Turnbull rolls over "again" to the ultra right

"my forefathers didn't think that a giant multi coloured snake created the geographic features of the planet.
They probably believed that a being from the clouds did it."

And what the fuck has the got to do with it, Blowin??

"An attachment is cultural. Cultures change whether they are 40000 years old or 2 years old.
It is not rascist or blasphemous or insensitive to say this."

You're right.... It isn't blasphemous or insensitive...... But it is pretty fuckn stupid.... Heheee!!!

Luv ya, blowin..... How have you been, you old son of a son of boat person? Gettin' a few waves?

Perhaps they should just hurry up and die......Geez you can be melodramatic Sheepy.

Yes it's sad seeing watching an " authentic " display such as a staged aboriginal dance. Same as it's sad watching a faux Fijian display, same as it would be if we were paid by tourists to wax our boards on a stage at a surfing themed tourist resort and shield our eyes and stare at an imaginary ocean and discuss the surf in exaggerated vernacular.

It's not authentic. It's compromised . It's staged and it's sad.

Sad as in pathetic , not sad as in teary.

And what's wrong with Blackfellas working in Bunnings ? Is it beneath them ? Is it diluting their culture ?
There doesn't seem to be a problem with Blackfellas utilising products available from Bunnings.
Is this a hardware related cultural issue I'm not aware of ?

No waves for me Sheepy. There is a Cat 3 cyclone due to pass over the top of me in a few hours.

Yipeeee. Not.

Blowin wrote:

Sorry Braudillo are you implying that it's more than just time ? That Blackfellas have an intrinsic link to the country ? That they can't survive away from this country or the country can't survive without them ?

Is it Earth wide or limited to Australia ?

If it's just Australia is it the whole country or just a region ?

Sounds like bullshit to me mate. My family was from somewhere before we came to Australia. We must have been there for quite some time I'd imagine , yet I don't feel an aching within my spirit now that I'm detached from this former homeland. But then again , my forefathers didn't think that a giant multi coloured snake created the geographic features of the planet.
They probably believed that a being from the clouds did it.

An attachment is cultural. Cultures change whether they are 40000 years old or 2 years old.
It is not rascist or blasphemous or insensitive to say this.

I've been living here longer than a lot of Blackfellas and I was born here. Do I have more of a right to be here than they do ? Do I have more of a right than an immigrant ?

OK, so you don't get it.

Fine, but, if you don't understand that calling someone's culture and heritage bullshit is not at the very least insensitive then we have nothing further to say to each other. I would like to think I misinterpreted what you wrote but going by the rest of your comments I think not. Good day to you.

Please note this decision is final and no further correspondence will be entered into.

Blowin wrote:

Perhaps they should just hurry up and die......Geez you can be melodramatic Sheepy.

Yes it's sad seeing watching an " authentic " display such as a staged aboriginal dance. Same as it's sad watching a faux Fijian display, same as it would be if we were paid by tourists to wax our boards on a stage at a surfing themed tourist resort and shield our eyes and stare at an imaginary ocean and discuss the surf in exaggerated vernacular.

It's not authentic. It's compromised . It's staged and it's sad.

Sad as in pathetic , not sad as in teary.

And what's wrong with Blackfellas working in Bunnings ? Is it beneath them ? Is it diluting their culture ?
There doesn't seem to be a problem with Blackfellas utilising products available from Bunnings.
Is this a hardware related cultural issue I'm not aware of ?

Not as sad as watching riverdance..... Now that's "pathetic".....

Ummm. Waxing surfboards with petroleum based products probably hasn't been around as long as indigenous dance..... But hey..... Woteva rocks your boat, blowin.....
Perhaps not all of us want to live in your generic homebrand reality, blowin.... Now that really would be sad..... ;)

no sheepdog, that stuff is good, its great they can make a buck and preserve their culture, its better than doing nothing. And I feel the same uncomfortableness when I see the natives dancing for money in bali. The main issue is the suggestion that that is enough, that is all they should aspire to, the assumption that that is what is best for them.

I know it's good... I said it was good... It's blowin that doesn't like it, SK..
I never suggested "that is enough, that is all they should aspire to, the assumption that that is what is best for them." What I suggested is that none of us are experts, that our capitalistic consuming way of life is not perfect either, that none of us have ever walked in their shoes, none of us have a clue, and that most of us seem to not have a problem with billions in handouts to Rinehart, or churches, or baby bonuses, or home grants for the middle class, or tax funded maternity leave for women on 100k..... But mention money for "blacks", and everyone makes my high horse look like a little plastic figurine.....

There are currently 660 000 aboriginals left..... That's including "mixed"...... 6 MCG's of people...... That's it.....

not have a problem with billions in handouts to Rinehart, or churches, or baby bonuses, or home grants for the middle class, or tax funded maternity leave for women on 100k

actually pretty sure I have complained about money for all those cunts too.

we clearly haven't got it right' sheepdog and that's why we should try to preserve their culture, yeh blowin is all hard and heavy but he usually has a point.

Though I would take him up on having no more connection to land, whether it be spiritual, physical, environmental, or reincarnation/ recycling of nutrients I think they have a little more connection to land, whether it be just perceived or real.

So what do you reckon Sheepy ? Should we round em up and make them breed to expand the numbers ?

You think that we should be counting numbers of a certain type of people and then you declare your hatred for rascism. The Blackfellas are people, same as us . Black, white, Wickan, Indian, gay , straight , self proclaimed Jedis , Amish or Chinese ....were all one mate.

There is no us and them. There is only humanity in 2015.

If you believe otherwise then you, my Provincial, mono cultural friend are the real rascist .

Or are you like Howard and ready to declare who and under what circumstance are the real Australians ?

What we need is a big melting pot....

That's right - I don't like staged tribal dancing.

If crew are making money doing it then good luck to them. If you enjoy watching it then knock yourself out.

Personally, it makes my skin crawl.

Jesus, blowin... And you reckon i'm melodramatic??!!?? lol

mate, I'd just like to take you up on "There is no us and them. There is only humanity in 2015.".........

Kumbaya, blowin.... Kumbaya..... lol...... Maaaaate..... That's bullshit and you know it.... If there is only humanity in 2015, you wouldn't be jumping up and down about "illegal boat people"..... They're "humans"......
Cheers, man......

Here's one for the comrades.
Martin Ferguson describes himself as Labor to the bootstraps
Former Labor resources minister Martin Ferguson has accused the NSW trade unions and state Labor party of deliberately misleading the public by telling them the proposed privatisation of the electricity networks will drive up electricity prices.
"It's just deliberately misleading the public, creating unnecessary fear and trying to scare people into voting for Labor not on merit but on misinformation," he said. "In many ways I am ashamed of the Party."

You wouldn't expect anything else from the Liars party.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/martin-ferguson-slams-nsw-union-misinform...

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/martin-ferguson-slams-nsw-union-misinform...

After all the forum posts on this topic and all the self obsessed self proclaimed political experts not one of us can come up with and or all agree on a way foward for this country..says alot about politics and political direction in this country..fucken elected governments cant even fuckn govern properly in regards to majority/policy decisions..no wonder the political narrative is in the outhouse

Haha lies lies its all lies forgot your an expert floyd..have one eye open for labor the other closed for liberal..nice to see your coming out of that closet mate..stretch you arms abit! I know the name of that song thats always stuck in your head...'solidarity forever'

barley, i think openly sharing information/opinions is a good thing if it sticks to issues and not attacking personalities. there n have been alot of good suggestions- its called brainstorming. Google allow all they employees to contribute as does the brazilian guy who lets all his staff even run the company and they are making a fortune.
Thats the problem here in oz, we have only a few making decisions and they all have agendas and views that have been shaped by so called experts from the past, WE have changed, we live in a technological age now, not an industrial age so we need conversation that fits the new paradigm.
The politicians are are job security, even being in opposition is a good thing financially.
Sheepy, i am not talking about dam s but building water reservours(sp) as outlets from the pipelines.
Have a look at the world, we are running out of food. Mining is not the gold mine it once was.
Be forward thinking, Build the infrasture of getting the water to plaves that need it, It will create jobs for the aboriginals as well including flora and fauna management. It will create new communities, it will produce new agricultural and livestock industries plus aquaculture, These rivers are full of european carp, catch em, turn them into fertiliser and plant the lands with nitrogen crops and plow the carp and nitrogen crops into the soils.
Sure it's an ambitios plan but but one that stimultes economic growth, ensures australias food supply, produces an export trade and if managed, helps our natural waterways,. Based on BOM reports you could flush out the rivers but still catch enough water to keep dams/reservours full and stop towns from flooding. And all this could be done with solar power and the growth in that thechnological field that australia could share with the world- for a price of course.
the mining boom wont last, but the creation of productive communities through efficient use of water resources will. THe monsoon's here to stay, the flooding of the Nile and the ingenious ways to utilise that resource made Egypt a powerful nation for eons.
Just an idea but i much prefer the thought of dredging the qld ports and drilling the barrier reef for oil- for fucks sake- get a grip. THe apathy of our politicians has infiltrated our public, we whing ane whine, but look a gift horse in the mouth. The sun and our water, and we do sweet fuck all to use it efficiently.

Dave, it was more than just the nile that made "Egypt a powerful nation for eons"... I'm sure you know the other factors..... Huge factors....

Barley; - "After all the forum posts on this topic and all the self obsessed self proclaimed political experts not one of us can come up with and or all agree on a way foward for this country"
The biggest growth industries in the 2000teens are hatred and waffle.... Get onto it, bro ;)

I thought pessimism was the defining trait of modern Australia.

No money in pessimism, blowin..... But outrage... hatred... It's like a pyramid scheme... Egypt eat ya heart out lol..... Bolt, Jones and co have made a fortune out of it.... Dog whistle inc'.......

I'm not talking about politicians or business interests.

Question … should we accept The Bricks (Glen Lazarus) move to be an Independent ? He was selected as a PUP Senate member then I suggest he should stay that way till next election. If wants to jump then PUP place in a proxy. We have seen thru the last two governments how important it is to have a consistent Senate. This may make it interesting for LNP. Lets get this place going … all this negativity aint good.

What about it Floyd ?

I just think the masses are so easily worked into a lather these days... Over anything.... People are addicted to bad news... it's unfucking believable.... Whether it's climate change, boat people, deficits, drugs, aging population, terrorism.......
Look, Australia just needs to make it's payments on it's "visa"... We need to stop clear felling and guarantee carbon sinks, maybe promote alternative energy - make it tax exempt..... We need to change peoples viewpoint that you don't need to have all the "mod cons like "I" watches" and 10k lounges from harvey norman, cos in the long run no one gives a fuck... And don't panic about an aging population, cos it will create jobs that don't exist today.... Make drugs a medical issue and not a police issue... Get out of the middle east... Tell them to go fuck themselves... Embrace our natural gas.....
The "outrage train" keeps chugging along....... But all those that want to get off the train, get off the fucking train.... Have a look around.... There's still good shit out there....
If we can get rid of Abbott, maybe tell Turnbull to be a bit more of a chilled out Pm, we might all be able to enjoy our weekends....

Nailed it Sheepy.

Cheers, blowin.... I think we all get caught up in it.... But recent events in my private life have reminded me that all we know is we are alive now.......

floyd, way off the mark mate- i was just using an example and i agree with you, but there are a multitude of other things that we could produce that could help. Our next generation- some anyway- are way ahead of us in environmental awareness, and so on it shall grow. Hemp, plants for food and medicine.
I like your comments floyd, but you have to have hope like you mention Baird. There are people out there who are making this world a better place.
The whole problem is ego centric. Where is australia rated in the worlds countries to live and finances. Which city in the world is the best to live in. Egocentricity is running the show and in politics this turns into power and control issues. I know there has been some questioning about my esoteric points, but it comes from a survival instinct, there's not enough, so we have to take as much as we can. The true cause, most of us are all scared shitless of death how often do you think of dying, hardly ever, because it frightens you to think it wiull be the end of you. Thats why we are so greedy here, we want to get as much as we can before we end, even at the expense of others and the planet. Love or not, that's the paradigm that runs our world, and it's a fiction.

Blowin wrote:

Would you really call it forced assimilation of aboriginals living in remote communities when funding is cut to services provided by modern Australian tax payers ?

No one is forcing anyone from their land. This is not forced dispossession or enacting structural rascism.
Anyone can live anywhere they like, it's just that a nurses station will not be provided for a few family groups on the edge of the desert.

Services will still be available to these people but, like many , many small rural communities of all types of people throughout the nation before, they may have to travel to access them as to continue funding them is not viable anymore.

The guardian has got to be the most puerile, small minded, click bait piece of trash going.

Hoisted upon the small minded people that believe being politically correct according to the latest missive will somehow make them a more moral person despite lives often full of an equal amount of venomous hate as the so called rednecks that they imagine they're staring down at from some lofty height of moral superiority.

So you only ever use the term First Nation when referring to Blackfellas you're spotless and bound for heaven ? Even if you can't bitch enough about that fat cunt at work that you dislike ? Or talk trash about posters on a website ?

First Dog on the moon can suck my scrotum.

" Playing ethnicy jazz to parade your snazz on your five grand stereo
Bragging that you know the niggers feel the cold and the slums have so much soul. "

Dead Kennedys

braudulio wrote:

Blowin wrote:

So it's a matter of time is it ? How long before I can claim that the land was gifted to my people and my people only ? The world is for everyone cobber.

If you want to dumb it down to just time then I'd say about 40,000 years should do it. Get back to me then. Unless of course you're a zionist ...

Has anybody on this thread actually lived on remote first nation peoples land?

yes, and i have seen the same politics and matriarchal egocentric shit fuck things up. Dont come on here trying to pretend you know how they live, think, act and should be managed. It is 2015, they have to come up to speed. no one wants to see amazing natural resources destroyed and we all want our lands managed sustainably. But we cant keep giving money to a select few who become rich and let the others live on grog.
Get real, a giant rainbow serpent did not create the world, as fantastic and wonderful as we would all believe, it is as plausible as saying santa claus delivers toys to every child in a night. We should not disrespect our ancient cultures but we must acknowledge their ideas come from limited data.

Fishlegs u may say this is not right, but when I spoke to all the Bungjalaung Nation Elders about words for their wall of history, not ONE could agree on the language. Oh they'll bitch about this, but in the end I sill show, shut your mouth unless you know what your talking about to dave the rave

yes, and i have seen the same politics and matriarchal egocentric shit fuck things up. Dont come on here trying to pretend you know how they live, think, act and should be managed. It is 2015, they have to come up to speed. no one wants to see amazing natural resources destroyed and we all want our lands managed sustainably. But we cant keep giving money to a select few who become rich and let the others live on grog.
Get real, a giant rainbow serpent did not create the world, as fantastic and wonderful as we would all believe, it is as plausible as saying santa claus delivers toys to every child in a night. We should not disrespect our ancient cultures but we must acknowledge their ideas come from limited data.

Fishlegs u may say this is not right, but when I spoke to all the Bungjalaung Nation Elders about words for their wall of history, not ONE could agree on the language. Oh they'll bitch about this, but in the end I sill show, shut your mouth unless you know what your talking about to dave the rave

one thing that would help our indigenous crew would be helped with some education being taught in schools about their history and achievements. does anyone agree that most aussie films and even literature always have a dark negative undertone, like a constant foreboding. the first aboriginal i really saw in bleached australia was in storm boy, Mr Gulpillil. (spelling/). We need to hear prideful things and celebrate our indigenous people which in turn builds their esteem and that is the key. i know fuck all about their history and that is a big problem in australia i think.

when i was being schooled in a first peoples nation as a young fella, i nearly fell of my chair when i heard about blackbirding and shipping slaves here to work on the cane fields.
staged tribal dancing is mostly bullshit.
but i will never, ever, forget the small numbas from Maleauka (Vanuatu) with full tribal dress playing ancient slit gong drums. id heard all the abo grog stories from my grandparents whod worked on farm stations, thought all blackies were criminal drunks. that day i smelt the earth kicked up by their dance and the rhythms of the drums, AND I GOT IT. pure humanity in connection with the earth and it was transcendental even for a year 6. it can work if it is genuine. Vanuatu protects its culture and does it pretty well. we all are talking about the same thing here, we gain most aussie pride stories from our ANZACS. how often does that get played over and over. what else? other than that i always feel like a bludger because i only work 50 hours a week and havent sacrificed my mental health and a limb. bludging because i havent worked 80 hours per week like some asian who sleeps in pods near work and sees his family for about half an hour on the weekend. Is that the future -race ahead for that! breed up !

conversely we have our brothers in NZ, the maoris being the most over privileged and over inflated bunch of scammers and bludgers i've seen in the world. Reaping gold in aussie and being given land in NZ.
in any case, our 'maintain the business status quo at all costs' politicians are selling us out as quick as they can. your kids will basically be serfs for the chinese as they are selling the 'farm' at each and every turn. 236 million investment freehold before its even on a register? they dont know how much land is foreign owned? why do we even bother with customs, asio and the wonderful AFP. this point alone nullifies any debate. I think western culture is nearly as obsolete as some are suggesting the indigenous here is. we can look forward to authority without question, the asian face has over the ages lost most of its expression because any hint of emotion would be a challenge to authority and you would most likely lose your head.

too many insects on automaton. human plague. too many of everyone. we have the knowleadge to live clean and maintain the planet. what are we trying to achieve as a humanity anyway? no one knows, the end game is to breed like fuckn rabbits and the most ruthless and un human wins. china and tibet. indonesia and western papua. patterns? progress? ruthless rabbits! modern humanity!
There have been some very interesting posts by all, sheepy and blowin etc. i like a non censored debate at the least. we all have different experiences and can relate our observations freely which is missing in most australian debates. as for our hard done by women, jeez if you are an aussie woman not absolutely killing it now in any job youre not qualified for you never will ( i admit i could be educated further in this point but i havent heard a good one from any debate ive heard in australia)

hem-stret wrote:

as for our hard done by women, jeez if you are an aussie woman not absolutely killing it now in any job youre not qualified for you never will ( i admit i could be educated further in this point but i havent heard a good one from any debate ive heard in australia)

Care to elaborate, couldn't make head nor tail of that.

First time I went to Yalata Land I drove into the community and there was an old fella walking down the dirt track clearly effected by leprosy. The houses were run down and falling apart, skinny unkempt dogs were scratching around here and there in the dirt. The biggest building in the town stuck out like a sore thumb, it had an air conditioner hanging off the walls probably 1 for every 2-3m all the way around it and grid mesh on every window. Parked up, walked into it, there were 6 white fellas sitting at their desk's doing what ever they were doing, they made me wait for a bit. I didn't mind it was a relief, but strange to be sitting in a comfy 26 degrees, and out of the heat that comes with a mid summer Nullarbor. One of the fellas slowly rose from his desk and made his way to the front counter, can I help you he asked, I'm hoping you can tell me were the elder is for the Yalata land, he sparked up and said 'why' I explained I wanted to explore their land for a while and needed a permit to do that. The quick reply was, he's not here, the bloke gave me the elders mobile number and said to call him. I said to the bloke no worries, can you sign off a permit on his behalf, he said no. I then asked, is this the administration centre for Yalata Land, he said yes. I left. It's a long way to drive only to be turned around so swiftly. Headed back toward Ceduna to see if I could get into range for mobile reception, rang the number but unfortunately there was no answer. December 2006.
If the Nunga bloke with leprosy could have pulled his socks up to be a team player, grown a new forearm and hand, he could have signed off on the permit, hey Dave. By the way it's "Bundjalung"
Makes you wonder how effective the money given to these remote communities is, or if it's serving it's intended purpose.
TAbott pulls their funding then says those fringe dwellers need to re-think their lifestyle choice and look to assimilate into his team, takes us back 200 years, if only they could,
A) Move to town buy a house and get a job.
B) Move out of the way quietly so mining exploration can move on.
C) Open their land for broad acre farming.
D) Vanish.
Wouldn't that be fantastic for our politicians, Dave, to remove that thorn from their side. Then they could concentrate on who's being the big dog in the house! without that annoyance.
Got story of some other communities if you care to listen.
Alpurrurulam
Arnhem Land, Yolngu peoples
Gunbalanya commonly known as Oenpelli
Hermannsburg
Koonibba
Wadeye
Yuendumu
So many intelligent post's on this thread, interspersed with the usual bottom of the barrel stuff. For me me, it's good to see that. At least we have a forum were we can vent our spleen without some fucker getting personal!

Gday, fishlegs... Read a few articles in the press about Abbott trying to sure up his conservative base within the coalition.... That's why since the "spill", he has been attacking "aboriginals", the U.N, Gillian Triggs etc etc.... It's not about "team Australia"anymore (which btw was a huge wank).... It's all about appeasing the far right powerbrokers.... Shallow self survival tactics....

Sheepdog wrote:

I just think the masses are so easily worked into a lather these days... Over anything.... People are addicted to bad news... it's unfucking believable.... Whether it's climate change, boat people, deficits, drugs, aging population, terrorism.......
Look, Australia just needs to make it's payments on it's "visa"... We need to stop clear felling and guarantee carbon sinks, maybe promote alternative energy - make it tax exempt..... We need to change peoples viewpoint that you don't need to have all the "mod cons like "I" watches" and 10k lounges from harvey norman, cos in the long run no one gives a fuck... And don't panic about an aging population, cos it will create jobs that don't exist today.... Make drugs a medical issue and not a police issue... Get out of the middle east... Tell them to go fuck themselves... Embrace our natural gas.....
The "outrage train" keeps chugging along....... But all those that want to get off the train, get off the fucking train.... Have a look around.... There's still good shit out there....
If we can get rid of Abbott, maybe tell Turnbull to be a bit more of a chilled out Pm, we might all be able to enjoy our weekends....

That's Gold

Sheepdog wrote:

Gday, fishlegs... Read a few articles in the press about Abbott trying to sure up his conservative base within the coalition.... That's why since the "spill", he has been attacking "aboriginals", the U.N, Gillian Triggs etc etc.... It's not about "team Australia"anymore (which btw was a huge wank).... It's all about appeasing the far right powerbrokers.... Shallow self survival tactics....

Yeah Yeah I know that, but jeez it's so disappointing that our current national affairs don't seem to have any well defined direction.

Yyyyyyepppp..... Weekly poll driven madness..... A spike in a meaningless weekly poll is now more important than any rational plan beyond 6 months... Ohhh... unless it's crystal ball gazing into 2055......

Fishlegs nice for you to look on the bright side IMO you have to see both sides..sheepie i love how your in the delusion of powerbrokers and warlords..ever played dungeons and dragons..really this faction/power politics is all hysteria have you ever asked yourself how does it actually effect your day to day life...seriously?

It does affect my day to day life, barley... For example, bile rises to my throat when I read your posts...
Are you saying there are no powerbrokers in political parties?
Now that's delusional...
Luv ya, barley ;)

All the argy bargy between left and right(and those that claim to be neither) aside, Abbott ate a raw onion skin and all while touring a Tasmainian farm yesterday. Um who does that? Here's a link including video of the onion munching Abbott, not a tear in sight!
http://m.canberratimes.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/tony-abbot...

Nah just sayin all this theory about the 'big players' is hysteria..

@ys george costanza!!

barley wrote:

Fishlegs nice for you to look on the bright side IMO you have to see both sides..sheepie i love how your in the delusion of powerbrokers and warlords..ever played dungeons and dragons..really this faction/power politics is all hysteria have you ever asked yourself how does it actually effect your day to day life...seriously?

Excuse me for being ignorant, but when you relate to sides, what do you actually mean! do we have multiple sides or 2 dimensional sides?

barley wrote:

Nah just sayin all this theory about the 'big players' is hysteria..

I'm not talking about a "kingpin puppetmaster", barley..... I'm talking about the far right voting block... Probably 20 or so votes, which includes Abetz, Bernadi, Heffernan etc ..... I think they were displeased with the handling of Ruddock.....

If they turn, Abbott is gone