Vaccinate or not

“Where do the real facts come from now?”

And that right there is the question. And you’re having it. Good.

It’s an oxymoronic question and exemplifies the outcome of a free thinking world turned conformist at crossroads with that very notion.

That question could be an album cover.

[img] https://imgur.com/4mjbVPJ [/img]

bloody vaccine impacted by upload skillz

Ha. thanks supa!

Supafreak wrote:

bonza wrote:

[img] https://imgur.com/4mjbVPJ [/img]

There ya go bonza , I thought it was a pretty good message

Beautiful!!! Fingers crossed we can all the same about the COVID vaccines one day in the future.

Nine or ten months on, and 67 pages of text later, I think this forum titled "to Vaccinate or Not" can be closed and archived, done and dusted. We should at least open up a new thread called Covid Megathread or something, because the current title implies there's still room for debate on the issue. Unless you are in the extreme minority, you should get the vaccine. If you're worried about it at all, talk to your GP.

Humanity depends on vaccination to reduce suffering on a global level. 99.5% survivability for covid, or whatever your chosen statistic is, still ends up with 35 million dead, hospitals being overrun, and protracted health restrictions. Even if the death rate is highest for 65+, there is still a huge loss of person years (number of dead multiplied by years remaining--keep in mind, half of people in Aus live beyond 83 years, and many live much longer than that). Global vaccination really is the only feasible way to exit the pandemic.

Some parts of the US are seeing a sizable 4th wave there with some hospitals filling up with covid patients. As a result, their vaccination rate is rising as people see firsthand the effects of covid on the unvaccinated. Australia has kept it mostly under wraps til now, and I really hope this current outbreak eases soon. It seems like people are more eager to get vaccinated when the threat becomes apparent or imminent. I just hope for everyone that is doesn't come to learning the hard way from widespread community transmission which the rest of the world outside Aus and NZ has endured. Sadly, the delta variant has upped the stakes.

My province in Canada just announced plans to require vaccine cards to enter establishments deemed to be discretionary, ie, recreation, like dining in restaurants, gyms, and movie theaters. We're in a different place than Aus, with 83%+ of the eligible population with 1st doses and 75% 2nd doses. Still, cases and hospitalizations are on the rise, and 90% of hospitalizations are among the unvaccinated. The hospitalization rate seems to have decoupled somewhat from previous waves thankfully, but I think they're rolling this vaccine card thing out in anticipation of another crappy winter respiratory season and trying to prevent more restrictions. I don't consider the people making these decisions, or the people who are in favor of this approach to be stupid. We have high vaccine availability, substantial buy-in of the vaccines 83%+, and have too many cases to advance to the next level of reopening (concerts, sports events, large organized gatherings etc). We're reacting to the same problem with locally different factors than Australia.

Here, initial reactions to the vaccine card program seem quite favorable, and I think its going to be popular. A good chunk of the vaccine holdouts are theorized to be apathetic or lazy with regard to getting the vaccine rather than fundamentally opposed. That's the hope anyway. It will also boost consumer confidence for people to return to pre-pandemic social gatherings at restaurants, music venues, and sporting events. The reality is that many, if not the majority of people, are just not comfortable socializing with unvaccinated people in close indoor settings.

A few years ago I spent a year in Vicco and did my farm work for a 2nd work holiday visa (never shoulda left!), so I'm itching to get back to Aus before my eligibility expires. It just doesn't currently seem like a great time for overseas travel with the quarantine hotels, testing, and intermittent lockdowns. Next time will be saving my cartilage for the ocean rather than more farm work that's for sure.

I enjoy the civilized conversation on this topic, but I think the title of this thread was at one point relevant and now is no longer. Talk to your doctor, get the jab. Wait for Pfizer if you're low risk and can wait. Or wait for carrots and sticks to encourage the jab. I do hope it doesn't come to vaccine mandates and cards for you guys, although I know some of my peers just a few months ago thought it would never happen here. I am fairly sure that when the dust settles, Australia being the progressive, tech-savvy, and motivated nation that it is, will probably see high vaccinations rates well over 70%, probably even 80% or 90% when they authorize the jab for under <18, and subsequently <12.

Thanks keeldude.
I was lucky enough to live in Canada for a winter a few years ago and was impressed about Canadians basic decency and common sense.
Your country's high vaccination rates are because you have a competent government that procured enough doses, and because it's the socially responsible thing to do.
Unfortunately Australia is not Canada and I can't see us reaching your country's high vaccination rates. We've got Murdoch media pumping out misinformation 24/7, an clown PM, and dare I suggest, a lot higher percentage of complete fucking morons than Canada.

I did a winter in Canada too and have been back several times. Beautiful country, awesome people, clean and green. Love it.

I think Canadians and Aussies have a lot in common.

Wise words keeldude. I’ve got a soft spot for Canada. Worked a season in one of the ski resorts in BC and have been back a few times over the years to several of the resorts in BC and Alberta. Love it.

Great people.

Canadians eh!
I took it the next step and shacked up with a Canadian girl. Now my kids are obsessed with ice hockey (in Australia) and want to eat everything with maple syrup. True story.

Canada is an amazing place. Spent a bit of time in Vancouver and Toronto. Managed to get out to Vancouver Island for a surf and Whistler for some snowboarding on our last trip a few years back. We’re going to try and weave a stint living there into our life plan. When / if travel gets back to normal.

zenagain wrote:

I think Canadians and Aussies have a lot in common.

Piss taking all things Yankee?

We went to the local ice hockey every week, sometimes 2-3 times a week. Canadians are super polite except when the puck drops, then there are no rules. I saw stuff that would get you ejected from every sporting stadium in Australia. Full beers chucked at referees in plastic containers. The refs just picked them up and carried on. At the end of the game, it's back to being super polite.

Don't ever mistake a Canadian for an American. It's like mistaking a South African for a New Zealander. A dead set insult :)

nahh gary.. that mistake only irritates them.. its when they get confused for an Australian then shit really hits the fan.. :)

"Vaccines Stop 100% Hospitalisations & Death."
Yes! This was the shit shoved down our throats from day 1.
Yes! MSM & Govt still convince Vaxerz that they're immortal.

Strange how normal people counted this down from that day but experts censored them.

From recent 15/16th Aug - Israel / UK Reports
Israel vaccinated now represent 60% Hospitalization > (Highest vaxed Group represents to 87%)
Highest UK vaccinated group represent highest 68% (2,156/3173 ) Age 50+ Hospitalizations.

Moratorium on VIP VOC Boosters...already broken / busted / dead & buried...lets mutate again...
Experts say Vaccine can't stop infection or spreading but the Vax works by preventing death.
Up until now that was this 2x covid spreading Vax saving grace.

390 Unvaxed Delta patients died or 5.35% of 7,285 UK Hospitalizations
753 Vaxed Delta patients died or 10.34% of 7,285 UK Hospitalisations

No shock!! Stats reflect Rollout progression...but a closer look sees they're an indictment upon the Vax.
Reports are emerging of more severe Covid infection amongst vaccinated that can't be hidden.
1 Unvaxed / 10 Unvaxed UK Covid Patients die. (This represents similar / high to past Covid)
4 Vaxed / 10 Vaxed UK Covid Patients die. (This represents similar to Death Row Covid )
That's not a good sign when Immortal Vax kill rate is 4x more deadly than all previous Covid.
Q: How the hell are 4/10 Vaxed Covid patients fast forwarding ICU straight to their death bed!
Experts are at a loss as to how to triage these new #1 at risk vaccinated patients. (It's real alright!)

Alarm bells would sound about now...(2nd time tbb has rattled this death cage!)
Relax! Rollout history shows 2 > 3 > 8x case ramps never alarmed a Vax expert...'Wot!'... Told Ya!
Israel claims highly vaxed are highly infectious & Unvaxed face far higher risk of this infection.

{ Gold Card } Vaxerz have already worn out the Covid Ward & Cemetery.
Yet no one thinks it's creepy that #1 infectious on Planet Earth award themselves VIP exemptions.
Most infectious vaxerz have no right to exempt themselves to legally sneeze killer covid over hesitants.
Gonna need more Hospitals just to accommodate skyrocketing VIP {Gold Card} covid cases...that's a fact!

Thanks Keeldude a steady voice of reason amongst the madness, unfortunately Vics summary of Oz is pretty close to the mark (made me smile as well) but I think we will stumble through all be it with a lot of noise getting there.

I saw on facebook the CEO of Pfizer wouldnt get the jab from his own company as he thinks he doesnt need it.
Ill be getting the Pfizer jab on friday anyway.

I wouldn't believe anything on face ache mate, i'm lined up for a Pfizer "shot" as well

yeah a lot of nutters talk shit on there. How much longer are you in Exmouth for? is it busy? id love to go there for a trip one day.

Busy as firk mate, 2020 was busy but next level now. Couple more weeks but might go back earlier for Frankie funeral, vale Frankie mate

@keeldude.

A succinct, genuine, knowledgeable and kind post. Thanks

Awesome to hear perspectives from different countries. Sounds like Canada is a little bit further down the road to a functioning country looking beyond This than we are here.

But apart from the demonstration attendees (many other descriptions I could have used but hey we live in the same country and it takes all kinds) it is beginning to feel like we are starting to head forward.

It is strange because I don't think we are fully aware yet of the momentum that is gathering and the tiny steps we have taken. Even if we get hit with a spread to other states, harsh numbers in NSW, VIC, wherever. It just feels like we are stronger and better equipped to cop those punches.

Because just like a wave, once created, can only stop it's journey by breaking on a shore, a nation of people creating momentum towards something is an almost perpetual force that can only dissipate at it's conclusion

Lining up like zombies even though it is now proven the vax isn’t effective.
Imprisoned and threatened and coerced. Blind and succumbing.
The Pfizer boss admits there are no vax yet that treat the variants . Wtf? And yet they are making $45 billion from selling drugs that can cause severe reactions including death.
• The flu had far more deaths in 2017.
Were we locked down , forced to vaccinate , QR code checkin and “show us your papers “?? No.
• cov19 has a very very high recovery rate. ( hardly a pandemic).
• The virus is completely treatable without a vaccine.
• Deaths are marked as covid death even though the patient has other life threatening illness.
• The pcr tests are not accurate.
• Media is paid by big tech who are affiliated with big pharma to censor and distort truth and saturate with fear mongering propaganda .
• Small businesses forced to close yet hardware and liquor shops stay open and amazon profits skyrocket.
• Suicide rates have been at an all time high and phone lines have been inundated . People are suffering.
• Govt plans to combine the QR code with cov passport . Goodbye autonomy and sovereignty!
This is about CONTROL . It was from the very beginning.

Keeping it salty Salty?

Get a couple of jabs, jump on board so we can all work to get those small businesses open and trading again.

You are right about the toll on mental health (Not sure about suicide rates not something I would feel comfortable looking into) and there needs to be more support options than just the phone. Direct contact support will open up sooner if we all get a jab. I did, was just like the (dunno) 6 or so I had as a kid.

Your other points, in the current climate, are just fading white noise.

This is happening jump on board.

“Current climate“ haha . What is that ?

“Get a couple of jabs , jump on board “
Sounds like a billboard slogan.
Straight outta bin chickens mouth.

keeldude wrote:

Nine or ten months on, and 67 pages of text later, I think this forum titled "to Vaccinate or Not" can be closed and archived, done and dusted. We should at least open up a new thread called Covid Megathread or something, because the current title implies there's still room for debate on the issue. Unless you are in the extreme minority, you should get the vaccine. If you're worried about it at all, talk to your GP.
Humanity depends on vaccination to reduce suffering on a global level. 99.5% survivability for covid, or whatever your chosen statistic is, still ends up with 35 million dead, hospitals being overrun, and protracted health restrictions. Even if the death rate is highest for 65+, there is still a huge loss of person years (number of dead multiplied by years remaining--keep in mind, half of people in Aus live beyond 83 years, and many live much longer than that). Global vaccination really is the only feasible way to exit the pandemic.
Some parts of the US are seeing a sizable 4th wave there with some hospitals filling up with covid patients. As a result, their vaccination rate is rising as people see firsthand the effects of covid on the unvaccinated. Australia has kept it mostly under wraps til now, and I really hope this current outbreak eases soon. It seems like people are more eager to get vaccinated when the threat becomes apparent or imminent. I just hope for everyone that is doesn't come to learning the hard way from widespread community transmission which the rest of the world outside Aus and NZ has endured. Sadly, the delta variant has upped the stakes.
My province in Canada just announced plans to require vaccine cards to enter establishments deemed to be discretionary, ie, recreation, like dining in restaurants, gyms, and movie theaters. We're in a different place than Aus, with 83%+ of the eligible population with 1st doses and 75% 2nd doses. Still, cases and hospitalizations are on the rise, and 90% of hospitalizations are among the unvaccinated. The hospitalization rate seems to have decoupled somewhat from previous waves thankfully, but I think they're rolling this vaccine card thing out in anticipation of another crappy winter respiratory season and trying to prevent more restrictions. I don't consider the people making these decisions, or the people who are in favor of this approach to be stupid. We have high vaccine availability, substantial buy-in of the vaccines 83%+, and have too many cases to advance to the next level of reopening (concerts, sports events, large organized gatherings etc). We're reacting to the same problem with locally different factors than Australia.
Here, initial reactions to the vaccine card program seem quite favorable, and I think its going to be popular. A good chunk of the vaccine holdouts are theorized to be apathetic or lazy with regard to getting the vaccine rather than fundamentally opposed. That's the hope anyway. It will also boost consumer confidence for people to return to pre-pandemic social gatherings at restaurants, music venues, and sporting events. The reality is that many, if not the majority of people, are just not comfortable socializing with unvaccinated people in close indoor settings.
A few years ago I spent a year in Vicco and did my farm work for a 2nd work holiday visa (never shoulda left!), so I'm itching to get back to Aus before my eligibility expires. It just doesn't currently seem like a great time for overseas travel with the quarantine hotels, testing, and intermittent lockdowns. Next time will be saving my cartilage for the ocean rather than more farm work that's for sure.

I enjoy the civilized conversation on this topic, but I think the title of this thread was at one point relevant and now is no longer. Talk to your doctor, get the jab. Wait for Pfizer if you're low risk and can wait. Or wait for carrots and sticks to encourage the jab. I do hope it doesn't come to vaccine mandates and cards for you guys, although I know some of my peers just a few months ago thought it would never happen here. I am fairly sure that when the dust settles, Australia being the progressive, tech-savvy, and motivated nation that it is, will probably see high vaccinations rates well over 70%, probably even 80% or 90% when they authorize the jab for under <18, and subsequently <12.

Keeldude , I think we could start another post with what you have written...and start again...very well balanced and factual.

I hope a blowin and a few others will read it and understand that the only way out for Australia is vaccinations and trying not to put our health Workers under so much stress that we have a meltdown of our health system......already people with elective surgery are being delayed causing unnecessary deaths....

Australia would be a lot further down the vaccination road , except the AZ has been trash talked , so a choice was made and we wait for Pfizer.....I reckon we have added on anther 6 mths of lockdowns etc ....so our nearly normal will have to take into account the u/16's.....which till now they have not......
How are the kid infections in Canada....and are you seeing reactions from people after they have had their Pfizer shots?

Yes, if only everyone would agree with me, then we can just chuck out the whole discussion and sit back and not think. Sweet Gesu Bambino!

Anyhoo, for those who still like to be properly informed, here are the UK numbers I talked about yesterday:

Note, 71 deaths under 50yo out of 265749 cases. All Delta Variant numbers.

Also note how little difference the vaccine seems to make in the <50yo: 48 deaths out of 147612 cases.

Not so in the >50yo: 205 deaths out of 3440 cases.

NSW= Mass Vax = Mass Outbreaks = Mass Covid = Mass Cover Up
Comes as no surprise that ACA forgot about Vaxing yer local Vaccinators...
Nothing in Fed/State Law requires a Master Mass Hubber to get a Jab...The Outrage!

Mass Vax outbreaks are generally limited to 1 or 2 cbd's & run up to 10 cases.

However! Nations / States that Ramp Rollouts also Ramp Outbreaks also Skyrocket Covid
Malaysia Staff Outbreaks April-40 Staff > 4 July-204 Staff (88% Vaxed) > 19 July-7 Staff

World over standard policy (1) Close Hub > (2) Inform Public (3) Clean Facility (4) Re-Open

NSW form the view that Vaxers sign a waiver to accept their evil doings.
So any infection > outbreak > Cleaning is none of the Public's business.
tbb uncovered the murky world of NSW Pandemic Politicization.

Latte Line...(Hospitals above the Latte Line get told their shit don't stink & only the others catch Covid.
Secret Outbreaks > Hawkesbury > P of Wales > Cumberland > RPA > Blacktown >Westmead > N'Castle.
Shame File > St George 8/2d > Nepean 46/d2 > Canterbury 9/2d > Liverpool 37/11d
24/8/21 ABC Hospital Outbreak reveals 20% Hospital Covid below Latte Line but above it is Taboo.
Gladys shapes N/E Angelic vaxed [L] = No Covid (vs) S/W Demonic unvaxed Labor = Covid (sorted!)
https://iview.abc.net.au/show/7-30/series/0/video/NC2101H134S00
Roughly 169 Hospital / 53 Care workers were infected during current outbreak

Mass Hubs...
NSW Govt can't afford to expose unvaxed / [+] jabberz by testing...so redeployed Sewage Tests.
Sewage Tests Monitor the Hubs > [+] Pull & Detour Vax / Postpone Frontline > Public walk into the trap.
Public then get infected...(BUT) NSW refuse to Close Hub + Refuse to List Hub as an Exposure Site.
All NSW mass hubs to mid Aug spread regional outbreaks...yet not one was revealed to local Vaxerz.
Take care visiting the World's most infectious Vax Hubs.

GP Hubs.
Same again...you sign away yer Hot Doc.. Only "Non Vaxing" GP's litter the shame File.
Non Vaxing GP's are so so cold & statewide might run a Hottie every 2nd day
Just one of Glady's Vaxing Hot Docs runs 6 cases/ 2weeks ( Not on the Shame File..."Top Secret!")
Vax Hottie Clinic is constantly on the boil...
Tips: (Less Cleaned) Entry Handles/ rails / Floors / Windows / Under seats / Desk wares

Premier / CHO Warned to keep clear of GPs / Chemists ...a week later she screams to Smash them?
Lockdown now sees millions & millions of NSW spreading covid from Hubs > GP > Tests > Chemists.
Lockdown is supposed have none? Now Millions cramming shoulder to shoulder in same crawlspaces?
That's right folks! Glady's #1 Hottest Spots in Town now ramped to Hell Town.

1,500 CBD / 2,400 Regional NSW Pharmacies also keep off Glady's naughty list, once Vaxer Signs in.
Non Vaxer Chemists statewide share 25 cases / 2 weeks > Gladys Hot Chems run 6-10 each / 2 weeks.
Hot Tips : Weirdly Chemists are last to supply QR / # SD / Sanitizer
Chemist Customers exchange Hot GP scripts & repeatedly 'Shout' Weirdest Drug names over & over.
Chemist has mix of dusty to farthest sourced Covid suppliers queuing from every diseased outpost
Again...sheer volume of Sick Customers in crawl space mauling shelves > constantly on Heat...
Chemists do Jabs / Blood Tests / Lung Tests / Wound Dressing / Cold'n'Flu all in grubby crawl spaces.
Many Chemists pulled outta Vax Scheme due to infectious nature upon staff & customers. (Smart!)

This review clearly shows NSW Govt Rollout the Vax outbreaks centered on their Pace & Venue.
The timing of Hub cases to Outbreaks can be viewed on NSW Health Maps.
NSW Govt Ramp Vax to Ramp Covid or can Slow Vax to Slow Covid or remove Vax to rid Covid cases.
NSW are also alone in hiding Govt infected Covid outbreaks from Hospitals / Hubs / GP's / Chemists.
People are just pieces of gum on their boots! NSW Rollout represents the obliteration of health care.
To purposely invite public to known Covid infected Health Sites by covering up the infection is evil.
tbb has never seen the like of this level Pandemic Politicization...couldn't find a more despicable display.
NSW Public are Lambs led to the Slaughter!

All stats point to NSW Govt shaping the pandemic to suit own needs as UK/US did & still massively do.
PM is at the Head of it...(This pure evil viral exploitation of the public must Stop!)

Plandemic, Yes or No?

https://brandnewtube.com/watch/irrefutable-evidence-that-will-send-all-w...

Thank you Admay !!!

Another example that convinces me , at least , that the science is not settled .

Wonderful scientist that is brave enough to speak out . This will not be reported in the mainstream press
and will be supressed by Big Tech .

In 10 years time ( hopefully much sooner ) , thanks to people like him and others , the truth will come out .

Abmay wrote:

Plandemic, Yes or No?

https://brandnewtube.com/watch/irrefutable-evidence-that-will-send-all-w...

Self proclaimed professional race car engineer with background in chemical and biological weapons...yeh I trust his credentials, because he told me so

san Guine - you may have better credentials and even if you do I would not automatically trust your views because you told me so .

I would listen to them , store the information and look for additional information to either discredit or confirm your views . I would not immediately bag you for your views and would keep an open mind .

san Guine wrote:

Abmay wrote:

Plandemic, Yes or No?

https://brandnewtube.com/watch/irrefutable-evidence-that-will-send-all-w...

Self proclaimed professional race car engineer with background in chemical and biological weapons...yeh I trust his credentials, because he told me so

To be fair…Mr racecar / chemical / biological engineer, did post it on the internet…surely that give it legitimacy!

Also the people in the townhall meeting , who would know him well as it would be an intimate community ,
have no problems with his credentials . Only you san Guine who , like me , have never heard of the guy before .

Hutchy 19 wrote:

Also the people in the townhall meeting , who would know him well as it would be an intimate community ,
have no problems with his credentials . Only you san Guine who , like me , have never heard of the guy before .

This is 100% correct, I have never heard of him

that was probably the least persuasive video I've ever watched.
but I'm probably going to be fed conspiracy vids by the bucketload now.

The paths out of the pandemic are all messy and imperfect and have risks.

Most exits are shut for political and community acceptance reasons irrespective of your views and whatever web sites and experts you follow.

The high vaccination doorway is the only one open that I can see that makes sense.

Our bodies will deal with fragments of the virus (vaccine), then the real thing soon enough. Quite happy to have my body prepared than unprepared.

All good now that Pfizer has fda approval? maybe not..
Sounding more like a pfizzer.

From the British Medical Journal.

"The paths out of the pandemic are all messy and imperfect and have risks."
The path out of the pandemic for Australia is going to get intertwined with an election campaign.
Mark my words, when the vaccination rates reach 70% of those eligible ( in reality low 60% of the total population) Scumo will call an election.
Hey will paint a glorious picture of post pandemic life and then say, the state ALP premiers are denying you this. Medical experts will be ignored because Scotty from Marketting only cares about Scotty from Marketting. He's already laying the ground work, because when people are discussing Scomo's glorious future, they aren't talking about his shameful past performance.
If Australians are dumb enough to re-elect this incompetent corrupt cunt, we deserve an even worse shit show for another 3 years.

https://kangaroocourtofaustralia.com/2021/08/25/doherty-institute-refuse...

Island Bay wrote:

Yes, if only everyone would agree with me, then we can just chuck out the whole discussion and sit back and not think. Sweet Gesu Bambino!

Anyhoo, for those who still like to be properly informed, here are the UK numbers I talked about yesterday:

Note, 71 deaths under 50yo out of 265749 cases. All Delta Variant numbers.

Also note how little difference the vaccine seems to make in the <50yo: 48 deaths out of 147612 cases.

Not so in the >50yo: 205 deaths out of 3440 cases.

As vaccinations increase, so does the fraction of hospitalizations in the vaccinated group: if 100% of people are vaccinated, 100% of the hospitalizations and deaths will be in the vaccinated. But the new death rate will be lower for areas of high vaccination compared to areas with low vaccination rates. Vaccines don't guarantee survival, but they substantially improve outcomes.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/effectiveness/why-mea...

Agree that under 50 arent likely to die fr covid, but vaccination still helps reduce likelihood of getting infected, duration of symptoms during which you are contagious and severity of symptoms. It reduces transmission.

It turns out it not straightforward to run the experiment where you vaccinate a clone then infect both the original person and the clone with covid and see who fares better.

What can be done however, is to look at different regions with similar populations and health restrictions
yet different vaccination rates and see which one fares better.

You can also compare for different countries the current caseload and number of deaths to that for previous waves wherein minimal amount of the population was vaccinated. The death rate in highly vaccinated countries such as UK, Canada, Israel, and many European countries is substantially lower for current waves compared to previous unvaccinated waves. And many of these places have a higher degree of economic reopening and social mobility compared to previous waves.

Interestingly, the UK is 63% fully vaxxed (72% 1st dose), yet 94% of people have antibodies. It does seems likely that naturally acquired immunity will play a role in our collective immunity from covid, however, the majority of current immunity in highly vaxxed countries is due to vaccination, and less people had to die to get there compared to the hard way.

And for a bit of balance:
All non vaxxers with no genuine medical reason not to proceed should just-
Drop dead

That's how it's turning out in the USA views from the.... Social Darwinism at it's finest.

@keeldude

Good post.

groundswell wrote:

I saw on facebook the CEO of Pfizer wouldnt get the jab from his own company as he thinks he doesnt need it.
Ill be getting the Pfizer jab on friday anyway.

Patently false news on that claim. He got his 2nd jab back in March.
https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-afs:Content:10025190134

Love the name FaceAche.

 “a lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is still putting on its shoes”

It takes a lot of effort to fight against the tide of false information so you can see the predicament the world is in going forward. At some point you literally cant keep up with all the fake crap. But I think we can all agree that Facebook needs to die.

groundswell wrote:

I saw on facebook the CEO of Pfizer wouldnt get the jab from his own company as he thinks he doesnt need it.
Ill be getting the Pfizer jab on friday anyway.

You didn’t think it was worth doing a quick fact check before you posted this?
It took about 5 second to find out he had his 2nd shot on March 10, 2021.

And what about Clive Palmer. The obese, 60+ year old was very coy about letting on whether or not he was vaccinated.

Don’t be coy Clive, tell us. Did you have a vaccine or not? Are you wearing a mask while shopping at Aldi or Bunnings? Do you ever go shopping, or do you get your butler Jeeves to look after all that shite?

Genuine question Clive, you fat freedom warrior, you.

Clive Palmer will play a really important role in Scomo's re-election bid. This fat bastard will throw millions at the next election chasing the idiot anti-vaxxer vote. He will then steer it away from Labor via preferences to help Scumo get back in.
Palmer wins the genuine idiot vote, typically polling 3-5%, with $60 million of advertising. Australia needs serous campaign financing reform so are democracy isn't hijacked by fat bastards like Palmer.
BTW, don't expect Scumo to criticise Clive anytime soon, no matter how deranged and dangerous his anti-vax message is. The PM is no Daggy Dad. He's in bed with genuine lunatics, both religious and secular.