COVID-19 Health System Overload Forecaster
*Important notice
medRxiv publishes preliminary scientific reports that are not peer-reviewed and, therefore, should not be regarded as conclusive, guide clinical practice/health-related behavior, or treated as established information.
blindboy wrote:burleigh I know you are a bit thick but I thought you might manage to interpret......"..there was enhanced transmissibility from unvaccinated individuals and decreased transmissibility from booster-vaccinated individuals."
What it says is that unvaccinated individuals spread it more than the vaccinated. Pretty simple. That is what their evidence shows. They speculate that this may not be enough to stop the spread .....which is all the more reason to be vaccinated since the reduction in severe disease is well documented......but you just keep on jogging mate and we'll see how you travel now the virus has a free pass into your region.
Vaccinated? You mean vaccinated + boosters? There is a difference dopey.
You are classed as fully vaccinated with 2 jabs, you can work on the front line, go to restaurants, fly from overseas, play tennis etc yet the evidence is clear that they do nothing.
Not anywhere have I mentioned boostered humans when I’m talking about the Pfizer CEO saying yesterday that 2 jabs does fuck all against omicron.
Although I’m sure in a few weeks we will learn that the boosters have the same effect, just in time for another jabby
"Two shots of Pfizer's COVID vaccine offers around 70 percent protection against severe disease from Omicron, according to results of a study published Tuesday in South Africa."
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-12-pfizer-jabs-omicron-safrica.html
blindboy wrote:"Two shots of Pfizer's COVID vaccine offers around 70 percent protection against severe disease from Omicron, according to results of a study published Tuesday in South Africa."
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-12-pfizer-jabs-omicron-safrica.html
Just give up mate, you’re old, we get it, but just stop.
This article is from 14th December.
The fucking CEO of Pfizer said it himself.
Just look around you. All these double jabbed employees that have covid.
indo-dreaming wrote:GuySmiley wrote:info proffers this gem this morning in regard to the ABC " ....But many of their views/narratives are not realistic anymore, Omicron is changing everything, its not the same as other strains, and the vaccines aren't everything we thought they were especially in regard to reducing transmission ....
The ABC is among others things a news service ffs, ie its job (its charter) is to accurately report the news. Since when having a view or narrative is reporting the news ffs, oooops I forgot that's what Murdoch and 9infotainment does for news.
The whole point that has obviously gone over your head because you are too busy wanting say black when i say white is they are not reporting things accurately, they are reporting using outdated weeks old information and not providing new widely accepted updated information as gsco pointed out, but again you ignore his post and others because you have some weird obsession with me.
If the ABC is wrong, outdated or pushing a “narrative” they are taken to task by the govt because it’s a breach of their charter.
The ABC do get it wrong occasionally and the govt are straight onto them.
The fact is you and others here don’t like the ABC because it doesn’t suit YOUR narrative; as I said if you want opinion based news head to Murdoch and 9infotainment.
Scientists believed Covid leaked from Wuhan lab - but feared debate could hurt ‘international harmony’. https://news.yahoo.com/scientists-believed-covid-leaked-wuhan-211452135..... https://www.projectveritas.com/news/military-documents-about-gain-of-fun.... https://newjerseymonitor.com/2021/11/22/project-veritas-and-the-mainstre...
Yeh but from the very start the only evidence for a lab leak was, and still remains, circumstantial. The furin cleavage site has evolved multiuple times in coronaviruses and so is irrelevant to the question of its origin. As there has never been substantive evidence of a lab leak, scientists were under no ethical obligation to publicise that hypothesis.
"An email from Sir Jeremy Farrar, director of the Wellcome Trust, on February 2 2020 said that “a likely explanation” was that Covid had rapidly evolved from a Sars-like virus inside human tissue in a low-security lab."
This seems to be either a distortion or an outright lie as:
On 19 February 2020, Farrar, along with 26 other scientists, published as a co-author of the Statement in support of the scientists, public health professionals, and medical professionals of China combatting COVID-19, which declared "We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin."[53]
Roadkill wrote:burleigh wrote:With some good news the QLD border is coming down 1:00am Saturday.
Now that’s something we can agree on RKAbout time to. A complete waste of resources and $ for the last week or so.
Good news.
+1
gsco wrote:But it's the original article that got me going. It presents as already accepted reality without question or thought, with a completely straight face and no flinching at all, the absolutely insane scenario of if you're double jabbed, and then you also get covid and survive, then you just "just rebook your booster shot" for a later date. It also presents the insane scenario, as already accepted fact and unquestioned reality, that if your child gets covid and survives, then just rebook their vaccination for a later date too. This is so wrong on so many levels I wouldn't know where to start, apart from the obvious that this advice no longer matches reality and is a month or two expired.
That article is a straight reprint from the Conversation by an academic and paedetrician.
Margie Danchin
Paediatrician at the Royal Childrens Hospital and Associate Professor and Clinician Scientist, University of Melbourne and MCRI, Murdoch Children's Research Institute.
This represents the straight ahead medical expert opinion.
Go follow her Twitter feed for a while.
I don't see any agenda or "angle" there.
I honestly believe she thinks this position is correct.
Whether you agree with it or find it batshit crazy, it's perfectly legitimate for the ABC to reprint the article.
Should they have printed a rebuttal to that point of view?
Perhaps.
But they can't really trawl social media accounts or forums to present it.
GuySmiley wrote:indo-dreaming wrote:GuySmiley wrote:info proffers this gem this morning in regard to the ABC " ....But many of their views/narratives are not realistic anymore, Omicron is changing everything, its not the same as other strains, and the vaccines aren't everything we thought they were especially in regard to reducing transmission ....
The ABC is among others things a news service ffs, ie its job (its charter) is to accurately report the news. Since when having a view or narrative is reporting the news ffs, oooops I forgot that's what Murdoch and 9infotainment does for news.
The whole point that has obviously gone over your head because you are too busy wanting say black when i say white is they are not reporting things accurately, they are reporting using outdated weeks old information and not providing new widely accepted updated information as gsco pointed out, but again you ignore his post and others because you have some weird obsession with me.
If the ABC is wrong, outdated or pushing a “narrative” they are taken to task by the govt because it’s a breach of their charter.
The ABC do get it wrong occasionally and the govt are straight onto them.
The fact is you and others here don’t like the ABC because it doesn’t suit YOUR narrative; as I said if you want opinion based news head to Murdoch and 9infotainment.
I listen to ABC radio everyday fuck witt, if i didn't like it i wouldn't listen to it,
It's just disappointing when they aren't keeping up to speed and giving us wishy washy narrative type views on something as important to the community as Covid.
The aim of this game is for everyone to catch covid and not die. And then society can forget about it and move on.
The mindset in that article is that getting double vaxed, and even achieving the aim of the game of getting covid and surviving, is actually still somehow not enough and we need to keep getting boosters to try to achieve something we’ve already achieved.
That would be the completely batshit crazy scenario that the so-called extreme conspiracy theorists in these forums have been absolutely canned and slaughtered for mentioning and warning about.
If that’s what happens in our society then this small handful of “whack jobs” in here have completely silenced and made a fool of everyone else.
I hope it doesn’t happen.
The ABC and these so called “experts” pushing for these ideas have no credibility in my eyes.
(Apologies if I’m a bit on edge today.)
I see a divergence in the scientific outlook as Omicron changes the game and perhaps the ABC is being a bit slack in presenting this new divergence.
I have a more generous outlook on the broadcaster than you it seems.
As to the more fringe theories that this is all some planned "great reset" or not related to the virus at all but more a function of governments seeking authoritarian control; I think the current chaos caused by Omicron around the world would sink those theories comprehensively and decisively.
Others will take a different view.
Constance B Gibson wrote:I nominate this as the soundtrack to this inane, insane, and deeply embarrassing* thread:
*embarrassing to the SN publishing platform team...or should be. 'Let 'er rip' is a piss-poor cop-out.
Thanks Karen
Cub reporter info says “... giving us wishy washy narrative type views .... “.
They don’t for the 3rd time.
What don’t you understand about the ABC’s charter which requires them to be FACTUAL and INDEPENDENT otherwise your man Morrison would be onto them.
Question for info: when was the last time Morrison or any of his Covid ministers appeared on the ABC to be questioned on their performance and contrast that to the regular arse licking they enjoy over at Murdoch or 9infotainment? Goes to show what’s what in AU media.
"The aim of this game is for everyone to catch covid and not die."
That's the plan now it looks like, but of course it wasn't the original plan.
Remember when "living with covid" meant getting vaxxed, slow and sensible easing of restrictions, expert track and tracing, and the re-introduction of highly localised lockdowns if necessary?
Well Perrottet / Gladys and Scumo put an end to that plan by letting it rip and not having any fucking RATs. We now have empty supermarket shelves, rubbish piling up in the streets, hospital systems collapsing, the logistics/hospitality/tourism/education sectors on their knees, and a non-existent track and trace system.
This shitshow reminds of a classic comment by Tyson about his opponents. "Well everyone has a fight plan until I punch them really hard in the face".
Scumo's fight plan was to let it rip, personal responsibility, and the private sector will provide RATs. Now that dog is just a punch drunk idiot desperate for the bell to end round 1.
only thing embarrassing about this thread is those that can't keep up with reality, and are still batting for big pharma... it was embarrassing enough before... but now...
seriously, stuff has changed big time
oh yeh, and this vid of cunstance and her four fat arse thug bouncers.... that is pretty embarrassing too...
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=297161675757955&id=100063923...
as is antifa's position generally
very embarrassing
again...
"What don’t you understand about the ABC’s charter which requires them to be FACTUAL and INDEPENDENT otherwise your man Morrison would be onto them."
this is just utter bullshit
as if morrison will go after the abc if they are doing the government's messaging
I don't take gsco's full sell out stance, but the abc has clearly had a role to play throughout this pandemic... and presenting both sides of any of the smaller debates within the main debate clearly isn't a part of that role...
Qld Hospital Rate (Update)
3rd Jan - Dr Gerrard : Unvaxed 26.5% (vs) 73.5% Full Vaxed
4th Jan - Dr Gerrard : Unvaxed 21.0% (vs) 79.0% Full Vaxed
12th Jan- HM D'Ath : Unvaxed 12.0% (vs) 88.02% Full Vaxed
(9 day Summary)
Unvaxed Patients drop 54.7% (vs) 19.75% rise in Full Vaxed Patients
Daily our Hesitants save our Health System as Rollout sucks our Health System dry...as all know!
Expert Qld Health advice...
14th Oct-CHO J. Young : "Every person in Qld & every town In Oz will be infected!"
20th Oct- CHO : "We'll be bringing in Virus thru the Borders in Vaccinated people!"
4th Nov-Premier : "Virus will enter your community & hunt down any Hesitants!"
January 2022
7th- Premier : "Everyone Isolate for 6 weeks until you get yer Boosters."
11th- Dr Gerrard:
"All of us by now will know people who have been Vaxed who do get the illness!" > "Vax is Working!"
"Qldurrz should not be concerned about Covid Peak...it's just another Virus!"
"No Pox Parties" + "Hesitants must Isolate!"
In last 9 days the $Gazillion Vax Roundabout devours 74.45% extra frontline resource.
Not even counting the Vax dominated 24,500 home care patients.
Vax Roundabout is a greater impost to Qld Health than current Peak Pandemic it pretends to fight.
Best ever Spin Dr Gerrard : "If Qld never had Vax we would clearly be overwhelmed!" (Cough!)
Vax Rollout runs rings around itself to orchestrate it's own demise...a fitting farewell.
Qld Govt Rollout & VIPs have finally infected every Postcode bar one...smirks the Health Minister!
Qld Govt has near fulfilled it's promise to infect every Qldurr with Covid...they need your help...
15th Jan Sat 1:00 am : Premier invites All Unvaxed Aussies to Mop up Qld's infectious VIP Hot Mess.
Oh Blumpkin! Please set us all straight. C’mon, give us your (correct, of course) opinion….
What you reckon bout the coppers arresting that old lady in qld for a good old no comply?
acab right?
Let me just try and get the thread of the argument here. The ABC has conspired with big pharma to push us all to take unnecessary booster shots, which as burleigh has pointed out, we actually need to reduce our chances of getting infected by omicron beacuse we are already protected, by two shots, from serious disease, but sypkan seems to believe that it's all antifa's fault, apart, of course, from the ABC, who are doing Morrison's messaging which is a bit confusing.....as usual for Scotty (black today, white tomorrow) while gsco just disagrees with everybody about everything? Is that somewhere near the stage of the discussion?
Pretty simple. Omicron has shown the shots made for the original virus are not effective at stopping spread. Even the pfizzer ceo said it so why are they (media and govt) still pushing for boosters and kids shots??????
blindboy wrote:Let me just try and get the thread of the argument here. The ABC has conspired with big pharma to push us all to take unnecessary booster shots, which as burleigh has pointed out, we actually need to reduce our chances of getting infected by omicron beacuse we are already protected, by two shots, from serious disease, but sypkan seems to believe that it's all antifa's fault, apart, of course, from the ABC, who are doing Morrison's messaging which is a bit confusing.....as usual for Scotty (black today, white tomorrow) while gsco just disagrees with everybody about everything? Is that somewhere near the stage of the discussion?
You really think that if it doesn’t work with 2 shots it will work with three?
There’s a quote about doing the same thing over n over and expecting a different result.
Also since you agree that 2 don’t work, you must agree that jabbing kids is insane?
Try to keep up Michael,
"Conclusions
To summarize, the study findings demonstrate that unvaccinated persons were more susceptible to infection by the SARS-CoV-2 Omicron variant, whereas booster-vaccinated individuals were less susceptible as compared to fully vaccinated individuals in Delta VOC-infected households. Furthermore, a lower susceptibility for booster-vaccinated individuals was detected among those living in families infected with the Omicron VOC. In addition, there was enhanced transmissibility from unvaccinated individuals and decreased transmissibility from booster-vaccinated individuals."
https://www.news-medical.net/news/20220105/Study-findings-suggest-spread...
burleigh the only thing that is insane is your belief that you are qualified to judge these issues. Go for a jog.....and hope your lucky 'cos it's coming your way.
No, my view is the abc is publishing mindless, irresponsible, misleading junk that is out of touch with the current reality, and at the same time it is also providing free advertising space that it should be charging money for.
I agree with the qld chief health officer and the nation’s current trajectory of facing covid head on even if we’ve largely stuffed it up
https://www.theage.com.au/national/hospitals-are-being-crippled-elective...
"Under the changes, category two and three elective surgery will be halted again at public and private hospitals in Melbourne and major regional cities to help manage a projected surge in coronavirus patients.
Two senior healthcare sources, who requested anonymity to detail private correspondence with the state government, said the government had considered the unprecedented step of cancelling more-urgent category one surgery across the state.
One of those sources said the situation in Victoria’s hospitals had become so dire this week that the suspension of category one procedures was still “on the table” just hours before the changes were announced.
This would have included delaying some procedures for people with life-threatening heart disease and cancer for several weeks, in a move the source said would have been “extraordinary and shocking in its implications” and a level of restrictions on healthcare unheard of in Australia."
"“We have finite resources,” Dr Tomlinson said. “So, we’re going to have to dramatically reset our expectations of what healthcare can deliver in the next couple of weeks.”"
It is unheard of in Australia. Can't remember a time in my life here that anything like this has happened. For now category 1 elective continues, thank God, for those are the most important ops (not discounting the 60,000 or so in pain who now can't get their procedures).
Yep gsco disagrees with everything except his own version of the latest cunspirrasee theory.
Vic Local wrote:"The aim of this game is for everyone to catch covid and not die."
That's the plan now it looks like, but of course it wasn't the original plan.Remember when "living with covid" meant getting vaxxed, slow and sensible easing of restrictions, expert track and tracing, and the re-introduction of highly localised lockdowns if necessary?
Well Perrottet / Gladys and Scumo put an end to that plan by letting it rip and not having any fucking RATs. We now have empty supermarket shelves, rubbish piling up in the streets, hospital systems collapsing, the logistics/hospitality/tourism/education sectors on their knees, and a non-existent track and trace system.
This shitshow reminds of a classic comment by Tyson about his opponents. "Well everyone has a fight plan until I punch them really hard in the face".
Scumo's fight plan was to let it rip, personal responsibility, and the private sector will provide RATs. Now that dog is just a punch drunk idiot desperate for the bell to end round 1.
The plan was always to open up when we hit over 70% vaccination, thats what we did.
Plus you might have missed the news but there is this new variant called Omicron, it's way more transmissible and has up to 80% less chance of hospitalisation.
It's changed the game, it impossible to track and trace Omicron and would be completely pointless to do so seeing it is nowhere as deadly compared to previous strains.
EVERY country on earth will have a wave of Omicron at some stage and have or will go through what we are, the reality is if you take decent chunk of workers out of the work force at the same time you have issues, no country is immune to this, its irrelevant who is in government in any country, there is no magic bullet, unless you change the whole midest and only those that are actually truly sick need too stay home, in exactly the same way we do with the flue.
You would expect if this stays the dominant strain that is the approach most countries will have to take eventually.
Anyway the good news is the wave will find a natural peak and cases will fall and the people affected will have an added degree of natural immunity (at least for a few months, i believe like Covid vaccines it wanes)
And yeah in the future there will most likely be further waves we will have to deal with.
It is what it is and its really not about politics like you like to make everything out to be, even your hero Dan doesnt have any magic bullet.
Denial -> Recognition -> Resignation -> Acceptance
Each of us can work out where we are at an individual level.
As a nation however, I think we are closing in on "Resignation"
Ive spoken to 3 different mothers of young children in the 2-4 age range that have along with their parents contracted covid. They have all said the same thing , mild flu like symptoms for a couple of days then all good. Parents were vaccinated kids obviously not . Not saying this will be everyone’s experience but just because something is coming your way doesn’t mean you will end up in hospital or worse. Fear and panic has gripped some on this forum.
Supafreak wrote:Ive spoken to 3 different mothers of young children in the 2-4 age range that have along with their parents contracted covid. They have all said the same thing , mild flu like symptoms for a couple of days then all good. Parents were vaccinated kids obviously not . Not saying this will be everyone’s experience but just because something is coming your way doesn’t mean you will end up in hospital or worse. Fear and panic has gripped some on this forum.
That's inline with the dozen work colleagues and friends that I've heard from. Not all of them vaccinated. Some of them boostered.
Info, you made a bit of sense then until you finished with "It is what it is and its really not about politics like you like to make everything out to be, even your hero Dan doesnt have any magic bullet."
Yes omicron is spreading ridiculously fast and the reason for that is very much political. The let it rip merchants ensured the country was in a poor place to deal with Omnicron, and Scumo's stunning fuck up re no RATs has just supercharged the spread causing medical and economic havoc.
Scumo is worse than useless in a crisis. He was warned about the bushfire risk two years ago and did fuck all about it and then buggered off to Hawaii when the shit hit the fan.
He promised a $2 bil natural disaster fund and has done fuck all about it, he promised bushfire relief and the money never came. He hasn't build any stand alone quarantine facilities, the vaccine rollout was a joke, and the fucking clown was told we needed RATs in September and he fucked that up too.
This fucking muppet couldn't run a bath, let alone introduce sensible contingency plans for natural disasters or pandemics. He's the reason you never ever make marketing people CEOs. The bloke couldn't see the big picture if it was nailed to his hair plug forehead.
2 - 3 days headaches and fevers seems to be the most common.
Family and friends I would know close to 20 people (Vic & QLD) that have gone through it. Vaxxed & Unvaxxed all seem to have the same symptoms.
I had these symptoms last week, was like a 2 day hangover, my partner was a little worse and my kids sneezed.
Can we just make it clear - not everything needs to make entire logical sense to every human being.
If you don't personally understand why we need boosters - it doesn't mean we don't need boosters! It doesn't mean that there exists some ridiculous conspiracy network of puppet masters - it just means you don't understand it!
It's actually disgusting watching people feel they can live their own truths (i.e. make their own shit up, and convince themselves it's real), because they personally did some basic logical deductions which made sense to them. They're blind to their own biases, and inabilities to properly consider all the data - but still they do it. Mostly because there's an overwhelming amount of loud mouthed commentators who will happily ignore science for their own gain.
i.e. natural immunity.
Idiots think: I've heard covid is mild, I think I'm healthy, so surely I can just get covid an forget about the vaccine.
In actual fact: We still don't have much data on covid, scientists are still nervous about making any sweeping/overarching comments about potential long term effects or how it effects each person (well, the reputable ones at least), and there's nothing to indicate natural immunity is effective in anyway (just like say syphilis - which you can't build natural immunity too). So the recommendations are avoid getting covid, and get vaccinated first to reduce your risk, and booster after 4 months to further reduce risk.
Stok wrote:Can we just make it clear - not everything needs to make entire logical sense to every human being.
If you don't personally understand why we need boosters - it doesn't mean we don't need boosters! It doesn't mean that there exists some ridiculous conspiracy network of puppet masters - it just means you don't understand it!
It's actually disgusting watching people feel they can live their own truths (i.e. make their own shit up, and convince themselves it's real), because they personally did some basic logical deductions which made sense to them. They're blind to their own biases, and inabilities to properly consider all the data - but still they do it. Mostly because there's an overwhelming amount of loud mouthed commentators who will happily ignore science for their own gain.
i.e. natural immunity.
Idiots think: I've heard covid is mild, I think I'm healthy, so surely I can just get covid an forget about the vaccine.
In actual fact: We still don't have much data on covid, scientists are still nervous about making any sweeping/overarching comments about potential long term effects or how it effects each person (well, the reputable ones at least), and there's nothing to indicate natural immunity is effective in anyway (just like say syphilis - which you can't build natural immunity too). So the recommendations are avoid getting covid, and get vaccinated first to reduce your risk, and booster after 4 months to further reduce risk.
Another actual fact - scientists have no long term data of vaccines either.
Another actual fact - natural immunity is science, just not the revenue raising kind of science
Gotta be up there with one of the dumbest posts on here
blindboy wrote:Let me just try and get the thread of the argument here. The ABC has conspired with big pharma to push us all to take unnecessary booster shots, which as burleigh has pointed out, we actually need to reduce our chances of getting infected by omicron beacuse we are already protected, by two shots, from serious disease, but sypkan seems to believe that it's all antifa's fault, apart, of course, from the ABC, who are doing Morrison's messaging which is a bit confusing.....as usual for Scotty (black today, white tomorrow) while gsco just disagrees with everybody about everything? Is that somewhere near the stage of the discussion?
sigh...
'conspired' ...bigger sigh...
work that nyt / guardian narrative harder bindboy...
no, abc has taken on the role of responsible government messager in a pandemic, as you'd expect... and .as it does in fires and floods etc....
however, rather typically in the modern context... it has taken on a hyper tribalist stance... much in line with all of the other nice middle class pandering 'left wing', self proclaimed 'responsible outlet' media sources...
so much so, that even former employees like chris uhlman and others have felt the need to comment on the one track narrative and massive peer pressure within media to stick to that narrative...
antifa have also taken a very vocal pro vaccine stance, pretty much right from the start... and much like the rest of their dogma, they've taken a very fascist robot 'you must comply' tactic with that stance... which is rather ironic to say the least...
again...
it's fucken embarrassing enough they would go there initially... not to mention their 'freedumb fighter' opposing protests (that struggle to get 50 odd crew... against crowds of thousands and thousands...)
but with the new developments, both in terms of the virus and vaccines... and some pretty moderate reasonable commentators now saying, we've pretty much all just been fed misleading big pharma propaganda for a good 12 months or more...
well, it is rather embarrassing
for all those young(ish), once cool, edgelord, 'fuck the system' anarchist types...
just sayin
but a cunny's gotta cun...
Natural immunity is real, but unfortunately anti vax idiots used it as a tool to further their own personal gain. They're idiots because they don't give a shit about potential down the track issues, and they don't have any accountability in what they say. It's usage is somewhat compromised.
You're in fantasy land Burleigh, choosing to question science based purely on your own whims, or whether you personally believe there's sufficient doubt to make a claim about sinister financial interests.
Also - we do have long term data on vaccines. Reputable scientists all state that they leave the body within 4 months.
Stok wrote:Natural immunity is real, but unfortunately anti vax idiots used it as a tool to further their own personal gain. They're idiots because they don't give a shit about potential down the track issues, and they don't have any accountability in what they say. It's usage is somewhat compromised.
You're in fantasy land Burleigh, choosing to question science based purely on your own whims, or whether you personally believe there's sufficient doubt to make a claim about sinister financial interests.
Also - we do have long term data on vaccines. Reputable scientists all state that they leave the body within 4 months.
So you say we have no long term data on Covid but we do for the vaccines? interesting stuff.
Im glad you corrected yourself about natural Immunity. That was pretty embarrassing
burleigh wrote:Stok wrote:Can we just make it clear - not everything needs to make entire logical sense to every human being.
If you don't personally understand why we need boosters - it doesn't mean we don't need boosters! It doesn't mean that there exists some ridiculous conspiracy network of puppet masters - it just means you don't understand it!
It's actually disgusting watching people feel they can live their own truths (i.e. make their own shit up, and convince themselves it's real), because they personally did some basic logical deductions which made sense to them. They're blind to their own biases, and inabilities to properly consider all the data - but still they do it. Mostly because there's an overwhelming amount of loud mouthed commentators who will happily ignore science for their own gain.
i.e. natural immunity.
Idiots think: I've heard covid is mild, I think I'm healthy, so surely I can just get covid an forget about the vaccine.
In actual fact: We still don't have much data on covid, scientists are still nervous about making any sweeping/overarching comments about potential long term effects or how it effects each person (well, the reputable ones at least), and there's nothing to indicate natural immunity is effective in anyway (just like say syphilis - which you can't build natural immunity too). So the recommendations are avoid getting covid, and get vaccinated first to reduce your risk, and booster after 4 months to further reduce risk.
Another actual fact - scientists have no long term data of vaccines either.
Another actual fact - natural immunity is science, just not the revenue raising kind of science
Gotta be up there with one of the dumbest posts on here
Right on cue burleigh comes up with a post that shows stok was right on the money.
This "anti-elite" bullshit has been going on for decades now. We've had a bunch of shock jocks, conservative politicians, and tabloid hacks sneering at educated people. They've found a willing audience of dunderheads who have zero expertise in subjects, so their default position is dismiss the experts' opinions. Normal sane people don't do that. They admit their lack of knowledge and learn more from the experts.
Covid has really brought out the sneering ignorant loud-mouth idiots who tell the experts that they are wrong, stupid, or part of some giant conspiracy. Clive palmer is playing to this exact crowd. People like burleigh and co are Clive's useful idiots.
My theory is that about 5% of the population has an imbalance with the left and right sides of their brains making it impossible to understand the most simple basic facts and gives them a sense of self entitled superiority which leads them to truly believe that they are right and the rest of the world is wrong. This thread is just an outlet for a few sad antivaxxer cultists to get their daily fix of self gratification.
Yes Burleigh...humans have been vaccinating and studying vaccines for decades. I'm no expert but I'd say there would be tonnes of data of vaccinating against coronaviruses. Covid and its variants is new, and we're still learning. Only the idiotic loud mouths are the ones maki g sweeping absolute statements - just as VL said, people like Clive.
And the only embarrassing thing about natural immunity is how it's become a war cry for the barely literate anti vax crowd. Tell me, would you try to build natural immunity against HIV?
Stok wrote:Yes Burleigh...humans have been vaccinating and studying vaccines for decades. I'm no expert but I'd say there would be tonnes of data of vaccinating against coronaviruses. Covid and its variants is new, and we're still learning. Only the idiotic loud mouths are the ones maki g sweeping absolute statements - just as VL said, people like Clive.
And the only embarrassing thing about natural immunity is how it's become a war cry for the barely literate anti vax crowd. Tell me, would you try to build natural immunity against HIV?
Here we go, you're comparing Covid to HIV now. haha. It's new at-least, you peanuts normally go for Polio for your go-to scary disease and why we should vaccinate for a Covid with a 99% survival rate.
Natural Immunity is real, in fact if you've had covid you can get a six month break from your jab jab jabs. Thats 2 whole jabs you can miss.
Although a think a few of you will have withdrawals
Yes, comparing it in the sense that can't blindly rely on natural immunity for both viruses. You listen to experts and take their advice.
Old Dog is on the money...the real question is why do people who actually hold rational thoughts and listen to experts, post on this page....
Stok wrote:and there's nothing to indicate natural immunity is effective in anyway (just like say syphilis - which you can't build natural immunity too). So the recommendations are avoid getting covid, and get vaccinated first to reduce your risk, and booster after 4 months to further reduce risk.
Thats not true there have been a number of studies showing the body does gain natural immunity to Covid after infection, its even been said natural immunity may be better than vaccine immunity.
But natural immunity gained from wuhan or delta strain doesnt seem to work as well for Omicron, but Omicron immunity should work well for Omicron reinfection.
Also natural immunity just like vaccines wanes over time, with 6 months being the generally length of natural immunity.
If this variant becomes the dominant long term variant, then common sense suggest that for many people young and healthy, vaccines may not be all that necessary, while off course for high risk groups it would be silly not too that fuzzy line between the two groups will be up to the individual to decide, its one thing to get double jabbed, its another thing to get a boster every few months for god knows how long.
State Health Covid Script
Dr: "Handful of RATZ / Bundles of Toilet Paper / pack/s of Panadol & or Ibuprofen / Icypoles!"
State Health Frontline essential Woolies Dispensary
(No Masks are kept on the Premises)
Expert frontline Checkoutchick ...that's...
1 Chewed up half slobbered Pensioner's pet RAT (Mark Down) Says use by 2021! They all say that!
2 Sheets of Toilet Paper ..."Careful mate!"..."I saw him slip one...Lets get him...Quick! lock the door!"
2 Open Packs of crushed Panadol powder!
1' Ice Cube melting into 1 essential Hydralyte Covid Elixir...
You didn't touch the Lab test Grocery Divider bar did you! ...('Thanks Mate!') Wot! (Cough!) Doh!
That comes to $9, 999.99c please!...Are you collecting the silly AO Fake Exemption Certificates...'Nah!'
Real Creepy foreign Hoodie type stands drooling : "Can I have yer Exemption...I'm collecting them!"
VIP Angry Flash Mob : 'Hey! That creep looks like one of them illegal [AO people]...Let's get him!"
sypkan wrote:blindboy wrote:Let me just try and get the thread of the argument here. The ABC has conspired with big pharma to push us all to take unnecessary booster shots, which as burleigh has pointed out, we actually need to reduce our chances of getting infected by omicron beacuse we are already protected, by two shots, from serious disease, but sypkan seems to believe that it's all antifa's fault, apart, of course, from the ABC, who are doing Morrison's messaging which is a bit confusing.....as usual for Scotty (black today, white tomorrow) while gsco just disagrees with everybody about everything? Is that somewhere near the stage of the discussion?
sigh...
'conspired' ...bigger sigh...
work that nyt / guardian narrative harder bindboy...
no, abc has taken on the role of responsible government messager in a pandemic, as you'd expect... and .as it does in fires and floods etc....
however, rather typically in the modern context... it has taken on a hyper tribalist stance... much in line with all of the other nice middle class pandering 'left wing', self proclaimed 'responsible outlet' media sources...
so much so, that even former employees like chris uhlman and others have felt the need to comment on the one track narrative and massive peer pressure within media to stick to that narrative...
antifa have also taken a very vocal pro vaccine stance, pretty much right from the start... and much like the rest of their dogma, they've taken a very fascist robot 'you must comply' tactic with that stance... which is rather ironic to say the least...
again...
it's fucken embarrassing enough they would go there initially... not to mention their 'freedumb fighter' opposing protests (that struggle to get 50 odd crew... against crowds of thousands and thousands...)
but with the new developments, both in terms of the virus and vaccines... and some pretty moderate reasonable commentators now saying, we've pretty much all just been fed misleading big pharma propaganda for a good 12 months or more...
well, it is rather embarrassing
for all those young(ish), once cool, edgelord, 'fuck the system' anarchist types...
just sayin
but a cunny's gotta cun...
Ha ha i was thinking about that the other day about ANTIFA, pro vax stance, its not very anarchist like, but as we know they are all full of complete contradictions, if Trump had stayed in power and pushed vaccines as he was and the trump crowd were more into vaccines, then they most likely would have been saying vaccines are part of the whole fascist BS as come from the government.
BTW. that facebook video didnt work, seems its taken down
Just curious Burleigh. Have you had your kids vaxxed on the standard diseases (non covid)?
Fair points in the most part Indo. Things could gave been done better at many levels across the board. I don't think too many people are deliberately trying to fcuk things up, just some are naturally better at it than others
Chris Uhlman is a Morrison/LNP courtier. A propagandist Catholic conservative who lost any credibility aeons ago.
Stop referencing fucknuckles like him and Hildebrand as authoritative.
I will take you more seriously then
just sayin'
I've created a spreadsheet forecast which I'll update as we go..
There's also a website with live running data.. https://sites.google.com/view/stayhomeaustralia