All Things Religion Thread
bonza wrote:blackers wrote:bonza wrote:blackers wrote:bonza wrote:basesix wrote:king hit, bro.
Thank you. I’m fuckn good at em I reckon. Let me know when your ready for round 2.
Twat.
Ha. Is that all you got? Put your back into it son.
Why bother, you dull, reactionary fool? Stick to whining in the pub to your "mate" about wokeness. Enjoy yer evening.
When did I ever say wokeness? Prove it? You just don’t like me cause I remind you of your dad. Sorry.
Bonza, let's call a spade a spade. My old man is 91. You do not remind me of him. I respect him because he visits his wife of 65 years, who is care following a stroke, every day. Even though she pays out on him because he didn't and she did. He has antiquated views because he is 91. You? Well, who knows, your choice. King hit? Tough talk, easy on an anonymous forum. No respect for that. No need to abuse because you feel superior. Maybe just leave it to being a warm inner glow of self righteous twatery.
^^ good on you blackers.
Back to the genocide and murderous slaughter of innocent people https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/aug/10/israel-gaza-war-schoo...
epic thread. my take away from @bonza wisdom: not personally having livestock but having a neighbor let his livestock onto my land, makes me a) grateful b) somehow pretending I am a farmer. Bonza thinks 'b'. I'm going to sleep on it, and watch the olympic basketball final with my son at 5am.
@Basesix,
Yo bro.
The fuel light quandary.
Gotta be the tank sensor, maybe a fuse or wire, but I'd bet it's the tank sensor.
Google it, I bet there is a video of how to get to it.
Probably just needs a clean.
No need to thank me.
I'll invoice you.
thanks @adam : )
here's a christian rap for @Optimist, a little stagnant and pedestrian, but not bad flow.
2 Timothy 2 : 15 KJV
cheers @Opti, proudly be yourself, too (NIV).
OMG
You have a Bonza setup , Base 6 .
A Collins St Farmer , that's moved out of Collins St , perhaps :)) ?
What a cool life !
Bonza seems 2 think everyone , has a Glass Jaw and he's heavy weight champion lol !
Bon Chance Bonza , with all the Round and Rounds .
Have a great Sunday , Opti !
Nearly everyone believes that there is something Greater , than themselves .
Another Hamas commander taken out yesterday
indo-dreaming wrote:Another Hamas commander taken out yesterday
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLA3ws-6qPU&t=214s
Schwing!
Pop Down wrote:OMG
You have a Bonza setup , Base 6 .
A Collins St Farmer , that's moved out of Collins St , perhaps :)) ?
What a cool life !
Bonza seems 2 think everyone , has a Glass Jaw and he's heavy weight champion lol !
Bon Chance Bonza , with all the Round and Rounds .
Have a great Sunday , Opti !
Nearly everyone believes that there is something Greater , than themselves .
Hey thar PoppaD, I'm just a Hallet Cove grom that decided to raise kids on an isolated bush block between Adelaide and Melbs.. best decision ever. (Bonza was bonza last night, just like my millionaire pubs (ha!) the highlight is when someone who has been on the turps all arvo wanders down to the local in tracky daks at 11pm to show the half-dozen at the bar how big his chips are.)
Looks a hella sunday to throw a line in off the Portsea West rocks, and catch a table fish.
blackers wrote:bonza wrote:blackers wrote:bonza wrote:blackers wrote:bonza wrote:basesix wrote:king hit, bro.
Thank you. I’m fuckn good at em I reckon. Let me know when your ready for round 2.
Twat.
Ha. Is that all you got? Put your back into it son.
Why bother, you dull, reactionary fool? Stick to whining in the pub to your "mate" about wokeness. Enjoy yer evening.
When did I ever say wokeness? Prove it? You just don’t like me cause I remind you of your dad. Sorry.
Bonza, let's call a spade a spade. My old man is 91. You do not remind me of him. I respect him because he visits his wife of 65 years, who is care following a stroke, every day. Even though she pays out on him because he didn't and she did. He has antiquated views because he is 91. You? Well, who knows, your choice. King hit? Tough talk, easy on an anonymous forum. No respect for that. No need to abuse because you feel superior. Maybe just leave it to being a warm inner glow of self righteous twatery.
Just been down that road with my in-laws in their 90's the last few years. Married for 65 years, one in care then the other. Both gone now.
Tough times take care.
indo-dreaming wrote:Another Hamas commander taken out yesterday
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLA3ws-6qPU&t=214s
Hope you had your splash guard up Indo.
You don’t have to have morals, you just need to say you do.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/article/2024/aug/10/penny-won...
This should whip you into a frenzy Indo, don’t skin yourself.
soggydog wrote:You don’t have to have morals, you just need to say you do.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/article/2024/aug/10/penny-won...This should whip you into a frenzy Indo, don’t skin yourself.
Why would it?
You would expect nothing less from someone like Penny Wrong or or many leaders of the same ilk.
The world has just become a very strange place.
Hope you didn't lose too many tears over another death of another of your Hamas boys though?
Hamas leaders dropping like flies.
Dont forget to drink lots of water to rehydrate after all that crying.
indo-dreaming wrote:soggydog wrote:You don’t have to have morals, you just need to say you do.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/article/2024/aug/10/penny-won...This should whip you into a frenzy Indo, don’t skin yourself.
Why would it?
You would expect nothing less from someone like Penny Wrong or or many leaders of the same ilk.
The world has just become a very strange place.
Hope you didn't lose too many tears over another death of another of your Hamas boys though?
Hamas leaders dropping like flies.
Dont forget to drink lots of water to rehydrate after all that crying.
Oh I forgot, in your mind starving 2 million civilians is just good tactics, how fast should they do it, and like the Israeli minister making the comments do you think this is a moral step. I’m not crying over anything. I’m here to point out how much of a depraved retarded cowardly sock cunt you are. Crank on cranky, I’m sure the IDF have snipered a kid you can wank yourself off to. Come on edumacate us.
indo-dreaming wrote:soggydog wrote:You don’t have to have morals, you just need to say you do.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/article/2024/aug/10/penny-won...This should whip you into a frenzy Indo, don’t skin yourself.
Why would it?
You would expect nothing less from someone like Penny Wrong or or many leaders of the same ilk.
The world has just become a very strange place.
Hope you didn't lose too many tears over another death of another of your Hamas boys though?
Hamas leaders dropping like flies.
Dont forget to drink lots of water to rehydrate after all that crying.
Oh I forgot, in your mind starving 2 million civilians is just good tactics, how fast should they do it, and like the Israeli minister making the comments do you think this is a moral step. I’m not crying over anything. I’m here to point out how much of a depraved retarded cowardly sick cunt you are. Crank on cranky, I’m sure the IDF have snipered a kid you can wank yourself off to. Come on edumacate us.
Blah blah blah, anyway who knows Iran might strike soon and you might be able to celebrate something for once.
#ChickensrallyingformoreKFCstores. #toolofhamas #suckerofjihadistpropaganda #undergroundmilatarybasearethesameasterrortunnellsundercivilianareas #Hamasarenowgoodguyscausetheychangedtheircharter #Suckerborneveryminute.
https://m.
And @indo
Why would Hamas have a command centre in a school when they have underground tunnels everywhere....,???
Keep cheer leading the killers of kids dude....
andy-mac wrote:And @indo
Why would Hamas have a command centre in a school when they have underground tunnels everywhere....,???
Keep cheer leading the killers of kids dude....
This is the problem with people like that just dont bother to educate themselves and have very little understanding of practical aspects or a war zone or military aspects of a war.
Yes there is a shit load of tunnels riddled through Gaza they are used to move around and take shelter when needed by hamas fighters (off limits to civilians though) and are used to protect ammunition, even rockets etc and at the start of the war they were used for holding prisoners and for hamas to use as bases, and in some rare cases still might be.
However the war has been going on for ten months, ten months is a long time to stay underground 24/7, and you need electricity and water in a dark tunnel for lights and ventilation etc.
Ten months in these things are much harder to get and things like fuel for generators limited it's much easier to stay above ground when needed and use natural ventilation and light.
If you have kept up with the stories or rescue's of those kidnapped while some had been moved at times via tunnels and even spent time in tunnels most have been kept above ground in houses etc again because its much more practicable.
As we all know Hamas use civilian's as human shields where possible, so an empty building is not a very good place for Hamas to base themselves because if IDF got intel they would just take them out with no civilian deaths, which you wouldnt care to. much about.
Mixing themselves in with civilian's makes it far far harder for the IDF to target Hamas, it means to take them out they must also take out some civilians, which then see's people like you lose their shit and start simping for Hamas.
The impact is even bigger when an attack is attached to a name like a school, mosque, hospital, even so called refugee camps (generally just neighborhoods's where decedents of refugees live) it makes a much better news story and gets wacko's like you and soggy simping for Hamas and tirnig on Israel.
You guys are basically tools/pawns of hamas.
#braindeadignorathamassupporters
Yeah Andy you just don’t understand the practical aspects of starving civilians and bombing schools. And if you head over to Indo’s he’ll teach you how to crank to murder porn. And explain the practicalities of the whole process. Lobotomies optional But highly recommended.
"...use civilian's as human shields where possible" ;);)
- hmmmmm :
https://m.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-808544#google_vignette
Apparently this is balanced and in good faith…….
@indo” The impact is even bigger when an attack is attached to a name like a school, mosque, hospital, even so called refugee camps (generally just neighborhoods's where decedents of refugees live)”
The words that make good murder.
Jelly Flater wrote:"...use civilian's as human shields where possible" ;);)
- hmmmmm :https://m.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-808544#google_vignette
Ha ha yeah like that is going to deter hamas from taking out IDF.
Sorry dude but it just doesnt work the other way around, we all know Hamas dont value their own civilian's lifes even their fellow fighters, this would have zero deterrent factor and nobody/media is going to care if Hamas shot IDF even with Hamas on the bonnet.
But hey you keep ignoring the 99.9% of war crimes committed by Hamas and group's like Palestine Islamic Jihad and keep clutching at the 0.1% of rare incident that go the other way.
Anything that helps justify your hate for Jews and Israel.
Using human shields is not the same as when hamas does it JF. Same as subterranean tunnels made of concrete and steel housing military installations are different.
Just finished my second surf for the day while Indo’s been cranking’ it over death & destruction.
No point trying to appeal to better judgment. Morally corrupt cowardly cunt.
;)
- then and now ;);)
"..... Mr.Hasbara. Bibi truly believes that a good speech, emphasizing the right core messages, is a remedy for every predicament. His last “talks like a duck” speech at AIPAC was a propagandist masterpiece, that got the audience engaged in a virtual fitness program of endless standing ovations, but it did not stop Iran’s nuclear ambitions, or give us the political space to act on it ourselves. At most he succeeded in insulting the ducks.
Bibi is only a symptom of our Hasbara Syndrome – when a lieutenant-colonel brutally beats an unarmed Danish protester, the country laments the damage to hasbara and not the moral predicament; when we send rescue missions to international disaster areas, such as Haiti, the focus is on the hasbara dividend more than on the tragedy."
https://m.jpost.com/opinion/columnists/savirs-corner-the-hasbara-syndrome
Remember drink lots of water to rehydrate after those tears.
BTW. Notice how many are also "Palestine Islamic Jihad" members.
Can it get any more clearer in what you guys support "ISLAMIC JIHAD"
Let it bounce around in those hollow heads and maybe one day it will lodge on to a lone brain cell, and you might have a little ..."oh okay" moment.
The misses must be doing a double shift on the triple time earning the moneeeeyyyy
- hahaha so..... ummm after more weird arse assumptions about ppl supporting islamic jihad blah blah... and hommus blah blah blah, and drying tears haha wtf wow zingaaaaa ;)
& recently throwing out false accusations about ppl posting using multiple sn accounts with different apparent names??
...and then assuming ppl here also don't know about farkn pogroms and thinking that cutting and pasting sadistic persecution shit on an internet forum (that most ppl already learnt about in the farkn 80's at school), whilst telling other ppl to get educated on things n stuff hahaha
- farkn hell, you're burning up like bozo last nite goin all huff and puff and blow yaself up haha
...take us back to the 80's again noinfo u vunderful intewigent vormunger ;);)
https://m.
&pp=ygUMY3J5aW5nIHNoYW1l reckon I've watched shuck 5 times since you posted it. who is saying goodbye to who; leading a loved one to the next phase. does it matter.. cool as, @Jelly. tots religion relevant.
oldy, but goody (society, tree, plant, shade, sit.. pick your phrasing):
@Indo"This is the problem with people like that just dont bother to educate themselves and have very little understanding of practical aspects or a war zone or military aspects of a war."
And the problem with you, self appointed military expert is that you don't understand anything about insurgency and counterinsurgency.
Very few counterinsurgencies in history have proved successful based on only military measures.
To achieve success you have to also provide the other two pillars of COIN to the insurgent population, economic and political. Israel is not doing this which is why they will never defeat Hamas as an insurgent force.
So far, despite the civilian death toll and Israel's claims of success in killing Hamas leaders and soldiers, of the 24 Qassam Brigades, only 3 have been classified as combat ineffective, others have been degraded but are still capable of guerilla attacks, and 8 are still combat effective. Of the 16 battalions in the northern part of Gaza, 7 have been able to reconstitute in the last six months.
"US military experts....said that Israel's prosecution of the war, defined by a heavy-handed bombing campaign, and the absence of a post-war plan has helped trigger Hamas' resurgence.
There has been evidence of that resurgence in key flashpoints. In Jabalya refugee camp, Israel said it returned in May to “fierce” resistance from three Hamas battalions, despite having devastated the area in a nearly three-month bombing campaign in the fall. And Israel has staged four incursions in Gaza City’s Zeitoun neighborhood, according to the analyses.
“If the Hamas battalions were largely destroyed, Israeli forces wouldn’t still be fighting,”
said retired US Army Col. Peter Mansoor, “The fact that they’re still in Gaza, still trying to rout out elements of the Hamas battalions shows me that Prime Minister Netanyahu is wrong,” he added. “The ability of Hamas to reconstitute its fighting forces is undiminished.”
In May, Secretary of State Antony Blinken warned that the upcoming Israeli offensive in Rafah, where around 1.5 million internally displaced people had settled, could incur an “incredibly high cost to civilians” and leave Israel with an “enduring insurgency.” Without a plan to replace Hamas, Blinken said, Gaza would be left with a “vacuum” likely to be filled “by chaos, by anarchy, and ultimately by Hamas again.”
"On January 7, the Israeli military said it had dismantled Hamas’ command structure in northern Gaza.
Within days, however, there were reports of attacks on Israeli patrols in eastern parts of Gaza City. Videos in the weeks that followed showed Hamas fighters apparently emerging from beneath the rubble, likely from the sprawling tunnel network that crisscrosses the territory."
The killings that give you such a hard on @Indo, won't defeat Hamas. In fact, they achieve the opposite because Israel is conducting a half arsed counter insurgency. Any leaders or soldiers are simply replaced, Israel's barbarism has only strengthened the number of Palestinians willing to take up arms.
"Irregular warfare is far more intellectual than a bayonet charge."
--T.E. Lawrence
"The shooting side of the business is only 25% of the trouble and other 75% lies in getting the people of the country behind us."
--Field Marshal Sir Gerald Templer
"Counterinsurgency is the use of all elements of a nation's power—including not only combined-arms operations but also psychological, political, economic, intelligence, and diplomatic operations—to defeat an insurgency. "
Unless Israel offers the Palestinians a post conflict future that can win over the population against Hamas it's just a slaughterfest that will achieve nothing and will in fact make Israel more vulnerable to attack.
"The "Laws"
According to Galula, there are four "laws" of counterinsurgency.
1 The first law is that the population is paramount. That is, the support of the people is the primary objective of a counterinsurgency campaign. Without the support of the population, it is impossible to root out all the insurgents and stop further recruitment.
2 Such support is most readily obtained from an active minority. Those willing to actively support a counterinsurgency operation should be supported in their efforts to rally the relatively neutral majority and neutralize the hostile minority.
3 Having attained the support of the population it is imperative to remember that this support is conditional. What you do matters, and support can be lost if your actions are unfavorable to the population.
4 The fourth and final law of counterinsurgency regards the "intensity of effort and vastness of means." Because counterinsurgency requires a large concentration of effort, resources,and personnel, it is unlikely that it can be pursued effectively everywhere at once. Rather, action should be taken in select areas, and resources moved as needed. Thus, according to the laws of counterinsurgency, it is important to continuously make efforts at gaining and maintaining the support of the populace in distinct areas by leveraging an active minority."
Israel should have held back on destroying Gaza, got it's hostages back, conducted precision kills on Hamas leadership as they have only now begun doing and exploited the dissatisfaction of everyday Palestinians with Hamas, which was prevalent prior to this conflict, offering them economic and political incentives to revolt against Hamas.
That's how to defeat Hamas.
They've blown that chance now.
And you can rip up the Abraham Accords.
This whole thing has left them isolated, a pariah State, and awaiting nothing but further attack, perhaps forever.
https://www.beyondintractability.org/bksum/galula-counterinsurgency
https://www.moore.army.mil/mssp/Counterinsurgency/
https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2024/08/middleeast/gaza-israel-hamas...
The problem with you Indo is you think you know it all, well one of the problems anyway.
And the childish hashtags, FMD.
"Military expert" pfft.
Have a read of what the actual experts say about how to conduct counterinsurgency operations, the Joint Chiefs of Staff of the US Military, from hard lessons learned in part from their own failed COINs like Vietnam, and the USSR in Afghanistan.
https://www.jcs.mil/Portals/36/Documents/Doctrine/pubs/jp3_24.pdf
The IDF's own intelligence assessments are that they cannot defeat Hamas, it is an exercise in revenge killing and genocide, and it will fail because it is only a military operation, and try as they might, they can't kill all the Palestinians.
I'm no expert in urban warfare, counterinsurgency, or military operations.
Nor are you.
The difference is I don't claim to be one.
And I don't get off on killings either, unlike you.
basesix wrote:reckon I've watched shuck 5 times since you posted it. who is saying goodbye to who; leading a loved one to the next phase. does it matter.. cool as, @Jelly. tots religion relevant.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbmVhb1-fPg
Yep. Gets you thinking. Apply one’s own interpretation to. Malleable. Calming.
Heya all. Just a quick post to apologize to Stu. Ben amd Craig for my posts yesterday.
Was way below the standard of acceptable conduct and i apologize to the site owners, and all the good folk that frequent these forums.
Take it easy all and be kind to each other as much as possible. We're the lucky ones. There's a batshit crazy world out there away from the surf community.
Aloha.
southernraw wrote:Heya all. Just a quick post to apologize to Stu. Ben amd Craig for my posts yesterday.
Was way below the standard of acceptable conduct and i apologize to the site owners, and all the good folk that frequent these forums.
Take it easy all and be kind to each other as much as possible. We're the lucky ones. There's a batshit crazy world out there away from the surf community.
Aloha.
All good, mate.
From my end at least, your apology is appreciated, your ongoing contributions even more so.
Cheers Stu. Legend.
;)
https://m.
I think I just understood “how north is north?”
Found myself reading things with an accent.
Probably totally wrong.
basesix wrote:reckon I've watched shuck 5 times since you posted it. who is saying goodbye to who; leading a loved one to the next phase. does it matter.. cool as, @Jelly. tots religion relevant.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbmVhb1-fPg
That was very cool.
Thanks.
I now think it is only Indo and some of the more radical in IDF that see the Gaza operations as a legitimate military operation.
For the rest of the world it is pretty obvious that it is a combination of an ethnic cleansing/ revenge operation where in many cases the IDF deliberately target children and civilians as well as essential civilian infrastructure.
Hardly conspiracy as plenty of video evidence posted by IDF members themselves proudly displaying their work, and senior members of Israeli govt stating their belief that it's morally ok to starve 2 million people.
But hey I'm not really educated so must be missing something. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
southernraw wrote:Heya all. Just a quick post to apologize to Stu. Ben amd Craig for my posts yesterday.
Was way below the standard of acceptable conduct and i apologize to the site owners, and all the good folk that frequent these forums.
Take it easy all and be kind to each other as much as possible. We're the lucky ones. There's a batshit crazy world out there away from the surf community.
Aloha.
Easy to get wound up on these forums SR.
Hope all good now.
I do see them as overall very positive and appreciate being able to have a dialogue, so cheers SN crew.
If Hitler was hiding in a school, a hospital etc do you think the allies would have not gone after him after weighing the consequences.
Or, if he was hiding in another country and running the assaults on a free and democratic country from there do you think the allies would not have targeted him there.
War is hell and should never be , but if they want the rockets to stop and if they want their enemies to be afraid of continually starting new attacks , they must go after the leaders personally. Maybe it just might make them have second thoughts.
I’d also like to say that I appreciate Indo’s fact checked history lessons on the plight of the Jewish people…..it’s easy to waffle on but history speaks for itself.
Easy to bag people until you see the whole story.
I feel deeply sorry for the Gazans who are caught up in this but they must stop shielding guys who are calling for the genocide of Israel.
Israel have a half of one percent of the Middle East to live on and the Arabs have the other 99.5%…
Israel would have a full 1% ( all of Palestine their original land) but the British stuffed that up after WW1 when the nazi friendly Ottoman Empire was defeated.
.... fairs fair…leave the Jews alone and instead make Gaza a nice seaside place to live instead of Iran's proxy hate hole…
Be interested in facts and the truth……the Iranians are getting very clever at misinformation and you need to be careful not to fall into the trap which many on here have.
Remember after all….this is a religious war ….Islam VS the rest of the world…..Islam wants Israel gone….then….its our turn.
""Remember after all….this is a religious war ….Islam VS the rest of the world…..Islam wants Israel gone….then….its our turn.""
Really?
I'll check under my bed tonight, just to be safe.
Optimist wrote:If Hitler was hiding in a school, a hospital etc do you think the allies would have not gone after him after weighing the consequences.
Or, if he was hiding in another country and running the assaults on a free and democratic country from there do you think the allies would not have targeted him there.
War is hell and should never be , but if they want the rockets to stop and if they want their enemies to be afraid of continually starting new attacks , they must go after the leaders personally. Maybe it just might make them have second thoughts.
I’d also like to say that I appreciate Indo’s fact checked history lessons on the plight of the Jewish people…..it’s easy to waffle on but history speaks for itself.
Easy to bag people until you see the whole story.
I feel deeply sorry for the Gazans who are caught up in this but they must stop shielding guys who are calling for the genocide of Israel.
Israel have a half of one percent of the Middle East to live on and the Arabs have the other 99.5%…
Israel would have a full 1% ( all of Palestine their original land) but the British stuffed that up after WW1 when the nazi friendly Ottoman Empire was defeated.
.... fairs fair…leave the Jews alone and instead make Gaza a nice seaside place to live instead of Iran's proxy hate hole…
Be interested in facts and the truth……the Iranians are getting very clever at misinformation and you need to be careful not to fall into the trap which many on here have.
Remember after all….this is a religious war ….Islam VS the rest of the world…..Islam wants Israel gone….then….its our turn.
Heading over to Indo’s for a death cult crank fest Opti. The club of necrophilic peadophiles cranking over the corpses of children. That’s what you guys are
Optimist wrote:If Hitler was hiding in a school, a hospital etc do you think the allies would have not gone after him after weighing the consequences.
Or, if he was hiding in another country and running the assaults on a free and democratic country from there do you think the allies would not have targeted him there.
War is hell and should never be , but if they want the rockets to stop and if they want their enemies to be afraid of continually starting new attacks , they must go after the leaders personally. Maybe it just might make them have second thoughts.
I’d also like to say that I appreciate Indo’s fact checked history lessons on the plight of the Jewish people…..it’s easy to waffle on but history speaks for itself.
Easy to bag people until you see the whole story.
I feel deeply sorry for the Gazans who are caught up in this but they must stop shielding guys who are calling for the genocide of Israel.
Israel have a half of one percent of the Middle East to live on and the Arabs have the other 99.5%…
Israel would have a full 1% ( all of Palestine their original land) but the British stuffed that up after WW1 when the nazi friendly Ottoman Empire was defeated.
.... fairs fair…leave the Jews alone and instead make Gaza a nice seaside place to live instead of Iran's proxy hate hole…
Be interested in facts and the truth……the Iranians are getting very clever at misinformation and you need to be careful not to fall into the trap which many on here have.
Remember after all….this is a religious war ….Islam VS the rest of the world…..Islam wants Israel gone….then….its our turn.
Heading over to Indo’s for a death cult crank fest Opti. The club of necrophilic peadophiles cranking over the corpses of children. That’s what you guys are
.
adam12 wrote:@Indo"This is the problem with people like that just dont bother to educate themselves and have very little understanding of practical aspects or a war zone or military aspects of a war."
And the problem with you, self appointed military expert is that you don't understand anything about insurgency and counterinsurgency.
Very few counterinsurgencies in history have proved successful based on only military measures.
To achieve success you have to also provide the other two pillars of COIN to the insurgent population, economic and political. Israel is not doing this which is why they will never defeat Hamas as an insurgent force.
So far, despite the civilian death toll and Israel's claims of success in killing Hamas leaders and soldiers, of the 24 Qassam Brigades, only 3 have been classified as combat ineffective, others have been degraded but are still capable of guerilla attacks, and 8 are still combat effective. Of the 16 battalions in the northern part of Gaza, 7 have been able to reconstitute in the last six months."US military experts....said that Israel's prosecution of the war, defined by a heavy-handed bombing campaign, and the absence of a post-war plan has helped trigger Hamas' resurgence.
There has been evidence of that resurgence in key flashpoints. In Jabalya refugee camp, Israel said it returned in May to “fierce” resistance from three Hamas battalions, despite having devastated the area in a nearly three-month bombing campaign in the fall. And Israel has staged four incursions in Gaza City’s Zeitoun neighborhood, according to the analyses.
“If the Hamas battalions were largely destroyed, Israeli forces wouldn’t still be fighting,”
said retired US Army Col. Peter Mansoor, “The fact that they’re still in Gaza, still trying to rout out elements of the Hamas battalions shows me that Prime Minister Netanyahu is wrong,” he added. “The ability of Hamas to reconstitute its fighting forces is undiminished.”
In May, Secretary of State Antony Blinken warned that the upcoming Israeli offensive in Rafah, where around 1.5 million internally displaced people had settled, could incur an “incredibly high cost to civilians” and leave Israel with an “enduring insurgency.” Without a plan to replace Hamas, Blinken said, Gaza would be left with a “vacuum” likely to be filled “by chaos, by anarchy, and ultimately by Hamas again.”
"On January 7, the Israeli military said it had dismantled Hamas’ command structure in northern Gaza.Within days, however, there were reports of attacks on Israeli patrols in eastern parts of Gaza City. Videos in the weeks that followed showed Hamas fighters apparently emerging from beneath the rubble, likely from the sprawling tunnel network that crisscrosses the territory."
The killings that give you such a hard on @Indo, won't defeat Hamas. In fact, they achieve the opposite because Israel is conducting a half arsed counter insurgency. Any leaders or soldiers are simply replaced, Israel's barbarism has only strengthened the number of Palestinians willing to take up arms.
"Irregular warfare is far more intellectual than a bayonet charge."
--T.E. Lawrence
"The shooting side of the business is only 25% of the trouble and other 75% lies in getting the people of the country behind us."
--Field Marshal Sir Gerald Templer
"Counterinsurgency is the use of all elements of a nation's power—including not only combined-arms operations but also psychological, political, economic, intelligence, and diplomatic operations—to defeat an insurgency. "
Unless Israel offers the Palestinians a post conflict future that can win over the population against Hamas it's just a slaughterfest that will achieve nothing and will in fact make Israel more vulnerable to attack.
"The "Laws"
According to Galula, there are four "laws" of counterinsurgency.1 The first law is that the population is paramount. That is, the support of the people is the primary objective of a counterinsurgency campaign. Without the support of the population, it is impossible to root out all the insurgents and stop further recruitment.
2 Such support is most readily obtained from an active minority. Those willing to actively support a counterinsurgency operation should be supported in their efforts to rally the relatively neutral majority and neutralize the hostile minority.
3 Having attained the support of the population it is imperative to remember that this support is conditional. What you do matters, and support can be lost if your actions are unfavorable to the population.
4 The fourth and final law of counterinsurgency regards the "intensity of effort and vastness of means." Because counterinsurgency requires a large concentration of effort, resources,and personnel, it is unlikely that it can be pursued effectively everywhere at once. Rather, action should be taken in select areas, and resources moved as needed. Thus, according to the laws of counterinsurgency, it is important to continuously make efforts at gaining and maintaining the support of the populace in distinct areas by leveraging an active minority."
Israel should have held back on destroying Gaza, got it's hostages back, conducted precision kills on Hamas leadership as they have only now begun doing and exploited the dissatisfaction of everyday Palestinians with Hamas, which was prevalent prior to this conflict, offering them economic and political incentives to revolt against Hamas.
That's how to defeat Hamas.
They've blown that chance now.
And you can rip up the Abraham Accords.
This whole thing has left them isolated, a pariah State, and awaiting nothing but further attack, perhaps forever.https://www.beyondintractability.org/bksum/galula-counterinsurgency
https://www.moore.army.mil/mssp/Counterinsurgency/
https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2024/08/middleeast/gaza-israel-hamas...The problem with you Indo is you think you know it all, well one of the problems anyway.
And the childish hashtags, FMD.
"Military expert" pfft.
Have a read of what the actual experts say about how to conduct counterinsurgency operations, the Joint Chiefs of Staff of the US Military, from hard lessons learned in part from their own failed COINs like Vietnam, and the USSR in Afghanistan.
https://www.jcs.mil/Portals/36/Documents/Doctrine/pubs/jp3_24.pdfThe IDF's own intelligence assessments are that they cannot defeat Hamas, it is an exercise in revenge killing and genocide, and it will fail because it is only a military operation, and try as they might, they can't kill all the Palestinians.
I'm no expert in urban warfare, counterinsurgency, or military operations.
Nor are you.
The difference is I don't claim to be one.
And I don't get off on killings either, unlike you.
Great post Adam thats a real good start you have clearly spent half an hour on the Internet maybe even an hour, but you still went to some effort thats one hour more of education you now have than others here, so its a great start.
Now if you want to continue educating yourself and gain more knowledge, your going to have to keep it up, your going to have to listen to a variety of experts and get their view points from day to day week to week and do it for months, this is an ongoing thing.
Even then you wont become an expert, and i sure aren't an expert but it will help you gain a far better understanding of things.
And yes war isn't perfect far from it, there is often not solution's as such more just options that are better than other options, and yes even among expert's you will get varied opinions and views, but one thing is for certain, just allowing Hamas to quite literally get away with murder and a massacre that based on population was like twenty 9/11's was never going to happen especially with 200+ hostages taken.
No country would just sit back and go, oh okay all good, especially after twenty plus years of rocket fire.
Again war isnt perfect, but you have to do what you can do and aim to remove the threat and weaken the enemy, and no dude just removing leaders wont do it, and look dude the reality is many of the leaders being taken out have been on hit list for a long time and are only able to be taken out because of the huge amount of intelligence gained from being on the ground in Gaza.
I dont have time right now to click your links, but those stats/views on Hamas strength are outdated and dont align with any of the sources that i follow and i follow those who are world leaders in this area and region people like Joe Truzman who is perhaps the worlds most renowned expert on Palestinian militant groups.
Even now after huge events like Ismail Haniyeh, being assassinated there was barely any rocket fire into Gaza when in the past an event like this would have resulted in hundreds of rockets, the only time rockets are now going off is when IDF get close to finding a stash and instead of allowing the IDF to destroy them, they fire them off.
Hamas are crumbling they have been severely weakened in every aspect, as a military force and even politically and every month they are getting weaker, but the time to stop is still a long way off and yes this war is like a game of whacko mole, areas are taken over and cleared, but then Hamas comes back into them, remember they have tunnel networks, so its not realistic to hold and secure an area fully, all you can do is keep whacking the moles, and each time fighters move back into an area IDF learns more intel, on where tunnels are etc
And yes its going to be a long process its only been 10 months, most wars go for years, the war has and will go through many stages, and realistically is likely to go for years in some manner even if just destroying tunnels etc and there will probably have to be some ongoing type of IDF presence in Gaza now indefinitely, especially in regard to areas like Egypt border, because Hamas can never be allowed to strengthen again to what they were
Anyway ive got to do some work, but honestly i do appreciate that you put some thought and effort into you post rather than just the typical abuse most throw around.
Optimist wrote:If Hitler was hiding in a school, a hospital etc do you think the allies would have not gone after him after weighing the consequences.
Or, if he was hiding in another country and running the assaults on a free and democratic country from there do you think the allies would not have targeted him there.
War is hell and should never be , but if they want the rockets to stop and if they want their enemies to be afraid of continually starting new attacks , they must go after the leaders personally. Maybe it just might make them have second thoughts.
I’d also like to say that I appreciate Indo’s fact checked history lessons on the plight of the Jewish people…..it’s easy to waffle on but history speaks for itself.
Easy to bag people until you see the whole story.
I feel deeply sorry for the Gazans who are caught up in this but they must stop shielding guys who are calling for the genocide of Israel.
Israel have a half of one percent of the Middle East to live on and the Arabs have the other 99.5%…
Israel would have a full 1% ( all of Palestine their original land) but the British stuffed that up after WW1 when the nazi friendly Ottoman Empire was defeated.
.... fairs fair…leave the Jews alone and instead make Gaza a nice seaside place to live instead of Iran's proxy hate hole…
Be interested in facts and the truth……the Iranians are getting very clever at misinformation and you need to be careful not to fall into the trap which many on here have.
Remember after all….this is a religious war ….Islam VS the rest of the world…..Islam wants Israel gone….then….its our turn.
+1
Ah, Indo gathering the clan for a Dutch rudder eh’.
The necrophilic peadophile gang. No child too small no school too many. Indo & Opti “if the kids dead, stroke yer head”.
Here you go optimist
Not sure my motivation...my instinctive need to stick up for the underdog...my secret desire to be one day honoured rightfully with the role of Forum moderator (expecting a call any day)...
But anyway I couldn't help but read your troubles on another thread...unfortunately I found myself siding with everyone's posts...other than your own...except for the part where you were told you can't post here!
So I put my low IQ mind to coming up with a solution that suits all...and here it is...a safe place if you like
You can post anything you like about your beliefs...and no one has to read it unless they want! Easy peasy...
maybe you could even get Jesus, fat Buddha, Mohammed, and friends to converse in adult conversation here
Solving the world problems, one at a time...call it taking a shovel as a way of moving that mountain
All the best...brother
PS...I actually was born again once, but I grew up, and grew a brain of my own...and realised it was all a load of shit!