The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices
errrrrm yeh...
glad Im not the only one who thought like this when I saw this photo
https://m.facebook.com/story.php/?story_fbid=pfbid02TCenHtWmSx5qR6UtmumS...
southernraw wrote:Burleigh considering indigenous crew can and did organise mass rallies for blm and for every invasion day, im surprised theres none for this..is there. Maybe as it gets closer but until then im going to trust my own instincts and the voices im hearing.
While im at it, are you up for explaining how indigenous livrs have improved in the last 15 or so years and can you pleaee relate that to the decline in education and increasing incarceration. An answer would b appreciated over an instagram post.
And fwiw, covid mandates are a long way off this current movement.
Southern, there was a rally in Brisbane today at Parliament House at 10am.
Didn’t see it on the news?……… funny that
I don't watch the new Burleigh.
I'll try to find something about it though.
Cheers.
Nope. Can't find anything about it.
Not even a rumour.
Can you post something from it so i can get an idea of numbers and message?
Sypkan,
"the irony is in the aloofness of mario facto, thinking we're all too dumb to see through his constant bullshit and spin"
Yep, understood.
As for Jacinta's FB post, gotta say I agree with her wholeheartedly, except for the last sentence.
Albanese is such a tool, tone deaf regarding the pain and loss caused by Rio blowing up the Juukan Gorge, not up to leading us or the Yes vote campaign. He's a good operator in the Parliament, as is Tony Burke, but not as leader of a country like Australia. Whoever does his twitter comms. needs the arse too, his thread is filled with the same type of crap Scomo was doing. It's like they are trying to promote Kylie Minogue or some pop star half the time. I know you read my thoughts on his role in the Voice debate I posted a while back. My opinion of him hasn't changed. A lightweight who won the title he never expected and wasn't suited for. He's certainly pissed off a lot of rusted on Labor voters from what I read and hear.
good discussion, constructive tone.
enjoyed the tunes tbb & udo.
adam12 wrote:Sypkan,
"the irony is in the aloofness of mario facto, thinking we're all too dumb to see through his constant bullshit and spin"
Yep, understood.
As for Jacinta's FB post, gotta say I agree with her wholeheartedly, except for the last sentence.
Albanese is such a tool, tone deaf regarding the pain and loss caused by Rio blowing up the Juukan Gorge, not up to leading us or the Yes vote campaign. He's a good operator in the Parliament, as is Tony Burke, but not as leader of a country like Australia. Whoever does his twitter comms. needs the arse too, his thread is filled with the same type of crap Scomo was doing. It's like they are trying to promote Kylie Minogue or some pop star half the time. I know you read my thoughts on his role in the Voice debate I posted a while back. My opinion of him hasn't changed. A lightweight who won the title he never expected and wasn't suited for. He's certainly pissed off a lot of rusted on Labor voters from what I read and hear.
i will never vote labour again full stop never ever...orwellian maggots.
sypkan wrote:and, in the interest of balance...
nice to see a straight talking, no bullshit academic
https://www.news.com.au/national/politics/aussie-professor-busts-ridicul...
he's clearly hiding as much as he's revealing... but on the whole, I appreciate his straight-upness
Speaking of so called fact checks and misinformation.
RMIT fact check this week actually got dropped by Meta after their USFTH document length fact check, that even ABC called out RMIT fact check as being misleading (RMIT verdict it is one page) even ABC agreed its disputable.
Huge complaints around this put pressure on meta to tighten up on RMIT fact check which also found for the last 8 months haven't held the proper International paper work to actually do the job, despite being paid $700,000 + a year for the so called service.
Some of the Individuals that were also doing the fact checks also had huge conflicts of interest clearly supporting or being involved with the Yes camp.
RMIT have now gone into damage control, heavily editing their website including removing details of the individual fact checkers, obviously so they cant be as easily kept an eye on by the public etc
I mean fuck me dead blind Freddy could see that RIMIT fact checking was a joke ad bias as all fuck, not to mention just look at how many fact checks they have done on the No camp (something like 17) while im not even sure they have done any on the Yes camp, if they had done just as many and were actually doing a proper fact check they would find lies and misinformation left, right and centre.
Anyway this is a win for the NO camp as if RMIT fact check do jump the hurdles to be able to do proper fact checks again, it will take time, so they wont be able to censor the No camp content with bias misleading so called fact checks.
Few videos around the issue.
&t=394s &t=11s
While you’re at it indo fact check this little snippet and you will get a better idea of the type of people mundine & price are , how low can ya go if ya don’t know . https://www.sbs.com.au/nitv/article/warren-mundine-and-jacinta-price-mis...
Supafreak wrote:While you’re at it indo fact check this little snippet and you will get a better idea of the type of people mundine & price are , how low can ya go if ya don’t know . https://www.sbs.com.au/nitv/article/warren-mundine-and-jacinta-price-mis...
Jeez that's desperate.
Shameful behaviour.
How low can you go....and these are the pin-ups of the no movement. haha!
@indo , this one might give you a chubby.
I was leaning towards yes, but after reading the official AEC booklet yes and no cases I may have to change my mind. The no case leaves the feel-good, airy-fairy fact free yes case for dead. Lawyers picnic, too much scope, racist, high court judgements, more bureaucracy, so many unanswered questions. This is the Govt's guide to help us make a huge constitutional decision. If Burleigh reads it he may have to change his mind and vote yes. It's all a conspiracy to make us vote no and all the sheep are falling for it. I'm still on the fence, slightly left of center, and have no strong feelings either way but from what I hear on the street yes is in trouble.
They had some class acts at cpac , crowd loved it ………. https://x.com/mettabhavana1/status/1693354208215613813?s=46&t=5RczxwAfzX...
Supafreak wrote:@indo , this one might give you a chubby. https://youtu.be/9gZwiG-TImY
Holy fk Supa!! What did i just watch!!??
What a bunch of slithering snakes. Surely these people aren't really humans!?
What a bunch of wierdos. Gotta be aliens.
Who on earth in their right minds could like, let alone vote for this bunch of freaks.
That was traumatic.
Thank goodness for the running commentary. Bloody hilarious!
Cheers for the laugh!!
southernraw wrote:Supafreak wrote:@indo , this one might give you a chubby. https://youtu.be/9gZwiG-TImY
Holy fk Supa!! What did i just watch!!??
What a bunch of slithering snakes. Surely these people aren't really humans!?
What a bunch of wierdos. Gotta be aliens.
Who on earth in their right minds could like, let alone vote for this bunch of freaks.
That was traumatic.
Thank goodness for the running commentary. Bloody hilarious!
Cheers for the laugh!!
And you could pay $7000 for the privilege of rubbing shoulders with them at the after party.
hahaha. If only it was a joke.
https://m.
&pp=ygUJQmFrZXIgYm95 hahaha. If only it was a joke.Hey SR. Yeah, if only.
I have a close friend who has been going down the rabbit hole for about 10 years now. He has joined online groups that sometimes meet in person. "Don't/can't trust the gov't!" is the opening to this rabbit hole. The ones he is with... i've seen vids they produce. They are busy the last coupla years producing knock offs of American pop culture. So, as an example, they have a young teen group that (poorly) plays Chicago (the Band) music. They make copycat sitcoms. It is as if they expect a civil war, and they anticipate losing all this as a result, so they are creating their own little country with it's own fresh baked ready made lil pop culture.
It would be endlessly entertaining were it not so disturbing. And, lemme tell ya, to watch it on a tv in an American livingroom.... it is very disturbing.
Hey Wax24!
That sounds pretty mental. And a bit disturbing hey.
I know a few crew like that too, especially in the area i live. Tend to do the old shuffle slowly backwards politely and find the nearest exit when the talk gets too intense.
I think alot of crew have headed down that road since the mandates/lockdowns. Somewhere, understandably given the way it all played out and the effect it had on people, the lines got blurred and it's turned into a complete anti establishment, can't trust the government resistance. Which i completely get....but...
I watched a doco a couple of years ago when the lockdowns were all going on. It's called 'Century of the Self'. I'll post it below. I've shared it a couple of times but the general gist is, governments and the elite have been playing us for years. It's all based on observations of all the different times in history that populations have been controlled, from psychological experiments on people to the Nazification of Germany, plus much more. It's pretty fascinating to see how easily huge populations have been so easily manipulated over the years.
Populations are manipulated to suit those at the top, and also populations are controlled to basically save us from ourselves. How much of that's true, who knows..but it puts it in perspective. As one big wave surfer who's name i can't remember said, 'we're just a flea on a rhinos ballsack', when it comes to having any control of the greater powers.
At some point it's just best to live and let live, stand up for the less fortunate and the suffering whenever and wherever you can, and just hope you can navigate the twists, turns and loopholes of life without too much damage to yourself. That's my theory anyway, but i get why people do want to try to resist.
Seems pretty futile though, the battles are endless and the victories against the governments and elite are slim to none. At what point do you draw the line for your own mental health and happiness i guess....because that stuff can't be too good on your own energy which in turn will affect your health.
Anyway bit of a ramble.
Here's that flick. There's a few crew that have been posting on here a bit lately that could do worse than to watch this.
Hope your friend comes good!
Thanx SR. Yeah, it's a "for reals" thing that gov'ts have earned some mistrust. That'd be more of a shame to me than it is if i didn't understand a coupla truths. One, is that governance is a necessary evil. Two, is that power corrupts. To take examples of this wisdom and use them to not trust any governance at all is a form of self harm. To try to convince anyone else of that misguided notion is harm to others. You sound like you have the right tone. Stand up for others, do the next right thing, show up to work.... and let alot of things go.
Anyhow, i am about off work (sneakin up on 7am here) and am going to ride what i can ride at my Mushy At The Moment, but Beloved home break. (May not be anything, but i'll get wet and have a paddle round.)
Have a good day/nite. (Never sure what time it is there.. 16 hours ahead of me?)
Really well said Wax24. Good to hear good thoughts and good vibes of other crew on the same frequency.
Yep, that's 2 pretty sound philosophies there. Power does indeed corrupt.
Really like that perspective on the self harm through complete mistrust.
Oh wow, 7am! Crazy that's basically the opposite side of the planet to here! ha.
Getting late here, and i got a severe rinsing today,...actually 2 pretty violent hold downs that shook the body pretty hard today, not huge surf, just solid and had alot of punch to it...so time to rest up.
Hope the mush does the trick for ya and have a good one over there.
old-dog wrote:I was leaning towards yes, but after reading the official AEC booklet yes and no cases I may have to change my mind. The no case leaves the feel-good, airy-fairy fact free yes case for dead. Lawyers picnic, too much scope, racist, high court judgements, more bureaucracy, so many unanswered questions. This is the Govt's guide to help us make a huge constitutional decision. If Burleigh reads it he may have to change his mind and vote yes. It's all a conspiracy to make us vote no and all the sheep are falling for it. I'm still on the fence, slightly left of center, and have no strong feelings either way but from what I hear on the street yes is in trouble.
Its really just about either voting with your head or voting with your heart.
Nobody that votes with their head is going to vote No.
That said it's also not heartless to vote no, Albo has said the voice will still get put in as policy, those who support the the Yes case still get some of what they want.
Its very different for the No voters, its very much win or lose.
@wax24
You do know southernraw was one of those rabbit hole anti covid anti covid vax cookers he even attended so called freedom rallies.
“ Its very different for the No voters, its very much win or lose.”
Never mind that you’re losing absolutely fuck all though.
Released about two weeks late, but still perfectly played, these cartoons and so nail hitting.
goofyfoot wrote:“ Its very different for the No voters, its very much win or lose.”
Never mind that you’re losing absolutely fuck all though.
Ive dealt with this before.
indo-dreaming wrote:Supafreak wrote:My question is different to AW , my question is what do no voters believe they are going to lose if the yes vote gets up ?
I don't think ive really heard people say we will lose anything, its more the possible beast that we are creating thats is the issue. (putting the moral aspects aside)
But i guess we lose constitutional equality and i guess technically we even lose being a proper democracy as one person= one vote=one influence will no longer be the case.
Its not so much about losing something, its more about the unknown beast we are creating, but one thing for certain it's a beast we dont need.
Like i said even in the case of a No vote, the yes camp still get what they want, and better still we get to test it out and see how wonderful it really is.
A no vote is actually a fair compromise, the yes camp still get their cake they just dont get the icing.
Supafreak wrote:@indo , this one might give you a chubby. https://youtu.be/9gZwiG-TImY
what a freakshow : /
;)
“ It’s not so much about losing something, it’s more about the unknown beast we are creating, but one thing for certain it's a beast we dont need.
Like i said even in the case of a No vote, the yes camp still get what they want, and better still we get to test it out and see how wonderful it really is.
A no vote is actually a fair compromise, the yes camp still get their cake they just dont get the icing. “
https://m.
&pp=ygUqd2hhdCB5b3Ugc2FpZCBpcyB0aGUgbW9zdCBpbnNhbmVseSBpZGlvdGlj indo-dreaming wrote:@wax24
You do know southernraw was one of those rabbit hole anti covid anti covid vax cookers he even attended so called freedom rallies.
Huh. Was i talking to you. Or about you.
Fk off u weirdo. Don't even mention me or converse with me on here clown.
https://m.
“ It’s not so much about losing something, its more about the unknown beast we are creating, but one thing for certain it's a beast we dont need.”
Ffs have a listen to yourself Indo, I can’t imagine what it must be like to live with so much irrational fear and bullshit swirling around your head.
The only certain thing is you’re sounding more deranged and more of a whack-job than usual.
Anyway I’m not hanging around here to play back and forth all day, it’s an epic sunny Father’s Day too good to spend on line.
Edit. Sorry for the personal crack, but fucken hell man. Come on
The announcement of a referendum to recognize FNP and a “Voice” was met with overwhelming approval according to public opinion polls. It took a short while for the “No” camp to swing into action and now approval is around 50%: it’s not difficult to see where the divisiveness comes from.
The “No” camp is populated by some familiar faces. Those who appeared under the Climate Change Denier banner, the sloganeers: Axe The Tax, Ditch The Witch, Bob Browns Bitch, Juliar etc, the Pro Brexit Brigade and lets not forget the Trump fan club, are all up there with their media support crew shouting No. I’d say the Anti Vaxxers are in there as well.
Not much changes in the Liberal Party. Our post WW2 recovery including the Snowy Hydro Scheme was initiated by the ALP under Chifley. Upon winning government, largely on the back of a “Reds under the Bed” scare campaign, Menzies did not attend the ceremony to mark the commencement of the project because it was a Labor initiative. Some years later he remarked it was a “visionary project”. It’s worth noting that nothing visionary came from Menzies or the Liberals. In fact, Pig Iron Bob is best remembered for allowing British Nuclear testing in Australia, complete with human guinea pigs, and two lines of inane prose about QE2. And let’s not forget about him selling scrap iron to the Japanese during their preWW2 military build-up.
While Conservatism has its place, it will rarely achieve much. Almost every progressive policy has come under ALP governance. We now have a situation where the right are trying to stifle an attempt to improve the lot of the indigenous. History repeating itself.
In my opinion it’s better to attempt reform and fail than to run away and pretend there never was a problem.
And now Farnsy has allowed his music to be used in support of the Yes campaign. Gutsy move. How long will it take before Bolt, Panahi, Credlin, Dean and Co are calling for everyone to burn their copy of Whispering Jack.
southernraw wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:@wax24
You do know southernraw was one of those rabbit hole anti covid anti covid vax cookers he even attended so called freedom rallies.
Huh. Was i talking to you. Or about you.
Fk off u weirdo. Don't even mention me or converse with me on here clown.
Just pointing out the fact during Covid you were a very vocal cooker, yeah sure the freedom crew had some points on some aspects, lockdowns went to far, but that whole anti vaxer thing, and going to the effort of actually intending rallies, that's next level.
goofyfoot wrote:“ It’s not so much about losing something, its more about the unknown beast we are creating, but one thing for certain it's a beast we dont need.”
Ffs have a listen to yourself Indo, I can’t imagine what it must be like to live with so much irrational fear and bullshit swirling around your head.
The only certain thing is you’re sounding more deranged and more of a whack-job than usual.
Anyway I’m not hanging around here to play back and forth all day, it’s an epic sunny Father’s Day too good to spend on line.Edit. Sorry for the personal crack, but fucken hell man. Come on
No offence but you don't sound very well informed and dare i say a tad guillable if you think having concern over what is going to be created equals being a whack job.
There is zero reason or even a half decent argument why the voice cant just be implemented as policy and needs to be cemented in the constitution.
At least go read all official documents related to the USFTH and both the Yes and No pamphlets
https://www.aec.gov.au/referendums/files/pamphlet/your-official-yes-no-r...
Or better still
https://www.ruleoflaw.org.au/voice-the-case-for-voting-no/?fbclid=IwAR1d...
Q: Why do Referendums mostly fail only in Australia?
Worldly Amendment Fails...
Swiss 14/320 failed
USA 6/27 (Not yet ratified)
Canada 7/30 Rejected
Ireland 11/38 rejected
Australia 36/44 rejected
So why does the World point & laugh at us backward freaks.
Here we stand as the most outgoing society on the planet but can't hack change...Huh! WTF.
Those in the know will keep us in our chains.
For all the other nations be they pollies or public are asked to...
*Vote to [ Amend their Constitution ]
Meaning to right a wrong in changing times by updating their Constitution. (Hardly a Big Deal!)
However! Australians have never & will never ever be asked to Vote to amend the constitution! Huh!
It is not our Constitution to amend...it belongs to another nation that owns us!
Our foreign rulers forbid Australian's to 'Alter' their Constitution.
See: (One can only Amend what is truly theirs & must never dream of Altering another's lot)
Fed Govt must pass the Vote > Governor General seeks approval of wording by our ruling Monarch.
https://www.afr.com/politics/queen-rejected-howard-language-on-1999-repu...
Our foreign rulers decide if we're to have a referendum & what their subjects shall Vote on...
(Albo + Aussies are merely chook feed!)
Only by impossible means of Majority Vote + Majority States. (Cough!)
Then & only then...
The people's Verdict is again accepted by Governor General (Has the power to overturn)
Governor General then presents people's majority plight to Ruling Monarch for approval.
King / Queen can give thumbs up or thumbs down...
Sorry to inform that no majority Vote wins nothing...yer Vote is worthless!
No Democratic Referendum just a Monarch forever ordering Aussies not to 'Alter' their offshore Lease.
ALTER : (Oz Dictionary)
Castrated / Neutered / Buggered / Bastardized / Done / Spayed / De-Sex
(Altered People) : Convicts / Slaves / Eunuchs / Deformed / Sex Slaves / Choir Boys / Mental Patients
(Altered Animals) : Herds / Pets / Live Stock / Fighting Beasts
(Altered Documents) : Judges rule are deceitfully forged (re: AEC games! Badge of Honour!)
Pause!
Who here wishes to Alter their Owner's prized possession or wishes to be Altered in the process?
[factcheck] For 1,000's of years ~ Altered Slaves / Animals lose 25% of Worth...possibly more now!
Altering lifeforms increased disorders > Immunity / Thyroid / Cancers / Cognitive / Joints
The Altered beings become docile, weaker & get aggravated!
Altered people are domicile & subservient to their masters...
Convict's (t&c) Constitution must not be Altered...(Saves one from reading between the lines!)
Now with that in mind...
Please read yer Voting paper on what yer asked to [Alter]...no pressure!
Now Ask!
How can Altering (Enslaving) Aborigines be a good thing in context of our ruler's request.
Your ruler is asking their subject a Question...
Q: "Will you be the bastard that forges the King's sacred Parchment in order to enslave Aborigines!"
Just reminding Subjects of their Allegiance to our King!
Chapter 8 : {Commonwealth Constitution shall not be Altered without the King's consent}
Loyal Subjects know what not to do...
Go forth with honour & valor to serve our King! God Speed crew!
Took tbb a while to realize but the answer is ever there on every Reffo ballot paper forevermore.
Every time yer asked a Question..."Are you that Bastard that will Alter our Aussie Values!"
Crafty Poms know exactly how to craft a document to have us squirm under their power!
PS: [Alter] Used in Sentences
(Example) Alternative Voices in Pop culture...
Alternative Voice Song goes Viral (Shock Jocks refuse to spin it as usual!)
(Example) Religious
The Altered Altar Boys' Voices were tweaked a little...That's a Double Ouch!
(Example) Political
Albo's alter ego altered our constitution fuelling inevitable altercations between YES (vs) NO.
tbb is not makin' it up...this is how it's meant to play out...
Sure : Alternative amended Reffo ...Good luck with that!
Our ruling Monarch's thought for the day!
King's 1st Anniversary is in a Week's time...
https://www.ramint.gov.au/news-media/news/2022-change-effigy-faqs
ALP Treasurer decides on King Head Coinage...(There ain't no rush!)
Reffo Question/s :
Should Oz vote on a Republic before minting a $Gazillion of King's Coins
or
Should Australia smelt a $Gazillion of King's Coins the day after the Republic Reffo!
A Salty Dog wrote:The announcement of a referendum to recognize FNP and a “Voice” was met with overwhelming approval according to public opinion polls. It took a short while for the “No” camp to swing into action and now approval is around 50%: it’s not difficult to see where the divisiveness comes from.
The “No” camp is populated by some familiar faces. Those who appeared under the Climate Change Denier banner, the sloganeers: Axe The Tax, Ditch The Witch, Bob Browns Bitch, Juliar etc, the Pro Brexit Brigade and lets not forget the Trump fan club, are all up there with their media support crew shouting No. I’d say the Anti Vaxxers are in there as well.
Not much changes in the Liberal Party. Our post WW2 recovery including the Snowy Hydro Scheme was initiated by the ALP under Chifley. Upon winning government, largely on the back of a “Reds under the Bed” scare campaign, Menzies did not attend the ceremony to mark the commencement of the project because it was a Labor initiative. Some years later he remarked it was a “visionary project”. It’s worth noting that nothing visionary came from Menzies or the Liberals. In fact, Pig Iron Bob is best remembered for allowing British Nuclear testing in Australia, complete with human guinea pigs, and two lines of inane prose about QE2. And let’s not forget about him selling scrap iron to the Japanese during their preWW2 military build-up.
While Conservatism has its place, it will rarely achieve much. Almost every progressive policy has come under ALP governance. We now have a situation where the right are trying to stifle an attempt to improve the lot of the indigenous. History repeating itself.
In my opinion it’s better to attempt reform and fail than to run away and pretend there never was a problem.
And now Farnsy has allowed his music to be used in support of the Yes campaign. Gutsy move. How long will it take before Bolt, Panahi, Credlin, Dean and Co are calling for everyone to burn their copy of Whispering Jack.
The yes polls have slid for all kinds of reasons but giving credit to the No camp is being a bit generous.
Albo and Linda have just been terrible at selling it, i guess because its hard to sell such a divisive on the nose idea, especially when questions asked cant be answered and anyone who disagrees is a chicken little or trump like
And then you get them spinning complete BS that everyone can see through, like this has nothing to do with treaty, its only one page, Aust day wont be targeted etc
And still so many questions un answered.
The strategy clearly seems to be more of one, we can sell this if we get big business and celebrities involved or shaming people into voting Yes.
Not sure those strategies will cut it, but i guess we will wait and see.
Anyway like Goofy said time to get outside, cracking day.
See that a lot of shit is still being thrown around here.
That CPAC crew, geez what a bunch of fine individuals...
Horrible people.
andy-mac wrote:See that a lot of shit is still being thrown around here.
That CPAC crew, geez what a bunch of fine individuals...
Horrible people.
Yep. What a shame.
Uurgh.
Indo
You still don't get it, do you.
“ It’s not so much about losing something, its more about the unknown beast we are creating, but one thing for certain it's a beast we dont need. ” - indoraptor daily ;););)
https://m.
&pp=ygURdGhlIHVua25vd24gYmVhc3Q%3D I wish everyone would burn their copies of whispering jack!
been wishing it ever since it plagued the airwaves way back when...
The things that pop up in my noggin sometimes, away apologies to Coles but my way of dealing with the constant barrage of @info's bullshit
Where goes he find these?
Great question
You see here at Swellnet @Info dives to great depths to win every argument
Grifters here, grifters there, grifters everywhere
Wakey wakey hand off snakey @Info
@Info is off to CPAC to dredge up even more bottom feeders
And now his back on the farm he’s been coming to for years to scoop up his usual serve of bullshit
You good? Yeah nah
Those Voice warnings look amazing, yep ripened on the (social media grape)vine
Its why @Info partnered with Burleigh
Hello, my little cookers
And its why @Info taste tests all his own racial theories
More milk, less milk again and again and again to get his perfect taste of coffee
Because at Swellnet if you go to great depths to win every argument you end up winning none
"Worldly Amendment Fails...
Swiss 14/320 failed..."
if only we had a system like the swiss, where referendum are often and ballsy enough to ask more than one pathetic question...
australia would still be alright I reckon
should have been at least 4 or 5 questions on this referendum to put to bed a few significant issues that are tearing this country apart
labor's biggest fail...
no balls
sypkan,
More than one question would only confuse to No Voters.
And Labor has no balls??!!!!
They may not be perfect and have made their fair share of mistakes, but they the are the only mob prepared to have a go at reform and make a change. (And see a bit further than the next election).
sypkan wrote:I wish everyone would burn their copies of whispering jack!
been wishing it ever since it plagued the airwaves way back when...
Could almost get me voting No...
Haha.
Na I'm a Yes...
sypkan wrote:I wish everyone would burn their copies of whispering jack!
been wishing it ever since it plagued the airwaves way back when...
If you want proof that it's all really a simulation - that late boomer music will be with us forever and ever and ever and ever in every commercial establishment and every commercial station you come across and it's never going to go away, ever. Interminable.
https://x.com/empcomnational/status/1698211419681075460?s=46&t=5RczxwAfz.... https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/dutton-promises-another-vote-if-... Spud just can’t stop playing politics with the voice.
indo-dreaming wrote:@wax24
You do know southernraw was one of those rabbit hole anti covid anti covid vax cookers he even attended so called freedom rallies.
Hey Indo.
No, i didn't know that. It doesn't change anything for me about the exchange.
Not to get all "preachy" (oh shit.. he's gonna get preachy, lol), but you posting that inserted unnecessary negativity (or the potential of it) into 3 lives. Mine, Southern's, and yours. Restraint of pen and tongue woulda been the way to go. It almost always is.
Have a good (night? what time is it there?)
Uni assignment i did a few years ago. This is my take on things. I'm sure this will ruffle many feathers. I hope so.
Love Blue Diamond x
The Necessity of Reparation for Historic Injustices
Introduction – Compensatory Justice
Disparities between the standards of living of humans on this planet have long been a part of our history on this planet. From the wealthy nations of the West to the developing and undeveloped nations on this globe, the diversity in the quality of life when viewed from a moral standpoint are without a doubt grossly unfair.
In this paper I will look at why historic injustices do require some form of reparation. I take a strong stance that we are more obliged to solve current injustices than to provide reparation for every act of injustice in the past. In doing this I will first investigate the historic injustice of the Aboriginal people of Australia and I will look at the argument that they are entitled to some form of reparation and why.
I will incoroporate some interesting views from Jeremy Waldron, Robert Nozick and others which will help me slowly build to my conclusion that reparation should be in the form of Non Indigenous Australians surrendering some of our priveleges as a form of reparation.
Historic Injustices to Indigenous Australians:
Australia the continent was well inhabited for many years long before white settlement. It is commonly known that in 1788 Australia was colonised as a country under the rule of the British Empire, with total contempt for the fact that it was already inhabited by a native indigenous race of people.
The way the original inhabitants have been treated, including forced assimilation, execution, stolen families and not even allowed to be recognised as citizens for a large part of white Australia’s history are also well known facts. (Poole, 1999,pp114-142)
There exists now a situation where there is a large divide between Aboriginal and non Aboriginal Australian’s that can be traced back to the moment Australia was invaded by English settlers and the brutal and unfair treatment that has followed.
So at this point now, in 2013 what is the just and fair way to make amends for past actions?
I would argue that a moderate to large amount of reparation is overdue for this nation of people, the Aboriginal people. But there are many challenges to this view point especially that of how much reparation, and what sort of compensation.
Past injustices or present suffering?
One of the questions raised in an issue like this is whether it is better to provide compensation or reparation for past deeds, which have already been done in a previous generation and cannot be changed, or whether it is better to now provide assistance to those who are suffering in their current situations and consider that as a form of moral duty.
To understand this we need to delve a little deeper into this issue and hear some differing viewpoints.
Firstly we need to understand what the best way to provide reparation. How do we judge what is the best way of giving back and how much? Jeremy Waldron states “The historic record has a fragility that consists, …in the sheer contingency of what happened in the past” (Waldron,1992,p5 )
This is saying that we can’t trace every single injustice back to the original act therefore reparation for every act would be almost impossible because it would ultimately be guess work.
In this statement he has an objection from Robert Nozick who believes it is in fact possible to address this problem by “changing the present so that it resembles how the past would have looked had the injustice not taken place” (McKenzie, 2013)
This would be a way to ultimately provide maximum reparation, but is it the correct approach? I believe this is a fairly radical approach, although it does have some merits in the fact it would be working in a positive way for indigenous people, I don’t think it is entirely the right way to deal with these issues but it is on the right track.
Waldron argues that it is based on too many unknowns. “The status of counterfactual reasoning about the exercising of human reasoning of human freedom is unclear”(Waldron 1993,p10)
Which leaves the question somewhat open about the sort of reparation that is required, but provides one clear answer to the key question. Both agree that yes, reparation to some extent is required. But how much and in what form?
Another philosopher who leans more towards Waldron’s views is Kymlicka. He is somewhat more straightforward in his assessment that property rights in particular for Aboriginals would create “massive unfairness” and also he maintains the argument “Aboriginal rights must be grounded in concerns about equality and contemporary disadvantage. (McKenzie, 2013) I agree with both these views but I don’t think they provide any active solutions.
The Solution?
So if its not handing back all of Australia’s land to the original inhabitants that is the most appropriate way to deal with past injustices, then what is?
I look at the current country I grew up in, as a white Australian. I ask myself why I never had Aboriginal friends growing up, no understanding of Aboriginal culture and why my basic understanding of Indigenous Australians is mostly 200 years old. I look at our flag, a symbol of a nation that stole a country from its original inhabitants, with no recognition of the Indigenous people at all on it. I see that Australia considered Indigenous people as less than people until only 40 years ago and I see the way that Indigenous Australians live a completely separate life to the way of life I know as an Australian. I see that the only indigenous politician I am aware of is a former Olympian and it is because of this fact of her sporting status that I know this. I see no collective power or representation of Indigenous Australians and I see non Indigenous Australians,( a culture built on a history of stealing a land and mistreating its people) still taking, taking as much out of this land as they can, with little to no regard of sharing or giving to the original inhabitants. I see a government that says lots of words about ‘closing the gap’ and bringing the living standards of non- indigenous and indigenous Australians closer together, but apart from nice words, there is no conviction, no follow through, just assimilation , and all that still remains are injustices.
As stated by Sparrow, “Continuity gives rise to responsibility on part of present generations of Australians for our history”.(McKenzie,2013). Although deeds happened in the past beyond our control, what we do now to either ignore, or rectify these issues will reflect on us in history. So if we choose to do nothing, we are contributing to the history of the mistreatment of non- indigenous Australians. And this is simply unacceptable in my opinion.
Conclusion
So what is fair? I believe that the way forward is a surrendering of some of our privileges as non- indigenous Australians. The simple fact is it was morally wrong without a doubt what has happened in the past. And it is also morally wrong without a doubt to ignore these facts and not offer some form of reparation in the present. But how much?
I think that going back to Robert Nozick’s argument is a start. I think Nozick is wrong to make the present resemble the past in every aspect. But I do think that it would be reasonable to restore some aspects of the way things should be. The things that happened in the past were out of our control and we can’t go back to changing the way things were. But we could change the way things are.
For some examples. Why not give at least 50% of political power to indigenous people? It surely would be a fair thing to do considering this is their country. Media control. 50 percent. Industry. Realestate. The list goes on. Why do we not acknowledge the indigenous people on our flag, or better still use their flag? Why is Australia still a part of the Commonwealth when it serves little purpose to any of us and serves as a constant reminder to Indigenous Australians that they are still controlled by the original invaders. These to me are fairly simple reparations that would have minimal impact on Australia as a whole. Perhaps, it would alter the way we live but I think it is our responsibility, morally to forfeit some of our privileges for the greater good. Basically a little bit goes a long way.
In closing, it is a fact that a huge injustice occurred to the Indigenous population and suffering continues to this day. There is no easy solution to such a burden of pain. I believe the only solutions are for the non- Indigenous population to take responsibility and sacrifice our own way of life to bring about an overall equality. Sacrifice is not an easy word. But it all comes down to right and wrong. We are in a position to give, in this current generation. What are we so scared to lose, that was never ours in the first place??
Bibliography
McKenzie,C.”Prof” (2013), Lecture, Historic Injustices and Indigenous Rights, Macquarie University
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28
References
Poole, R. (1999). Nation and Identity.Routledge, London, pp.114-142
Waldron,J. (1992). ‘Superseding Historic Injustice’. Ethics, 103 (1), 4-28