Localism....should be more to do with how well you know and surf a wave shouldnt it? not living nearby if you're a kook.

Agreed. But chances are, to get to that stage of knowing a wave you probably live relatively close by anyway. Also, I think its worth mentioning the idea of 'getting in' with the locals. If you're consistently surfing a break and making an attempt to be friendly and get the know the other guys who are often out there, that counts just as much as how well you can or can't surf.

I tend to disagree, mostly because I'd rather dodge a local kook than battle it out with blowin shredders taking the best waves on the best day of the year. I've tried to explain the "rules" to my partner before and she shook her head in disbelief saying it makes no sense at all and really I had to laugh and agree with her. Surfers are weird and there's far too many of us these days!

Thought about discussing this but it made head ache so stopped.

yes

Nah locals are locals no matter surfing ability a learner,a kook, a young ripper, a mid age tube master, or an old washed up cruiser that was often one of the best surfer in his day at his local are all locals.

When travelling in Aust i tread carefully and try to respect all and find my spot in the line up.

Decent non local surfers to rippers from elsewhere always get more waves anyway as have the advantage of ability and confidence plus if they have surfed the wave a bit knowledge of the wave, they often tend to get respect from locals anyway.

Plus being a local doesn't mean you have a right to snake or drop in you still need to wait your turn, it just means you have the advantage of local knowledge and ideally a little respect from other locals and outsiders.

But of course the old question is who is a local, live at that beach, live in the area, the postcode? And then how long does it take to become a local?

groundswell you should take a trip to the north shore and go repeatedly drop in on a learner at V-land.
I’m assuming you’d surf better than him, so you have more right to the waves than him.
Report back and let us know how it went.

Good points Indo. Down here in Tassie some of the best waves are in areas where very few if any surfers live at all, so local status is somewhat meaningless. The wave that is our jewel in the crown has people claiming local status that live half way up the mountain in Hobart about 80k away haha.

Head ache gone. Pretty simple. If you are a well known face in the line up, you will know the wave better and the crowd will know you and as a result will almost certainly pick up more waves as a result and be accepted in doing so irrespective of where you live. Being overly greedy is not cool though no matter what your residential status or level of surfing ability but is especially rude if you are a rare or first time visitor. It is not a technical thing - most humans sense when they have stepped over the line in a social situation and ease back. The few who don't should not resort to their postcode to justify bad behaviour.

Kooks are okay - you don't have to rip - but people who blow take offs over and over are not popular no matter where they live and should choose an easier spot or be content with scraps. If you are crap at takeoffs you need to work on that to have a comfortable place in scarce quality waves anywhere and to be able to position yourself to get waves inside the pack.

Frog for PM

Nailed it Frog.

Surf etiquette, localism, how the lineup works etc simply comes down to awareness.

Awareness of your own ability, the vibe of the lineup, the locals who you shouldn't interfere or hassle with, those who you can push a little for sets, the ones who aren't competent and are pushing too deep for their ability etc.

Being observant and switched onto any change to the vibe in the water is also very useful.

And lastly awareness of what the ocean is doing, deep ones, wide ones, double ups, who wants what etc. All part of the game which keeps it constantly fresh.

I know of one where you surf Craig that sees himself as the enforcer and is a total kook,not cool.

The surfing line-ups are one of the purest "survival of the fittest" or self regulating competitive social environments on earth. It is pretty amazing how it all "sort of works" for most. I watched a clip of Rincon in California on a good swell on youtube the other day showing how it all happens in a fairly intense line-up.

Very crowded. Quite a lot of bad drop-ins and interesting decisions by surfers as they dealt with the crowd situation (most appear fatalistic). Worth watching as there are lots of long shots giving a sense of the wave - not the usual close-ups (well done to the photographer). The waves are beautiful. Being a local would not help much there in terms of home address. Being familiar with the wave, competent and tactical would get you a few. What a crazy sport to have to deal with that though. What we all forget is that those who stick with surfing are just the tip of the iceberg in terms of those who tried and gave up or did it for a while or a long time and then gave up. It is a tough gig in most locations to have the balance between fun and hassle work in your favour. It takes skill, persistence, fitness and brains. From a selfish point of view that escape valve is fantastic. Otherwise every line up would be unbearable. So, if you are getting pissed off, quit and play golf, we won't miss you and your life will be happier....

Frog, that video was mesmerising. Cheers.

Wow 26s, 4th in line, some kook without a leggy, tried to get up, fails and then the board continues on and nearly takes out the guy who is deepest legs!

...and that's just the very beginning.

What's every bit as staggering as the crowds is the view count: 105,000+ for a raw clip.

I guess the two stats go hand in hand.

1 view for each person out there.

My wife has no interest in taking up surfing when she hears* about all the politics. I try to explain surf etiquette like road rules, when everyone follows them it's all good but it just takes one dickhead to run a red light...

(*is forced to listen)

Haha imagine being that much of a cock-head that you paddle out into that crowd, without a leggy, and you can't even pop up on a super clean 2-3ft wave

Right! Dx3.

haha awesome story. Love to hear those stories

Stu, with that Rincon video there is a real story to be told (perhaps an article by you) about what huge numbers of surfers want to watch.

All we get are the carbon copy tight focus, fast edits, with only the hottest known surfers, often cutting out takeoffs, wipeouts and less than peak moments. Plus over use of slow motion.

Whereas the Rincon video mimicked the view we all love as we sit on a point or walk back out after a wave watching the line up as it unfolds with good and not so good surfers catching waves. We also love the more distant line up shots giving a feel of the way it breaks. So often we get 6 seconds of the line up view then bang it is in close

I don't know how content works on swellnet but a feature on the video and a story on the way it was filmed and edited might go down well.

Video makers take note. Of course if the waves become the stars they have to be really really good.

I've been mulling over that issue myself Frog, but more about the rise and rise and rise of the raw videos. There's 3 videographers (at least two of them non-residents) in Bali posting long, barely edited videos of waves that gets thousands of a views a day. There's a few more in other parts of Indo, as well as some in Hawaii and the states. I've seen one of them filming at Ulus and he sat there for hours and hours and I can't for the life of me understand why.

Hilarious story Groundswell, though I bet at the time it was anything but funny haha.

I have surfed all over this beautiful country of ours, and a good few spots around the world and I have never had any trouble getting my share in most places without too much trouble (except that one time I almost got shot in Mexico....but that's another story). I think its all about the attitude you bring to the session, here are a few things I've learnt that help:
- bring good energy to the lineup, smile at people and say hello
- paddle out wide first and watch a couple sets go through (this lets the guys waiting get theirs and also gives you perspective on where to sit)
- this time to "observe" will also give you an idea of who is who in the lineup
- ask a couple of old mates "do you want this one?" showing you're happy to share
- hoot and celebrate if someone gets a good one
- and when you finally get one.......dont blow it!!!!! and then paddle back out slowly and wide (nobody likes the @rse hole who froths and paddles like a maniac straight up the inside to the top of the peak)

Bring good energy and a postitive attitude and you will get your fill......except at the superbank where its dog eat dog......put your mongrel hat on and get yours hahaha

great advice Kooklife.

amazing to me how many frothing kooks paddle out like rabid dogs, try and take the inside and then whinge like little bitches when they get dropped in on by someone who's been sitting there waiting patiently for an hour.

I think it's mixture of ignorance and entitlement.

At a certain spot that I know very well I love it when the frother jumps of the boat paddles straight inside everyone and expects the next set wave . I don’t say anything I just paddle inside them and slowly start heading up the reef , they always follow and I lead them about 75 meters up from the takeoff off zone then let them paddle past me and I then head back to the zone lol They fall for it every time and just can’t handle anymore sitting inside them and further out . Usually have a good laugh when they attempt to take off and a just way to deep then get smashed and washed in over reef then it’s along way back around to the channel to paddle out again. Some wake up but most don’t.

"bring good energy to the lineup, smile at people and say hello"

It may seem obvious, but a few years ago I learnt this lesson in a pretty harsh way. 36 hour haul, much of it awake, and I rocked up to an off-the-radar coastline frequented by a bunch of gnarly expats - or at least I'd been warned they were gnarly.

Between the aforementioned warning and my fatigue I played it very cool when arriving. SA desert training told me to put my head down, say nothing, act invisible.

Turned out to be the worst thing I could've done. If the expat crew were upset to see a new face, they were positively livid when the stranger ignored them.

Even left them alone to surf a wave for a while before slowly paddling out and sitting down the line. One fella caught a long one, then came up behind me in a huff. His movements could be read as nothing other than hostility and I braced for the inevitable showdown. I'd transgressed, that much was clear, but my mistake was to assume what I'd done.

“You uncivilised pig!” He roared at me.

"You no say hello?!”

Took me a while to register that I was in shit, not because I'd intruded, but because I wasn't friendly enough. That was a first.

Take home message for me was ALWAYS say g'day or acknowledge locals (or people who've been there longer). Don't assume you know what they're thinking. If you do get rebuffed...well, at least you know the state of play and you can claim the high moral ground if things head south.

After he called you an uncivilised pig I can imagine he farted in your general direction.

No mention of hamsters or elderberries but it was the most civilised spray I'd ever received.

Localism is mostly a social function, ratrher than based on skill. I'd say 80% social, 20% skill.

The social side is quite simple, and somewhat childish. It's either you in or you're out. An alpha or a beta. You naturally blend with people/crowds well, and can make friends, or you can't. Maybe you're lucky that your group of friends actually all surf and you live close by. Maybe you fell into it through family. Point is, if you're that type of person, you'll become a local fairly easily.

You may also be a strong personality who is able to exude an image of a local simply by the way you carry yourself - this is the case for locals who are more lone wolfs.

Surfing ability is a small piece of the pie when considered to the above.

to be honest , I'd say that describes workplaces more than line-ups, which are far more ruled by skill, competence and experience.

And desire.

if you want something you gravitate towards it and eventually get good at it, become established at it.

Thats probably the biggest factor, by far.

What about someone like Baddy at Angourie, he had the locals completely bluffed.
Every time I saw him out there he would sit furthest out and take every set wave, and when he was paddling back out he would always call people into waves yelling out "go mate''.
There was another guy John who the locals nicknamed ''the owner'' because he would paddle back out up the inside every time.
So many strategies all based around wave greed.

Greed?
Baddy called me into so many set waves at Angas.

I wouldn't even paddle out unless he was there.

I got called into a set by Baddy at Anga, nice bloke, wanted to talk about my board.(vanguard). Quite the opposite to Nat Young who told me to “fuck off”.

Which brings us to the next point. If ya wanna be the hard nut, mouthy local, you'd better be able to punch on (and also enjoy it). Someone will call you out one day sure as shit.

Nat's lack of skill in that department was laid bare for all to see.

I heard that the bloke who renovated Nats face would chase Baddy out of the water.

I can never get my head around what makes a grown adult be arsed with being and maintaining the 'hard c@#t' image.....

I am guessing groundswells question originates from an experience with some bra boys shoulder hopping a kurnell reef break, and wouldnt let anyone paddle deeper to the true take off spot

Some good points there kooklife.

At places that you jump off rocks etc. and you
could paddle straight to the inside i think you should always paddle wide first around those sitting deepest.

Can't stand it when guys jump off rocks and go straight for the inside, its just asking to be burnt.

yeah Baddy was pretty cool. God help you though if you didn't take off when he called you in to one. Iv'e seen him send plenty of people in for pulling back .

Groundswell I cant agree with you I know that area quite well and the notable
locals nobody referred to Terror like that he was always polite and respectful
and the best surfer out there.
My idea on locals simply is its not where your from its how much time and effort
you put in at a particular surf spot. It dosent give you the right to take every wave or dropin does give you the right to sit at the main take off spot and call out snakes
and drop kicks. Good locals are great just to keep order, perspective and keep the
line up in shape.

How funny is that groundswell a northern beaches surf reporter calls out
a southern beach surf god. I wonder what he says about his drumming even
though hes regarded as one of Australias best and international stars use
him services always that he lives too close to the coast to be a brilliant musician
they all come from out west. I think this is the reason I have very little time for humans.

It's always good to put a bit of time in on the B grade days at the quality more localised spots before paddling out on the A+ days i reckon. Put a bit of time in and get your head known a little. Normally you'll get to know a couple of crew which helps to feel a bit more welcomed. Tread lightly and like Stu said, always say G'day and initiate a little bit of chat.

ahhh saying G'day.... Being a local isn't all it's cracked up to be . Spending too long in in the carpark or surf check spot talking shit/n/shit to the crew when you just want to have a quick session can be a pain in the arse. Then trying to paddle 200m down the beach to another bank without running into one of the boys wanting to have a chat about his faarking job/car/holiday/boat/missus/the list goes on , or who did what at the pub last night.
So many lost waves greeting people.

yeah TS can relate to that .....throws me off talking to guys about shit ,end up losing focus,would rather ignor em or say gday and paddle away....

Re: the Rincon clip above, Stab has got an article on a man who died after a collision at Rincon, which is sad.

fwiw, I thought the recent superbank clip was way more crowded than the Rincon footage - maybe it was the excellent wide view?