COVID-19 Health System Overload Forecaster
I attended the Ballina Rally.
A few points.
1. It was huge. Thousands of people. Maybe 3 thousand? I dunno, lots.
2. Diverse crowd. I heard some local crew say it was mostly a rent-a-mob based in Byron/Mullum.
Maybe true, but still shitloads of people.
3. I went in because I wanted to hear the counter-narrative and see what ideas were being broadcast by the speakers at the rally, and to try and ascertain what kind of political constituency this was, or who would represent them politically.
4. I'm personally well acquainted with the MC/Rally organiser. I won't dox them here, even though it is very much part of the public record now.
They are very much involved in QAnon and Trump online discourses.
Does that matter?
Maybe not, but as an indicator of the level of online radicalisation and entry into silo-ed off information rabbit holes it may be significant depending on your world view.
They are also partnered to one of the wealthiest business people in the area.
That may also be irrelevant depending on your views.
I just note it here.
5. I stayed for three speakers.
The first was Mason Taylor, who has a mushroom business based in Mullum importing mushroom products from China and selling them as powders. He is also a "wellness educator"
I use these products, they are great in a coffee.
Mason rambled on, but the gist of what he said is found right on his website: "I do not look to institutions or ideologies to gain my identity: it arises from within and is forever evolving. I have strong convictions but I am not a part of your belief system. I take responsibility for my life and honour my committments. My choices are mine and I own them fully. My body, mind, Qi and Spirit is my compass. I accept and welcome being challenged, and do so of others, without projection. I am Sovereign. Are you?"
He's selling a T-shirt with Sovereign printed on it.
His talk was basically that ethos, peppered with a lot of "they say this and they think we are this.....a lot of posturing up against this "they", which I took to be the mainstream media, health, govt etc etc, although it was never fully explained.
He didn't really come up with any call to action or political directive.
Second speaker I saw was a Naturopath. I didn't catch her name.
The gist of her talk was that the human immune system is amazing and can fully heal itself.
Covid is basically harmless and a hoax.
I must have guffawed or grunted because the two people standing beside me, woman and man in their late 50's? Turned on me and a robust exchange followed.
She asked me if I was vaxxed?
I said yes.
She said, this isn't even a vax, you are shedding spike proteins and are a danger to other people around you etc etc.
She told me I was a brainwashed idiot and to stop watching the Channel 7 News at night.
The guy said he knows heaps of people who have been killed by the vax, no-one who has Covid etc etc.
We all know the talking points by now.
A guy in front of me, told me I should leave.
I said, this was my community, I live here and I had every right to be here to see what was happening.
He agreed.
The Third speaker I saw was Meryl Dorey.
Dorey is Australia's most well known anti-vaxxer and has run an organisation called AVN, (Aus Vaccination Network) for decades.
She actually sounded quite reasonable.
She made a case against mandatory vax etc etc.
Like Andy said, there was no clear-cut goals or set out political agenda.
I got a sense of an inchoate sense of anger and a willingness to gather together as a tribe.
It's very much a "you are either with us or against us vibe"
If you don't swallow the entire world view holus bolus, you are a brainwashed sheeple.
To be honest that level of polarisation concerns me.
Who represents their interests though?
Neither of the major parties.
Not the Greens.
The only explicit political support comes from Craig Kelly, Clive Palmer, Pauline Hanson, etc etc.
They may gather enough votes to be elected but their preferences will flow to the LNP, which means in effect it's a right wing movement, if not in aims, in it's effects.
I agree with Shorto though, this movement is far too big to be ignored.
There will be some downstream effects.
Experts told you if you complied with lockdowns, masks and vaccinations life would go back to normal.
Tin foil hat wearers like me and the 100s of 1000s at these rallies told you it was a scam and you would be put into a perpetual state of fear, propaganda and lockdowns.
Now tell me again Andy M who’s really dribbling shit?
Hey Freeride,
Palmers United Australia party preferences will go to Liberal Democrats.
https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/clive-palmers-united-...
Life seemed pretty normal to me.
Everyone drove their cars, they freely associated, said what they wanted, there was no police presence (that I could see).
I guess either side of the fence sees the other as fearful/paranoid and spreading propaganda/misinformation.
burleigh wrote:Hey Freeride,
Palmers United Australia party preferences will go to Liberal Democrats.
https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/clive-palmers-united-...
Cheers mate.
I think that only reinforces my point.
shortenism wrote:Experts told you if you complied with lockdowns, masks and vaccinations life would go back to normal.
Tin foil hat wearers like me and the 100s of 1000s at these rallies told you it was a scam and you would be put into a perpetual state of fear, propaganda and lockdowns.
Now tell me again Andy M who’s really dribbling shit?
No expert ever said that…no one expects you to be honest.
Thanks for the detail freeride. Good on ya for turning up and having a listen anyway.
The problem is on the one side you have a centuries old system with endless resources pushing a narrative via the TV and press conferences. On the other side Mum and dad naturopaths getting up on stage to to tell theirs. Who’s voice is getting heard... The odds certainly aren’t in the latters favour but fortune favours the brave.
burleigh wrote:Because this page was ignored yesterday. Here it is again. Jab Injuries Australia.
Have a read from some peoples stories VicLocal, Roadkill and the others.
https://www.instagram.com/jab_injuries_australia/
A lot different from the obese, elderly or other humans with comorbidities in ICU with Covid.
Hmmm something a bit odd here, these are the profiles of most of the females.
And one quite good looking girl didnt have her profile pic on main thing, so left her out.
Who said it then VL?
Looks like the friend requests I get every other day...
indo-dreaming wrote:burleigh wrote:Because this page was ignored yesterday. Here it is again. Jab Injuries Australia.
Have a read from some peoples stories VicLocal, Roadkill and the others.
https://www.instagram.com/jab_injuries_australia/
A lot different from the obese, elderly or other humans with comorbidities in ICU with Covid.
Hmmm something a bit odd here, these are the profiles of most of the females.
And one instagram screenshot link didn't work, can't be bothered trying to work out what profile it was, and one quite good looking girl didnt have her profile pic on main thing.
Don’t tell Burleigh.
He got suckered in hook, line and sinker.
hahahahahah
Thanks for the report FR - interesting . This weeks minefield episode on point here too. I'd be a bit shy of those mushroom products . Mate who is a produce buyer warned me off the cheap Chinese garlic - said you'd only have to see how it was grown .
Yeah, thanks for that report FR.
I don’t think Bitchute and Instagram are reliable sources. You know someone’s lost the plot when they cite these sources as evidence for their claims.
Craig wrote:Looks like the friend requests I get every other day...
About 10 years ago I said some bad things about israel on FB . Suddenly had a whole lot of friend requests, stalking and abusive comments from profiles like that. One of the reasons I left FB.
Speaking of israel...
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-28/israel-shuts-borders-to-world-omi...
Great report FR. Gotta take care with the guffaw at a freedom rally though, could have turned nasty. I chortled at one once and nearly didn't make it home.
Cherry picking again. Here's more you choose to ignore from the same page.
freeride76 wrote:burleigh wrote:Hey Freeride,
Palmers United Australia party preferences will go to Liberal Democrats.
https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/clive-palmers-united-...Cheers mate.
I think that only reinforces my point.
Freeride, not sure what you mean? Liberal Democrates are not the Liberal party.
nice rundown freeride
nice to not get a huff and puff and blow your house down version of events... for once... good onya...
interesting that the trumpy qanon stuff is tied in with the byron scene, as flakey as byron can be... i would have thought that's not really their flavour...
would love to sit down and have a chat with that first speaker and see how nutty their version of events is... i say this because, yes there's some extreme nuttyness around these 'narratives'.... but geez there's a lot of truth too!!
"They are also partnered to one of the wealthiest business people in the area.
That may also be irrelevant depending on your views.
I just note it here."
I don't think it is irrelevant
something I've noticed is a lot of small business people seem attracted to this stuff
purely self interest?
desperately seeking bigger explanations?
personality trait?
burleigh wrote:freeride76 wrote:burleigh wrote:Hey Freeride,
Palmers United Australia party preferences will go to Liberal Democrats.
https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/clive-palmers-united-...Cheers mate.
I think that only reinforces my point.Freeride, not sure what you mean? Liberal Democrates are not the Liberal party.
Where do the liberal democrats preferences go?
Thanks for the write up and analysis.
"The only explicit political support comes from Craig Kelly, Clive Palmer, Pauline Hanson, etc etc.
They may gather enough votes to be elected but their preferences will flow to the LNP,"
The people attending no doubt are genuine about their concerns but it would be no surprise to see that there is some string pulling and orchestrations going on in the back ground. The strategists in the LNP are no doubt very happy with the way things are panning out
Burleigh, do you really think that a former LNP premier and his party are going to support Labor or the Greens?
gragagan wrote:burleigh wrote:freeride76 wrote:burleigh wrote:Hey Freeride,
Palmers United Australia party preferences will go to Liberal Democrats.
https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/clive-palmers-united-...Cheers mate.
I think that only reinforces my point.Freeride, not sure what you mean? Liberal Democrates are not the Liberal party.
Where do the liberal democrats preferences go?
To the United Australia Party.
Fliplid wrote:Thanks for the write up and analysis.
"The only explicit political support comes from Craig Kelly, Clive Palmer, Pauline Hanson, etc etc.
They may gather enough votes to be elected but their preferences will flow to the LNP,"The people attending no doubt are genuine about their concerns but it would be no surprise to see that there is some string pulling and orchestrations going on in the back ground. The strategists in the LNP are no doubt very happy with the way things are panning out
Burleigh, do you really think that a former LNP premier and his party are going to support Labor or the Greens?
Their preferences are going to Palmers United Australia Party.
United Australia Party Chairman Clive Palmer has confirmed that the United Australia Party would exchange preferences with the Liberal Democrats in the Senate and the House of Representatives at next year’s federal election.
— United Australia (@UnitedAusParty) November 23, 2021
sypkan wrote:"They are also partnered to one of the wealthiest business people in the area.
That may also be irrelevant depending on your views.
I just note it here."I don't think it is irrelevant
something I've noticed is a lot of small business people seem attracted to this stuff
purely self interest?
desperately seeking bigger explanations?
personality trait?
possibly all 3.
in this case, very much so.
These are for Shortenism
@roadkill said "I have been in the vicinity of a rally, close enough to watch and listen. I have not attended a rally.
It was an interesting experience."
You're sounding less and less credible in your opinions roady. You either have been to one or not. Not in between.That's like me saying i've surfed, and when pressed saying, well i've been close to it so i get it, it's just alot of gesticulation and stuff. Or rooting. Been close to it so i'm an expert on it.
And yeah great report FR. Well reasoned as always. That sounds like a completely different crowd to the one down here on Sth Coast WA. But...that also explains why i left the area too. I feel for you having to put up with that and cop ridicule. Good on ya for showing up. Yep, can see extremes and polarisation on both sides.
Selfie or it never happened Andy M! :-P
Fair turn out. Would have had more impact in front of the big prawn though!
Good on you for heading down and checking it out.
You stuck around longer than I did Steve.
Good on you for snorting out a scoff and then having an engagement of the minds :)
So the thing was basically wellness and anti-vaccination - no deeper talk of politics or policies?
Can’t say I’m surprised.
It was mentioned earlier but the most recent minefield episode is highly recommended to further try to come to grips with all of this.
https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/theminefield/melbourne-pro...
Consensus seems to be that it’s another manifestation of disillusionment with government and the seeds have been planted for quite a long term run.
Disillusionment with government is understandable but I just wish these people could think straight.
The natural immunity thing as part of a broader anti-vaccination ideology is fucking embarrassing.
bluediamond wrote:Selfie or it never happened Andy M! :-P
Fair turn out. Would have had more impact in front of the big prawn though!
Good on you for heading down and checking it out.
I reckon you’d know that water slide mate!
That is clear as day Burleigh. If either party gets voted in, who do you think they will support with their votes in the senate? Labor or LNP? Answer that and you've got the end game
I came in the other way Andy.
Up North Creek, under Missingham Bridge and across the skate park, to the back of the amphitheatre.
Do you think my assessment was fair enough?
AndyM wrote:bluediamond wrote:Selfie or it never happened Andy M! :-P
Fair turn out. Would have had more impact in front of the big prawn though!
Good on you for heading down and checking it out.I reckon you’d know that water slide mate!
haha. Check!!
Ah there we go! Good on ya Andy but still shows no evidence it’s you? Anyway mute point.
I keep hearing 'diverse crowd' 'diverse crowd' 'diverse crowd'.... with no clear agenda... etc...
it's basically like the literal opposite of identity politics... which is probably what terrifies the left so much... hence the desperation to discredit the movement...
but it clearly is a movement, in the traditional sense of the term... a group of people who feel strongly about something, and come together, traditionally... organically...
which again, is basically the oppisite of the contrived contemporary left...
"Consensus seems to be that it’s another manifestation of disillusionment with government and the seeds have been planted for quite a long term run."
not just seeds... active rearing it would seem...
I think the one unifyiing factor is bullshit
people are so bloody tired of the bullshit. in this decades long age of spin, 'weasal words', and professional PR... both sides of politics have gone hard down the propaganda road... and whilst the internet should just undermine and correct this tendency - as it has - the machine has just gone harder in their attempts to 'control the narrative'...
it's just embarrassing some of the lies both sides of politics now try to pass off, or over, like it's not the case
it's become so perverse, and so pervasive, the whole system has become an exercise in mass public gaslighting
and sadly, I think the left go harder than the right!
"Disillusionment with government is understandable but I just wish these people could think straight.
The natural immunity thing as part of a broader anti-vaccination ideology is fucking embarrassing."
yeh, but I think it has moved well beyond this now, I'd say the 'natural immunity' crowd are like 10 % in your photos... the argument, and movement, has moved well on from there, these guys just got in on ground floor early...
the breadth of views re. the virus amongst these groups is just staggering
but a bit scary too... that there is such different realities amongst so many people with a common interest...
it goes from... the virus is fake ... a conspiracy ...just a cold ...is the flu ..is bat soup ...is an escapee ...is franken virus ...is china's revenge ...is biological weapon ..is population control ...is an elitist cull... etc. etc.
then, somehow... they all come together in the street against a common enemy...
bizarre to say the least
but I think it all comes back to...
the professionalisation and over utilisation of PR... propaganda basically...
the capture and corruption of the media... (which has totally voided their crucial role as the fourth estate)
and a scared weird inept and totally over-reactive political class...
where to from here?
it is exciting... but that division freeride sees is also quite scary...
we need a new internet
a legitinet...
where people, politicians, journalists, scientists etc. must actually face and answer their critics...
this social media silo model is dangerous
Well said Sypkan.
Just for context on my attendance yesterday too, it's the first rally/protest or any kind i've ever attended. Tend to steer clear of such things, both because i've always wondered the effectiveness of them, and because i was a little apprehensive of the kind of crowds that they'd attract.
It was also the first time to attend one for the two girls i went with, both with similar feelings.
After going, and getting a whack of the feeling that surrounded it, i wouldn't hesitate to attend another one for this particular movement/cause/desperation.
You're right. Its anger, discontentment, a feeling of not being heard and a feeling of having no voice to speak for them.
I think Freeride hit the nail on the head with that. There is no political movement, it's the political machine that is in place now that has left no space for an alternative. That's scary for alot of people. No voice over legitimate concerns about their health, wellbeing and financial security.
I'd be loath to ever vote for Pauline hanson, Clive palmer or Craig Kelly. But then who do i vote for as an alternative?? There is none. What i do know, is someone with true compassion and understanding of this current movement, with political savvy could step into this potential space and have a tidal wave of support.
freeride76 wrote:I came in the other way Andy.
Up North Creek, under Missingham Bridge and across the skate park, to the back of the amphitheatre.Do you think my assessment was fair enough?
Will put something down tonight instead of dictating into my phone.
shortenism wrote:Ah there we go! Good on ya Andy but still shows no evidence it’s you? Anyway mute point.
Mute point? Bloody love youse Shorto.
Fliplid wrote:That is clear as day Burleigh. If either party gets voted in, who do you think they will support with their votes in the senate? Labor or LNP? Answer that and you've got the end game
Depends how much power they will hold.
Another one:
It's not a political movement. It is a mass tantrum. The only beneficiaries of which are political opportunists like Palmer, Kelly, Hanson and Campbell Newman.
They all vote with the LNP in the Senate.
If they knew anything about freedoms they would be marching against the Religious Discrimination Act and Scott's new internet laws.
What are their demands? Take your pick.
Get the vax or don't. Just shut the fuck up. It's gotten very boring.
adam12 wrote:It's not a political movement. It is a mass tantrum. The only beneficiaries of which are political opportunists like Palmer, Kelly, Hanson and Campbell Newman.
They all vote with the LNP in the Senate.
If they knew anything about freedoms they would be marching against the Religious Discrimination Act and Scott's new internet laws.
What are their demands? Take your pick.
Get the vax or don't. Just shut the fuck up. It's gotten very boring.
I think the demands are very straight forward. No Vax mandate & no Vax passports. I don't give a fuck if it makes Clive Palmer more money.
I also think an enquiry into Australias Vax roll out and the corrupt premiers would be important
Next year when many of us start going back to Indonesia, I wonder if there will be protests outside the Indonesian embassies about the requirement to be vaccinated in order to enter their country.
Nothing to see here. Just another heart injury from the jab
You’re right, Burleigh. There should be an inquest into the federal government’s mismanagement of the covid pandemic. A few friends and family members who are medical professionals think that the government (and the media) is to blame for much of the cynicism and misinformation about covid and the vaccine, which has led to the situation we are in now where society has become divided.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-28/social-media-laws-online-trolls/1...
Not naming names (especially based on a few posts in last 12 hours etc etc) but jeez, Swellnet might have just had a load taken off their hands if this gets passed. Can probably get rid of the sin bin....nothing like being held ACCOUNTABLE for your words and posts on a public forum.
I've created a spreadsheet forecast which I'll update as we go..
There's also a website with live running data.. https://sites.google.com/view/stayhomeaustralia