reason for the voice to be in the constitution, it could be legislated as policy tomorrow, if it was nobody loses anything and it comes with no risk.

3. It's much more than just about voice, it's really a whole package no matter if Albo admits it or not, Voice-Treaty-So called truth telling, and its driven by activist some clearly full of hate wanting some weird type of revenge

I mean fuck just look at the lyrics from that clown above, its the same hate that people like Southernraw peddle.

Especially this lyric "Turn that flag to a noose, put a cease to your breathin"

Yeah sure he aint involved in this, but its the same mindset, you only have to listen to those like Thomas Mayo or Teela Reid dare i even say Marcia Langton to some extent.

4. Nothing should be put in the constitution unless its a 100% known improvement, and this is an unknown but what we do know is all previous federal advisory bodies have been problematic full of issues, putting something so unproven and untested in the constitution is down right crazy.

5. The complexity of it's reach politically and legally is disputed but it does come with unknown's and risk, all made much worse by it's poor structure and lack of detail, one thing for certain though having direct access to parliament pretty much unlimited funding with no fear of being removed and if it got up backed by the Aus public, means it would wield much political power, as Thomas Mayo says it would be a brave government that doesn't listen and he also said they will make politicians pay

BTW. Your other post today had to just be a troll, nobody could take that seriously, maybe there is some No voters somewhere voting for those reasons, but ive never heard those reasons before.

These aren't reasons... they're just more ignorant stupidities. Go back to yr dreadies and Kombi will ya.

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 9:05pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
FFS.

Honestly indo yr not doing yrself any favours... the LNP were hassling people no end as AndyMac states... that was intentional harm... they didnt give a fuk.
This is what im saying... you just come out with more stupidity. Sorry but I got to call it out. At least burley knows when to pull his head in...

seeds Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 9:19pm

Today Jacinta claims ‘ there are no negative ongoing impacts of British colonisation on Indigenous Australians’
And
Warren says ‘ Asked by reporters in Canberra if he was still considering seeking a position on the Voice, Mr Mundine said: “If yes gets up, sure”.

“I’ll be there to make sure that we do fix the issues that are plaguing Aboriginal communities,” Mr Mundine said.

FFS Opti’s saviour wept

burleigh Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 9:56pm

harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
FFS.

Honestly indo yr not doing yrself any favours... the LNP were hassling people no end as AndyMac states... that was intentional harm... they didnt give a fuk.
This is what im saying... you just come out with more stupidity. Sorry but I got to call it out. At least burley knows when to pull his head in...

Pull my head in? I told you i'm out of the discussion with you because you're either drunk, stupid or probably both.

I'm not engaging in your rubbish, because it's................ rubbish.

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 10:01pm

seeds wrote:
Today Jacinta claims ‘ there are no negative ongoing impacts of British colonisation on Indigenous Australians’
And
Warren says ‘ Asked by reporters in Canberra if he was still considering seeking a position on the Voice, Mr Mundine said: “If yes gets up, sure”.

“I’ll be there to make sure that we do fix the issues that are plaguing Aboriginal communities,” Mr Mundine said.

FFS Opti’s saviour wept

Insanity. They lie to themselves and believe it. Trying to understand them and ppl like indo is like trying to understand why ppl support Trump. It's not just that he lies or that he's a bully or that he's corrupt as they come... any reasonable sensible rational person can see he's an ugly human being... and yet ppl love him!!
Overwhelming the majority of Aboriginal people want a Voice. And yet people say No, the LNP say no... they say it's divisive and yet it's them dividing by saying No!!! Work that out. As indo says FFS... As Trump says Grab em by the ()...

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 10:02pm

burleigh wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
FFS.

Honestly indo yr not doing yrself any favours... the LNP were hassling people no end as AndyMac states... that was intentional harm... they didnt give a fuk.
This is what im saying... you just come out with more stupidity. Sorry but I got to call it out. At least burley knows when to pull his head in...

Pull my head in? I told you i'm out of the discussion with you because you're either drunk, stupid or probably both.

I'm not engaging in your rubbish, because it's................ rubbish.

Pull ya head in ya dope

harrycoopr Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 10:32pm

harrycoopr wrote:
burleigh wrote:
harrycoopr wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
FFS.

Honestly indo yr not doing yrself any favours... the LNP were hassling people no end as AndyMac states... that was intentional harm... they didnt give a fuk.
This is what im saying... you just come out with more stupidity. Sorry but I got to call it out. At least burley knows when to pull his head in...

Pull my head in? I told you i'm out of the discussion with you because you're either drunk, stupid or probably both.

I'm not engaging in your rubbish, because it's................ rubbish.

Pull ya head in ya dope

Actually burleigh just seen in another thread yr bizarre views. Pls don't engage with me anymore... you've proven yr stupidity well and truly now... it's now plainly obvious. Just try and get educated at some stage... please.

Reform Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 11:05pm

I think empathy alongside pragmatism is key for the common good of our society and for casting a positive vote in this referendum. In this case it is for a marginalised society, a society that has so much to offer, so much to give and to share, If we don’t allow their voice, how are we to learn from them what it is that they know, for they know much. Much more than we will ever know or think that we know, true.

I cannot see that the detractors contributing on this forum have empathy, even though they proclaim it to the high heavens. “We have empathy!”
They’ll say that this is not the reason, for their putting up the closed sign, sorry sir, madam.. but we’re CLOSED!  No entry here… only whitish people are allowed here, You’re not part of our club.. Well…okay..okay! You can come in but… I’m watching you, and don’t try to trick me because you know, I don’t want.. Like you know.. To be trapped in all, you know.. Deceived and misled or betrayed or hoodwinked, sorry but I just don’t trust you, just so… I don’t know…I really don’t know.. It’s just so, But just quietly, I feel pretty good about myself…I don’t know.. it’s not fear or anything.. it’s just so! “But YES,Im against it!”

So I just wonder how many of you ‘fear driven’ detractors have ventured out at first light the day after a massive storm swell at Uluwatu. Positioned yourself well, mid-field to negotiate the take-off on an 8ft plus wedge at the wonderful Uluwatu peak on a high tide..Then taken the drop, while drawing out the bottom turn observing how the smooth faced wave 15-20 metres in front of you has a defined thickened volumed section that is the backdoor section and as it thickens some more and takes shape begins to stand up straight (12ft face) signaling its intention to pitch, You can feel the energy and strength of the ocean, so much water moving. You set your line and sit tight as you cling to the fast moving vertical face with the water pulling off the reef, the perfect almond shape cylinder is formed and the lip throws itself over you, the sound of the lip hitting water is crisp and thunderous as the backwater begins to mist up your whole room space inside the barrel! Vision is lost, arms outstretched feeling for the exit, only finding it many more seconds later than you anticipated, but you made it through with feet firmly in place on your chosen and cherished gun. Stoked out of your mind!
I just wonder if you guys ventured at all? You have it in you to do it, throw caution to the wind and be generous to yourself and others, If not that.. Then do for this cause and be that hero! Thanks.

Rabbits68 Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 11:07pm

Thanks Reform. I’ve enjoyed reading your posts in this thread. I’m with you. BTW that’s the first time I’ve ever felt so close to being locked inside a solid Ulus pit & then so magnificently been let out. I was there.

zenagain Thursday, 14 Sep 2023 at 11:29pm

Ha! I've never been there but I was there.

That was really nicely written.

truebluebasher Friday, 15 Sep 2023 at 8:48am

Reform can lock tbb in...just waitin' on the Qld Police Check!
Gun Permit takes 3 business days & Polls close Monday...put tbb down for a head dip!

burleigh Friday, 15 Sep 2023 at 8:59am

View this post on Instagram

suprusty Friday, 15 Sep 2023 at 10:12am

" a sense of despair" & "I want to help" are the impressions that were made on me after having a good look at my concerns about the Voice. Originally 80/20 No, is now 90/10 Yes.

Point (iii) of the Voice Fact Sheet that Supa provided the link to the other day eased those "what if it doesn't work, all turns to shit, radical recommendations" type concerns that I had i.e. Parliament can intervene. Its not something I have great confidence in but at least its available.

Then I went to the human aspect where Despair kicked in. Its pretty clear that there's an awful lot of people living with a sense of despair. Why would I want someone to live like that? Adding greater transparency to existing methods may give someone a better standard of living but will it ease a sense of despair? will it foster a sense of value, dignity? A Yes vote might.

There's plenty of people wanting to help, smart ones too - the Statement from Heart, Voice creators down to those participating in electing representatives. It'll be complicated and a tuff slog but their willing to take it on. Why would I want to stop them?

There's plenty of ways to skin a cat (apologies to cat lovers). The current methods have got us to where we are to day which is not working the best. Why continue with them?

I'm glad I took the time to really think about it & would recommend to anyone who doesn't yet have a firm opinion to do so. Don't leave it till voting day - there's an awful lot of stuff to sift through.

Any chance I've converted you guys to riding SUP's? ....... Just taking the piss!

cheers

waveman Friday, 15 Sep 2023 at 10:16am

AlfredWallace wrote:
waveman.

What about we frame it this way.

‘Mass Aboriginal deaths on pastoral (stolen Aboriginal) land’ , they probably never had access to water…..basic food, basic human rights.

I think we all (hope) value a persons life over a fucking environmentally unfriendly animal that should never have been proliferated on Australian soil. If you want to know why, just ask, but if you are a farmer, you wouldn’t be interested one iota, because you are still stuck in your own archaic ways from your father, his father and so on from the time FNP were evicted from their land. You lot make my blood boil. Please respond so i can show you photos of what farming is really like. AW.

So what you’re saying is, lots of dead cattle is actually ok…because they’re not people….right….

By downplaying this catastrophe, like you’ve just done here, you do aboriginal people no favours. You attempt to void them of any responsibility in this. This strategy of ignoring, not talking about and diversion away from any kind of aboriginal misbehaviour/mismanagement serves only to perpetuate the problems.

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The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices

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