Shark Stories
If things are happening antidotally then we should be able to find a cure for it.
Disagree @basesix.
We all have basic needs. And we have want's on top of that.
We don't need to be in the ocean. We want to be in it.(mostly purely for recreation).
The shark cannot survive without being in the ocean. We can.
It's their domain.
Kinda disagree with the premise of most of your post.
Doesn't mean you're wrong. Just not how i see things.
Cheers.
Also not sure exactly what makes a shark a 'fuckwit' but i do know what makes a human one and there's way more of them on this planet.
think I disagree, too @southern.
just my inclination to push against popular sentiment.
especially when a recent thing has happened to a family.
AndyM wrote:If things are happening antidotally then we should be able to find a cure for it.
Ha, wasn't even close was I (anecdotal)
Yes i figured as such. ha.
Yes also agree i've softened on some of my hardline stance on the topic but still maintain my fundamental belief that it is their home, and we have to work around that....what ever that part of it means, which is the key i guess.
Something that has bugged me in all this 'science research' that's been going on is that there's been a void of proper scientific research from the day they gained protection status. It's almost like the scientists waited until attacks started to become a regular thing that 'vigourous' scientific research was set in motion. Which now means we're being asked to be patient while scientists try to 'understand' the population sizes and their behaviours and distributions. This sort of thing should have been happening right back from 1995!!
I understand science takes time, but at the moment, time is of the essence to at least 'understand' that word again, the general gist of White Pointers. I feel the scientific community have let us down badly on this one. But hey, at least we know they'll attack a rubber seal being towed behind a boat so thats awesome!
Hope you're having a good one.
Population wise both Southern Blue Fin Tuna, and Mako Sharks are endangered, whereas great whites are vulnerable (IUCN Redlist). So from a conservation point of view its not a cause for concern to kill a few great whites. Especially considering a annual population growth rate of 2-6%, and that killing is not for commercial interests.
It's worth mentioning with that WA study, it didn't account for fisheries bycatch in that percentage. It's no secret that the surfers/fishers around Streaky, and ab divers around Port Lincoln have at times taken it up themselves to manage the local GW population to their best ability. But it's still very likely that GW population growth is upwards trending.
There is a paper by R. Philpott that's titled "Why Sharks May Have Nothing to Fear More than Fear Itself". Unfortunately it's behind paywalls unless you have academic access. One take away from it is that as public fear increases from attacks, it is less likely that sharks will be culled sustainable, regulated way. Essentially switching from a protect sharks mindset, to a shark killing witch-hunt mindset in the community.
From that paper, I'd argue its better in the long term to occasionally kill great whites around surf spots, so the issue doesn't become a larger political issue that may actually damage the GW population significantly.
In South Africa, Great Whites avoided areas because Orcas started to target them for their livers, and kill the shark. The literature is still out on this...but one would assume if you did the same for that stretch of coastline, Great whites would associate humans with death and avoid the area.
@southernraw what scientific research do you want on great whites?
Gotta wonder why the fatality rate is so high in SA.
eeeee wrote:@southernraw what scientific research do you want on great whites?
curious about:
shark responses to nz fur seals behaviour vs. aus fur seals behaviour,
(given there are fairly distinct zones that seem to suggest olive-colour/treble-squawks, etc might.. dunno..)
and why GeeDubs seem to eat stingray covertly..
and how toxin build-ups affect their cognition.
and whether the super-oxygenated wave-zone is a regular need, preference, or defended goldilocks territory for them.
and why toey hungry pregnant females are observed before attacks.. is there a lack of easy fattening food that once existed?
eeeee wrote:@southernraw what scientific research do you want on great whites?
Not sure if you read my post properly.
My point was that the research they're doing now on numbers and distribution etc, is research that should have been done in the years between the start of protection and now. Why did it take so long to get to this research? As far as i'm concerned they're playing catchup now on counting sharks and we all sit and wait for another 10 years twiddling our thumbs while they wait for the results of sharks that have finally been observed and tagged in the last 5 or so years.
Point being no one really has any idea at all how many Pointers are swimming around out there, and that's the scientific community dropping the ball when their first priority post protection should have been proactive measures in getting a thorough understanding of the numbers and keeping track of growth or decline. There's been nothing until recently.
eeeee wrote:Population wise both Southern Blue Fin Tuna, and Mako Sharks are endangered, whereas great whites are vulnerable (IUCN Redlist). So from a conservation point of view its not a cause for concern to kill a few great whites. Especially considering a annual population growth rate of 2-6%, and that killing is not for commercial interests.
It's worth mentioning with that WA study, it didn't account for fisheries bycatch in that percentage. It's no secret that the surfers/fishers around Streaky, and ab divers around Port Lincoln have at times taken it up themselves to manage the local GW population to their best ability. But it's still very likely that GW population growth is upwards trending.
There is a paper by R. Philpott that's titled "Why Sharks May Have Nothing to Fear More than Fear Itself". Unfortunately it's behind paywalls unless you have academic access. One take away from it is that as public fear increases from attacks, it is less likely that sharks will be culled sustainable, regulated way. Essentially switching from a protect sharks mindset, to a shark killing witch-hunt mindset in the community.
From that paper, I'd argue its better in the long term to occasionally kill great whites around surf spots, so the issue doesn't become a larger political issue that may actually damage the GW population significantly.
In South Africa, Great Whites avoided areas because Orcas started to target them for their livers, and kill the shark. The literature is still out on this...but one would assume if you did the same for that stretch of coastline, Great whites would associate humans with death and avoid the area.
Good info and post. Cheers.
Another say-nothing, garbage statistics article with zero relevance for surfers.
Wasn’t it??
ABC online is like the Women’s Weekly and The Guardian isn’t any better.
They just keep recycling the same old garbage.
At least we now know not to wear flashy jewellery in the water.
southernraw wrote:eeeee wrote:@southernraw what scientific research do you want on great whites?
Not sure if you read my post properly.
My point was that the research they're doing now on numbers and distribution etc, is research that should have been done in the years between the start of protection and now. Why did it take so long to get to this research? As far as i'm concerned they're playing catchup now on counting sharks and we all sit and wait for another 10 years twiddling our thumbs while they wait for the results of sharks that have finally been observed and tagged in the last 5 or so years.
Point being no one really has any idea at all how many Pointers are swimming around out there, and that's the scientific community dropping the ball when their first priority post protection should have been proactive measures in getting a thorough understanding of the numbers and keeping track of growth or decline. There's been nothing until recently.
I agree with the lack of research you point out.
However,
How many fish in the sea ?...they aint tagging them BUT they are tagging sharks.
So, I look at Dorsal each month and specifically at 3 "shark stations" that record the tagged Noahs when they swim past.These 3 stations are near places I paddle around at.
For every bull/tiger shark recorded there are 6-8 WHITES recorded.The tagging is well over 2000 and might be closer to 2500 by now(?).
I have no idea if Whites are the preferred shark to catch and tag but Bulls are abundant in the river systems above a certain latitude(Shoalhaven on E coast).River whalers are another name for Bulls, Tigers are predominantly a ocean shark,i cant ever remember reports of them in lakes and rivers(maybe the Bulls hunt them away?)
SO, whats the ratio of tagged sharks to untagged?????
1/10..I doubt that...1/100 I dont think thats close...1/1000..maybe???
AndyM wrote:At least we now know not to wear flashy jewellery in the water.
The guy that got bitten at Saltwater a few years back got hit on the wrist that had a silvery watch.It was a young juvenile White,apparently they will bite just about anything as they learn to hunt on the job.
There’s been at least one instance of a surfer wearing a watch or shiny jewellery, bitten on the hand at Balian in Bali, and several other bites to surfers. I was there in wet season yers ago, small bull sharks jumping out of the muddy water in the lineup every day. At first I thought the splashes were fish, the way Mullet jump, but deffo sharks.
Often Wonder about Stainless Leggie Swivels ?
I just thought that for an article with "there are ways to reduce risk when entering the water" in the headline, and considering it was written directly after a death, talking about not wearing shiny jewellery is really weak.
I was waiting for the journo to mention that you're more likely to get struck by lightning or die from a bee sting.
They mentioned that you're more likely to drown.
Considering the premise of the article, not helpful at all.
Actually the journo did give another way to reduce risk - don't stand on a wobbegong.
Or, don't surf in the warmer months.
Or the cooler months.
Or after rain.
Or in the dry season...
she wrote a good article last year "shark attacks more likely at popular beaches".
Yeah, that wobbegong one really got me.
It's the same thing every time- this journo looks in her early 20's, is from Brisbane and describes herself as a "festival head and binge watcher".
This is not a person who should be writing about the ocean or what lives in it.
haha fkn hell. What the hell.
Yep agreed! Dont step on a wobbegong and don't kick your cat!
According to her Linkedin profile, her "creative exegesis" has seen her published in Girlfriend Magazine, so that's something.
I'm just really over fluffy lifestyle articles masquerading as news on the ABC and The Guardian.
Just lazy clickbait filler, day after day.
How many surfers really drown?
I guess the surfers that drown statistically would be older blokes after suffering some sort of medical episode. Pretty rare for a young, fit surfer to drown. Probs more likely to die by shark attack imo.
Exactly.
Australias drowning statistics are so bad because more and more people can't swim.
Both native born, but more particularly immigrants from the UK, India and China.
Whole families die because none of them can swim.
Absolute tragedy, but not relevant in any way as a comparison statistic to shark attack risk.
A few interesting stories on shark attacks and near misses on the Shark Shield report so I thought I would start this thread. Don't want to trivialize the subject as people have had their lives taken or changed forever by what can happen. I thought it might serve as an educational purpose by hearing others experiences so we may all learn from them and hopefully avoid it happening to us.
One of them was a mate of mine named Hazey.
He had been surfing at Castles, a notoriously sharky wave in the bay at Cactus.
Several hundred metres offshore the wave breaks before reforming into Inside Castles making a long left with several sections. The wave has been the scene of several attacks and near misses over the years including the local known as "Sharkbait" who had been attacked more than once.
Gerry Lopez is another who came very close to being attacked out there and vowed to never surf Cactus again after his near miss.
Well Hazey was surfing out the back with another bloke named Steve when out of the blue he was launched into the air still on his board by a huge force from below.
A shark had rammed him with a direct hit straight up into the air! In a moment it was gone but soon returned to the stunned Hazey and started biting him and his board. Hazey instinctively put his arms out to protect himself but both his arms ended up in its mouth. As the jaws closed down his arms could have easily been severed, but several teeth on the sharks lower jaw had become dislodged and imbedded in the board leaving his upper arms with massive injuries, but the vital inner arms where major arteries run were not majorly damaged. This probably saved his life.
By this time Steve had reacted and in a rush of adrenalin and pure ballsy courage he threw himself onto the sharks back and started gouging at the sharks eyeballs, eventually feeling one pop and the shark departed.
Steve got the two surfboards together and got himself and Hazey on and started the long paddle to shore.
Then they were both thrown into the air as the shark rammed them a third time before disappearing again. They continued to make their way closer to shore and the shark nudged them again. Steve told me he thought he really must of pissed it off when he popped its eye.
Finally they we're just a metre from shore when the shark made its fifth and final appearance. It beelined towards them and the shore while they stood in waist deep water with their boards. The sharks mouth was just rapidly opening and closing like one of those wind up sets of false teeth. The boys separated and put their hands on either side of it's body and held it on a 90 degree angle to the beach as they made the final steps to the safety of the sand.
Hazey was rushed to Ceduna hospital and then flown to Adelaide for micro surgery on his shredded arms.
Steve ended up receiving a bravery award and they both sold their story to 60 minutes and made $50,000 each out of it!
It was quite a story!