Australian churches, Victoria, Qld, ACT, New Zealand offer sanctuary to asylum seekers

winkie wrote:

All followers of this religion have been commanded to kill everyone who is not of this faith.

Oh yeah?

A billion a year is nowhere near the true figure
The oz taxpayer is being so under informed

I was answering happy as question of compatibility of islamic cultures with western society, and yes all
followers of allah have been commanded to kill everyone who is not of this faith so they can go to heaven.

You're wrong.

I was more referring to islamic cultures rather than the koran itself (spelling?). You know, how people live, their values and specifically their views on rights. any interpretation needs to be country specific as islam cant be painted with a single brush.

No, you are wrong, suggest you read The Story Of Mohammed- Islam Unveiled by Harry Richardson. or read
Islam- Be Informed, available by contacting The Concerned Citizens P.O. Box 9091 Wyee, N.S.W.2259.

winkie wrote:

No, you are wrong, suggest you read The Story Of Mohammed- Islam Unveiled by Harry Richardson. or read Islam- Be Informed, available by contacting The Concerned Citizens P.O. Box 9091 Wyee, N.S.W.2259.

Are you off you head Winkie? Maybe just pathologically paranoid? 'Cos some of the things you've said and profess to believe are just plain stupid, there's simply no other way to put it.

And the opening headline on Harry Richardson's website betrays his agenda:

"Fighting against Islam? A new weapon is now available. Read The Story of Mohammed."

So rather than aiming for objectivity his book is a project with an end goal in mind. Ever heard of propaganda, Winkie?

There's no question that there are value clashes between various strands of Islam as practised today and western liberal democratic values.

...which is a little more moderate than "All followers of this religion have been commanded to kill everyone who is not of this faith."

Yeah ya probably right! Thanks for putting me straight nothing to worry about then hey?
Lucky we have such informed people to pull us paranoid ones into line.

Worrying about something is one thing. Thinking every Muslim is going to kill you while espousing playground-level propaganda is something else.

Most refugees on Nauru are Christian so no need for islamaphobia from that lot

Good waves on nauru
Only 8k for a visa
Bargain

Not when I was there. Looked like shallow closeouts everywhere around the reef.

Nah free ride
There's waves most definitely

Fella from down this way works security there and says it goes alright. No classic reef passes but plenty of bends to handle any swell direction. He surfs almost every day.

oz government pays narau $1000 month per refugee visa fees, plus other stuff, way over $1bil

8k might be tourist visa, should keep the crowds down

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2015/may/22/australia-has-paid...

from winkle

Muslim men have been marrying aboriginal girls to have children who can then make land claims

they might also be having sex and babies and stuff because they like each other as well, that's how it usually works

which would mean muslims might just be compatible with modern multicultural Australia, Anthony mundine certainly thinks so. I'm very close to an afghan family that's been in the oz desert for generations, the original camel hearders, that developed into the most aussie cultured people you could meet, it's no surprise they're having sexual relations with aboriginals, they live together they're family. islam has been in Australia for eons, it's just no one noticed til September 11

geez winkle if you want to islam bash you could find a better source than that, it's really not hard to cherry pick.

Religion, race or skin colour is not a factor for me in the debate (Asylum seekers, offshore detention, border control, in what ever order you like).

I don't even have an interest in discussing religion in regard to the issue its about as relevant to the debate than if they are meat eaters or vegan.

but the real question is happyases'

c. we as a nation are mature enough to be a true melting pot of culture without going apeshit on the streets.

not at the moment, people are alll over the shop

reality is, legit. refugee or not 12 000 one off ,or allocated yearly intake, for decades to come, the vast majority are going to be muslim as that's where's fucked at the moment, as sheepdog has so convincingly pointed out, we have a responsibility either way because we fucked it, so accept it and get on with it

Gents, maybe slight off topic but should we expect that whatever migrants are settled in Aus, comply with Aus laws ? Agree race, color or religion should not be relevant in migrants. And of course they are not at present. But there do seem to be conflicts with the way we expect women to be treated, children also. And of course how the society itself is accepted.

Stunts

If old security mate reckons he surfs everyday on nauru I would say he's full of shut
He must be surfing some secret spot a lot and charging hard over shin deep razor sharp reef by himself
He must love surfing onshore crud also
He's smoking crack cobber

inzider wrote:

Stunts

Thats a first;)

Shit! A surfer talking up the waves!

Too true Stunet.

Fact : Surfers talk shit about surfing.

Can't be denied.

Makes my blood boil too be honest.

I remember taking this joker surfing one time and he just talked shit up the entire way there - " I did this " , " I did that ".

Fucking wanker.

But it was quickly forgotten as I pulled up on the headland into the buffeting gale. I got out of the car and stared into the tempest of wind and rain , my brow furrowing as I searched for THE swell that would provide the wave I'd been born to ride.

Could this be the day of days?

Amongst the fury I finally spotted a swell worthy of my blood red 14'6" tube stinger, my breath frozen in my chest as I realised that I'd come to the pivotal moment....

There are two pretty good spots that I've surfed.
Both on their day are quite heavy and scary.
A lot of the island is unsuitable due to large coral pinnacles
You can only surf safely from mid to high tide.
Low tide is ridiculous.
You don't want to visit the A&E dept that is for sure.
Golden staff is a permanent resident.
Google mening district
It's pretty obvious where the surf reef is.
They ain't interested in tourists either hence the massive visa fee
They busy farming people.

inzider wrote:

Most refugees on Nauru are Christian so no need for islamaphobia from that lot

is that actually true? what about manus island?

Yes there are several hundy Iranian christians on Nauru with a mix of pakistanis afganis africans etc.
The iranians are really nice people , bloody hard workers, cant work out why oz dosnt want them, they like a beer, a barby and a good yarn. None want a bar of oz now and want to be settled somewhere else like NZ but they are stuck in limbo, pretty grim, some have been here for 3 years.

When I went to the asylum seeker learn to surf thingie I mentioned a couple of pages ago, I got talking to two brothers from Iran. They told me their stories and what they wanted to do here as I was thinking about a story. Unfortunately it's kinda hard to write about asylum seekers as they can't be identified so I asked these fellas what pseudonyms they'd like to use.

"Matthew," said the first, while the second said he'd like to be called "John".

Though I didn't ask, I'm pretty sure 'Matthew' and 'John' weren't Muslim.

inzider wrote:

Yes there are several hundy Iranian christians on Nauru with a mix of pakistanis afganis africans etc.
The iranians are really nice people , bloody hard workers, cant work out why oz dosnt want them, they like a beer, a barby and a good yarn. None want a bar of oz now and want to be settled somewhere else like NZ but they are stuck in limbo, pretty grim, some have been here for 3 years.

It's not exactly about if Oz likes them or if they are good people, it's the precedent it sets if they are settled in Oz.

3 Years is nothing compared to the time some refugees spend in refugee camps, some refugees spend 10, 15, 20 years even if they have applied to be resettle and may never be resettled.

thats interesting....back in 2013 the UNHCR noted that the large majority at manus island detention were muslim, i read somewhere else that its much the same at present.

were christians and muslims largely sent to different camps?

happyasS wrote:

inzider wrote:

Most refugees on Nauru are Christian so no need for islamaphobia from that lot

is that actually true? what about manus island?

I have no knowledge of MAnus

indo-dreaming wrote:

inzider wrote:

Yes there are several hundy Iranian christians on Nauru with a mix of pakistanis afganis africans etc.
The iranians are really nice people , bloody hard workers, cant work out why oz dosnt want them, they like a beer, a barby and a good yarn. None want a bar of oz now and want to be settled somewhere else like NZ but they are stuck in limbo, pretty grim, some have been here for 3 years.

It's not exactly about if Oz likes them or if they are good people, it's the precedent it sets if they are settled in Oz.

3 Years is nothing compared to the time some refugees spend in refugee camps, some refugees spend 10, 15, 20 years even if they have applied to be resettle and may never be resettled.

So why not let them settle in NZ like we offered, oh thats right they might one day get citizenship and get to OZ that way which will then set off another que jumping epidemic via NZ, meanwhile all your 12000 syrians walk straight in with Your 457 scammers, students, rich people etc etc etc . Seems fair, NOT. Farming people is just plain wrong no matter what the political agenda. You tax payers are paying over a million dollars a year per refugee to have their lives and their childrens completely fucked over. The policy is so cooked.

inzider wrote:

indo-dreaming wrote:

inzider wrote:

Yes there are several hundy Iranian christians on Nauru with a mix of pakistanis afganis africans etc.
The iranians are really nice people , bloody hard workers, cant work out why oz dosnt want them, they like a beer, a barby and a good yarn. None want a bar of oz now and want to be settled somewhere else like NZ but they are stuck in limbo, pretty grim, some have been here for 3 years.

It's not exactly about if Oz likes them or if they are good people, it's the precedent it sets if they are settled in Oz.

3 Years is nothing compared to the time some refugees spend in refugee camps, some refugees spend 10, 15, 20 years even if they have applied to be resettle and may never be resettled.

So why not let them settle in NZ like we offered, oh thats right they might one day get citizenship and get to OZ that way which will then set off another que jumping epidemic via NZ, meanwhile all your 12000 syrians walk straight in with Your 457 scammers, students, rich people etc etc etc . Seems fair, NOT. Farming people is just plain wrong no matter what the political agenda. You tax payers are paying over a million dollars a year per refugee to have their lives and their childrens completely fucked over. The policy is so cooked.

Yeah thats what they do say about the NZ thing, personally i think its a low risk, sure wages are low but its still a very nice developed country.

BTW. Why no mention of PNG or Cambodia as settlement options?…Good enough for PNG and Cambodia population but not refugees?

There all important issues you mention, but i think the border control issue is still more important.

indo-dreaming wrote:

inzider wrote:

indo-dreaming wrote:

inzider wrote:

Yes there are several hundy Iranian christians on Nauru with a mix of pakistanis afganis africans etc.
The iranians are really nice people , bloody hard workers, cant work out why oz dosnt want them, they like a beer, a barby and a good yarn. None want a bar of oz now and want to be settled somewhere else like NZ but they are stuck in limbo, pretty grim, some have been here for 3 years.

It's not exactly about if Oz likes them or if they are good people, it's the precedent it sets if they are settled in Oz.

3 Years is nothing compared to the time some refugees spend in refugee camps, some refugees spend 10, 15, 20 years even if they have applied to be resettle and may never be resettled.

So why not let them settle in NZ like we offered, oh thats right they might one day get citizenship and get to OZ that way which will then set off another que jumping epidemic via NZ, meanwhile all your 12000 syrians walk straight in with Your 457 scammers, students, rich people etc etc etc . Seems fair, NOT. Farming people is just plain wrong no matter what the political agenda. You tax payers are paying over a million dollars a year per refugee to have their lives and their childrens completely fucked over. The policy is so cooked.

Yeah thats what they do say about the NZ thing, personally i think its a low risk, sure wages are low but its still a very nice developed country.

BTW. Why no mention of PNG or Cambodia as settlement options?…Good enough for PNG and Cambodia population but not refugees?

There all important issues you mention, but i think the border control issue is still more important.

Hit the people smugglers , not the people

Ambulance at bottom of cliff

sypkan wrote:

but the real question is happyases'

c. we as a nation are mature enough to be a true melting pot of culture without going apeshit on the streets.

not at the moment, people are alll over the shop

reality is, legit. refugee or not 12 000 one off ,or allocated yearly intake, for decades to come, the vast majority are going to be muslim as that's where's fucked at the moment, as sheepdog has so convincingly pointed out, we have a responsibility either way because we fucked it, so accept it and get on with it

i do think we have a responsibility, but if we are talking about "doing the right thing" then we must be talking about 50-100k syrians per year in the present crisis. and in my mind we should accept that muslim persons intake from the ME would need to continue for quite some time, maybe even 15 years or perhaps more - 40 years more likely? its natural for immigrants to bring with them their cultural ways and i would expect no less of them. so how do we ask that immigrants try to meet our expected value systems, can we even expect it? and no doubt there are some stark differences on certain topics....democracy, gender equality, sexual liberalisation, and secularism.

indo-dreaming wrote:

inzider wrote:

indo-dreaming wrote:

inzider wrote:

Yes there are several hundy Iranian christians on Nauru with a mix of pakistanis afganis africans etc.
The iranians are really nice people , bloody hard workers, cant work out why oz dosnt want them, they like a beer, a barby and a good yarn. None want a bar of oz now and want to be settled somewhere else like NZ but they are stuck in limbo, pretty grim, some have been here for 3 years.

It's not exactly about if Oz likes them or if they are good people, it's the precedent it sets if they are settled in Oz.

3 Years is nothing compared to the time some refugees spend in refugee camps, some refugees spend 10, 15, 20 years even if they have applied to be resettle and may never be resettled.

So why not let them settle in NZ like we offered, oh thats right they might one day get citizenship and get to OZ that way which will then set off another que jumping epidemic via NZ, meanwhile all your 12000 syrians walk straight in with Your 457 scammers, students, rich people etc etc etc . Seems fair, NOT. Farming people is just plain wrong no matter what the political agenda. You tax payers are paying over a million dollars a year per refugee to have their lives and their childrens completely fucked over. The policy is so cooked.

Yeah thats what they do say about the NZ thing, personally i think its a low risk, sure wages are low but its still a very nice developed country.

BTW. Why no mention of PNG or Cambodia as settlement options?…Good enough for PNG and Cambodia population but not refugees?

There all important issues you mention, but i think the border control issue is still more important.

Can be dangerous for some in PNG e.g. homosexuality is illegal and can carry a jail term of over a decade in PNG.

Both are very poor countries.

I wonder what are 'our expected value systems'? I am pretty sure even the people on this forum have stark cultural differences in regards to 'democracy, gender equality, sexual liberalisation, and secularism.' Australia has a long history of a myriad of stark cultural differences from the time Australia's settler peoples colonised the peoples and places already here.

There's some evidence dialogue seems to equal some moderation and getting along. The people trying to get here are diverse in cultural beliefs and mores, just as the mob already here are.

clif wrote:

I wonder what are 'our expected value systems'? I am pretty sure even the people on this forum have stark cultural differences in regards to 'democracy, gender equality, sexual liberalisation, and secularism.' Australia has a long history of a myriad of stark cultural differences from the time Australia's settler peoples colonised the peoples and places already here.

There's some evidence dialogue seems to equal some moderation and getting along. The people trying to get here are diverse in cultural beliefs and mores, just as the mob already here are.

sure, there's cultural differences here, but the collective narrative in australia on these matters is strong at this time. abbott fucked up the narrative a bit and temporarily reignited the dark ages, but that wankers gone now. differences? i read that 15% of women are "married off" before their legal age in iran. and thats the official figure so its likely to be higher. we cant ignore cultural differences if we are going to provide the humanitarian intake thats needed. the soln isnt some 1500 people stuck in png. some of the predictions about the future mass exodus out of syria are astounding. its a dogs breakfast like several other countries. you right about one thing, dialog, in my mind enough of it fixes anything. but i dont think australia is even having that dialog.

so dealing with that marriage age when people arrive is worth thinking about, right? denying people entry who have no choice in regards to such - e.g. the young women - seems to me to be a bit back-to-front.

no need to convince me mate, im not denying anyone. tell it to the govt

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-09-08/christians-to-get-priority-in-syri...

It probably should be pointed out to anyone out there thinking we are in risk of being overrun by muslims or islam that of all the official religions Islam is the second least represented in Australia.

Amazing the No religion percentage is so low though.

Religion in Australia as declared in the census (2011)[1]

Roman Catholicism (25.3%)
Anglicanism (17.1%)
Other Christian (18.7%)
Buddhism (2.5%)
Islam (2.2%)
Hinduism (1.3%)
Other religions (1.2%)
No religion (22.3%)
Not stated or unclear (9.4%)

Yeah, I think thats right from what I remember. But we are about to have a new census, so lets see what the 2016 figures are. I suggest there would be changes in the last five years. This year they are planning to do online census counts - a big change. Hope its accurate.

Australias population growth - good or bad thing ?

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/bob-carr-calls-for-australian-immigration-to-b...

Blowin wrote:

Australias population growth - good or bad thing ?

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/bob-carr-calls-for-australian-immigration-to-b...

Maybe from a economic point of view its a good thing.

But from a quality of life perspective it's a bad thing and from an environmental perspective its a bad thing.

Blowin wrote:

Australias population growth - good or bad thing ?

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/bob-carr-calls-for-australian-immigration-to-b...

Suggest its not a good thing. Mainly because governments now do not build infrastructure to manage the increase. Hence I am not sure its even a positive economic value.

But its inevitable. Already there is little agreement on the numbers for migration.

Just a correction:

I said in one of my post Naru refugees are free to leave the detention centre (or concentration camps as some uneducated people refer to them) between 9:00 am to 9:00 pm, it seems this changed a while back to free to go as they please 24/7.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-03/nauru-to-grant-asylum-seekers-full...