What's what?
The children in detention situation is certainly a sad stain on Australia's reputation and proud history of post war settlement. But people, particularly from the extreme left, also conveniently have a poor memory and selective recollection. The chief architect of this avoidable catastrophe was the smug, virtue signaling Kevin Rudd who encouraged a surge out of Indonesia that resulted in at least 1200 people drowning. Pilots and crews in aerial surveillance believe the unofficial, under-reported figure, may be closer to double this! Rudd's disingenuous concern about refugees is a shocking disgrace and he would, even factoring in the hapless Billy McMahon, rate as the worst Prime Minister Australia has ever had. The whole episode resulted in 50,000 mainland arrivals with the concomitant family reunion chain migration of (at least) another 150,000 more - very difficult to get exact data on this.
'neglecting the written word in favour of individual illuminations by the Spirit are ignorant of the role which the Bible plays in the Pentecostal movement. Pentecostals live with the Bible. ... Many of them hardly read any books apart from the Bible'
'Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. [38] This is the first and great commandment. [39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. [40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets'
I studied theology, as Indigenous Australians understood Western Christianity's role in lying about them, hating them and beating the fuck out of them. In the name of God. Its in the constitution.
'The children in detention situation is certainly a sad stain on Australia's reputation and proud history of post war settlement.'
Is there any thing about lying, attempted genocide and stealing Australia from Traditional Indigenous Australians that isn't stained with blood, gun powder and hypocrisy?
Pentecostals. South Park on roids. What has hammering your neighbour and his kids and locking them up got to do with this?
'Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. [38] This is the first and great commandment. [39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. [40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets'
A fucking literal bible basher, bullshit artist idiot running the country. Its in liz's, the corgi's and phil's constitution. Again. Donny will love it.
Im not a fan of any religion I think they all suck some serious arse (well i kind of like Buddhism and Hinduism for the cool statues and artwork and ideals)
But i think people these days especially those with more left views are pretty hypocritical for any job including prime minister someones religion should be irrelevant and there is no way you guys would say the same things about him if he was a muslim or if he had traditional indigenous creation/afterlife beliefs.
You wouldn't dare attack these beliefs and if someone did they would be labeled as racist or bigots or some other label.
@ Crypto,
I undertook a year of Aboriginal studies at uni and am painfully aware of the genocidal policies of the past. It was illuminating as my formal early schooling had mostly been a depraved historical hagiograph to white settlement. This country lost 90% of its indigenous population by 1900; we still fail to full come to terms with acknowledging the sickening massacres around the continent that continued up until at least the 1930's. I hope a comprehensive treaty is established in the near future - as do many Australians. I stand by my comments on children in detention.
The point is dreamer, that Traditional Indigenous Australians followed through with their core beliefs, as their not even remotely matched, ever in human history, success story and track record highlights. So, there is nothing at all to 'attack' as you say, but conversely, everything to admire. Unlike european cultural history, they didn't constantly lie, invade and try to wipe out any other countries, or even visitors to their land, whilst hypocritically having this below as their cultural, core back bone. This below is the basis of the 'oz', your constitution. Created and enforced by bloodshed, brute force, war and genocide. 'White man speak with forked tongue' was long earned and entirely correct.
'Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. [38] This is the first and great commandment. [39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. [40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets'
Bullshit artists.
Indo writes
"But i think people these days especially those with more left views are pretty hypocritical for any job including prime minister someones religion should be irrelevant and there is no way you guys would say the same things about him if he was a muslim or if he had traditional indigenous creation/afterlife beliefs.
You wouldn't dare attack these beliefs and if someone did they would be labeled as racist or bigots or some other label."
Ummmmm Bullshit.... I attack the Islamic Saudi regime for bombing Children in Yemen. And if the Australian PM was a muslim or a jew locking up kids in detention, that USES HIS religion as a promotion for his political career, I would attack them too.
This is from Sco Mo's FIRST EVER speech to parliament in 2007;
""So what values do I derive from my faith? My answer comes from Jeremiah, chapter 9:24: I am the Lord who exercises loving kindness, justice and righteousness on earth; for I delight in these things, declares the Lord".
So, Indo, you wanna sprout this shit IN PARLIAMENT, then WALK THE WALK... 7 times Sco Mo voted down the banking royal commission. "Justice"?????
Deaths in detention... Denied medical help.. Kids mentally ruined.... "Loving Kindness"?????Righteousness??????
I hate taking the deaths at sea angle but lets not forget over 1,000 people died trying to get to Australia by boat between 2008-2013
Not at all comparable to taking in people, housing and feeding people, giving them allowances and all kinds of other things millions in this world including millions of refugees would do pretty much anything for.
We have been through the refugee/detention thing one hundred times if people are too ignorant to understand the bigger picture, then so be it.
Im all for bashing religion, but just admit there is a huge double standard if Scott Morrison was Muslim there is no way people would critique him based on religion and sprout lines from the Koran, even if he was a Jew he would be protected thanks to Hittler.
It's just an easy angle to bash him with.
And just for the record next election i wont be voting for him, I'm more likely to vote labor if i vote a major party, mostly based on the fact i think its about time for a change of government and what i can personally gain tax breaks etc is more likely to come from Labor.
Indo writes - "I hate taking the deaths at sea angle but lets not forget over 1,000 people died trying to get to Australia from Indonesia between 2008-2013"
You hate taking that angle. But you still take it. And here's the deal- Sco IS NOT muslim. Your hypothetical is a joke. There's NO WAY a muslim would be voted in as leader of the Liberal party. They couldn't even vote in Bishop (the best chance against against shorten) because she has a vagina!! And any muslim in Australia that does talk politics gets absolutely torched.. Look at the attacks on Waleed Ally, or the time conservative media commentator Prue MacSween said she'd run over Yassmin Abdel-Magied with her car.
But back to your drowned refugees... They're STILL drowning right now, just not off our coast. But we're still bombing the middle east, still helping Saudi Arabia bomb Yemen, still propping up the new puppet regime in Libya. Its sort of sickening that refugees are still drowning right now, yet we pretend that we were soooooo disturbed about deaths at sea.....
Only CERTAIN deaths at sea right? The deaths at sea that serve a political purpose.. smh
Just admit the double standard, Christianity is fair game to mock and criticise especially by those on the left but ironically islam is protected by the exact same people, despite being an even more backwards religion and ideals even further removed from those on the left or from a modern western society, if there was an islamic politician there is no way you would attack him based on religion. (BTW. nobody suggested a muslim was going to become a liberal leader?)
Although there is people who I'm sure don't like Waleed Ally because he is muslim or because of his lame attempts to justify extreme Islamic ideology.
I think most don't like him because he is divisive and over opinionated much like any right wing shock jock types in the media, that people either seem to love or hate.
Not my words but i think this sums up Ally pretty much down to a tee.
"Aly’s attempts at humour are dismal and his political commentary comes across as pointed, condescending and self-righteous. He behaves like an intolerable academic who loves the sound of his own voice. He talks down to everyday Australians in a way that implies that everything that comes out of his mouth has been divinely revealed to him and is an infallible truth. Worse, he interrogates guests with a disconcerting arrogance which reflects a lack of respect for alternate viewpoints"
In regards to deaths at sea, i thought it would be pretty obvious but we can only really control what happens in our waters.
Yeh, whatever dreamer. Bottom line its kids, kids in an 'advanced' culture. A culture that has 'advanced' somewhere between brutes, maggots and cockroaches. A culture that 'colonised' the planet. By lies and manic, pure brute force and bloodshed. No one went to them saying, 'we are so impressed with you, so impressed with your endless bloodbath, wars, lies, smog, diseases and plagues, factories, poverty, crackhead kings and queens fucking who and whatever they like, child labor, slaves, over flowing prisons, so please come and take over our country.' We left, and we leave a trail. Like a cunt that flogs his neighbours car, rapes his wife and kids, trashes the car, and dumps it back in his neighbours driveway. And moves to a new suburb, goes to work, and puts shit on the the last place he was. A serial killer is one thing. A serial killer that dresses up and parades around like granny and gramps down the road, is another, more dangerous beast.
The sad thing is you have a kid. Its kids. Kids. Welcome to the world kids. 'Bit betta 'ere in the clink but, than the last mess we left ya in, the last work camp we left ya in but, aye mmmaaayyte.' We sold the world out. Its all for sale. The whole show. Not everyone was perfect, some asshole cultures too, but some were doing real good. One better than anyone ever. We fucked the lot of them over big time. You name it, we'll sell that fucker! That's our 'advanced' way. Gone are the days of someone coming across a way of helping their friends and neighbours, coming across a nice feed, a nice place to swim, sit, play, whatever, and running back to tell them. That naive runner will be shot in the back before he gets anywhere near them. Deals will go down, dirty, conniving, maggoty, sleazy, low deals... sales, dressed up like gramps and granny down the road. Sold like the fuckin' waltons standing on their fucking heads. And they'll buy it. Adolph was counting on it. Donny too.
milat was innocent. Even now his lawyers will fight tooth and nail to prove it. Its advanced shit. And some stupid cunt will go on a picnic with him if he ever gets out. And some stupid cunt will let 'firey' down the road look after their kitten, because he's turned over a new leaf. And the poor kitten will fry. The catholics will keep innocently humping and fucking up kids. They'll just get even sleazier, more cunning. It has to stop.
So indo, you've got a kid. Stop trying to be a cool, unattached, rational, groovey dude, an advanced smart arse. Its kids, in prison camps, sleazily dressed up like gramps and granny's place. Its got to stop. The milat's and 'firey's' will never stop though. So deal with them accordingly. That's one mistake the Traditional Indigenous Australian's made, that I won't.
'Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. [38] This is the first and great commandment. [39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. [40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets'
Bullshit artists, dressed up like the fucking waltons. The most dangerous kind.
Full moon
No moon is my favourite but they’re all pretty cool.
The waltons always looks good from hidin' between stupes or mummy's legs too... again... and again... and again...
@Cryptoknight, lifter, roids whatever name you are using this month.
Okay today i will come down too your level, in a nutshell.
What do you like about blax? I had not checked it out until now.
Dirt old white man said he was innocent. Even now his lawyers will fight tooth and nail to prove it. Its advanced shit. And some stupid cunt will go on a picnic with him if he ever gets out. And some stupid cunt will let 'firey' down the road look after their kitten"
I’m able to maintain visible abs year round, as are my clients, by eating just three meals per day and not having to survive on boiled chicken breasts and steamed broccoli. In fact, we can do it while eating delicious meals every day of the week, off course the swill nuts will nut listen, high in their chair of swillnuting.
The words babble, babel sound the same but have different meanings and spellings. Why do babble, babel sound the same even though they are completely different words?
Well brilliant swillnutting exhibition!!! Professional swillnutting 101!!! In a nutshell!?!'!!! In a nutshell!!! Again!!
If you come across these people, under no circumstance approach them, they are armed with lethal, ludicrous amounts of stupidity!!! Call the authorities immediately and allow them to deal with them.
Blax....and again i say blax my swillnuts.
"A Samaritan woman came to draw water, and Jesus said to her, ‘Give me a drink’. 8(His disciples had gone to the city to buy food.) 9The Samaritan woman said to him, ‘How is it that you, a Jew, ask a drink of me, a woman of Samaria?’ (Jews do not share things in common with Samaritans.)* "
Proven, redneck, soft cock, bullshit artist. Again
https://www.swellnet.com/forums/wax/381069
And dreaming idiot.
I really don't understand why you guys get so upset with indod. His posts are hardly extreme, or even remotely right wing. As someone pointed out above, t'was such a civil discussion...for a brief moment...
Anyway, I have to agree, the hypocrisy of certain lefties and lefty outlets regarding defending islam to the extreme, whilst practicing gratuitous christian bagging pile ons, at the drop of a hat, at every minute opportunity. Its cringeworthy at best.
I like waleed ally, or at least I did. I still like him on his abc RN show on the weekends. Always considered, often pompous, but generally willing to discuss nuance. However on the project he has become almost un-watchable. the spitting image, but opposite, of the right wing shock jocks. The righteousness of the whole project panel is tedious and divisive, except steve price I guess, who's also divisive, but provides a skerrick of (tasteless) balance.
The media is shameless in its hypocrisy. I also quite like that muslim Yassmin chick, who's quite funky and personable, but the fawning guardian and abc are quite sickening in their presentation of her. She's presented as 'the chosen one', totally above reproach. Especially when defending her about her 'islam is the most feminine of religions' claim on q and a. Even, when the day after, she admitted to consulting the 'cat meat iman' about her position and presentation on q and a. Consulting the cat meat iman, from 'the most feminine of religions', the day after....to quote sheepdog"....bahahahaha...."
She literraly left the country within a week, claiming mysoginy and islamaphobia, whilst the guardian beefed up their defence of her. Did she leave because australia and australians suck? Or because she realised her position was beyond naive, to the point of being untenable? Maybe both.
Serious question cryptoknight, I agree with much you say about indigenous australians, but do you really think the poms did such a dastardly job of colonisation in comparison to the dutch in indonesia? Or say, the spanish in south america?
Also, what about the poms in malaysia? Or singapore? Or hong kong? Some of these places seem to have done alright out of the poms tendency to want to educate, a tendency developed well before the dutch had the same belated revelation.
Upset? You don't think the innocent kids are? Or the Indigenous Australians, etc, all those on the receiving end of colonialism? In comparison, he's getting the cotton wool treatment. Because I know how delicate he is. He cries out to stupe, squeals for backup at a just a bit of a look in his direction. Plus there was that total collapse he told about, when his world, when the earth caved in on him, when he couldn't pay his rego. If he could just say something real, fair enough. Like, 'no look, here, see, there's lots, tons of irrefutable evidence that the poms were invited to rape and pillage.' Or, 'no see they didn't lie at all. Look, see the terra nullius saga is just bullshit. No, look see, the poms were telling the truth, the Indigenous Australians aren't actually human. No, see, slavery didn't happen. Plagues weren't real... see. Prisons overflowing, no look, its not true. Colonialism... women, children raped and butchered across the globe, no look it didn't happen.' Our, well, the queen's constitution based on the bible, on Christian God. 'No see, that's not true...' But he can't, so he endlessly bullshits, smarmy, like a sleazy, proclaimed God loving, bullshitting politician crapping on about this, while doing the exact opposite:
'Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. [38] This is the first and great commandment. [39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. [40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets'
And, bottom line, its kids. Kids. We left a clear, obvious mess across the globe to get here. Its innocent kids. Should you need to say anything else to an 'advanced' humane being? Like I said, milat is innocent, and there's cunts out there who will jump at the chance to prove it. Go on picnics with them if you want.
And to answer that question to me. Are you serious? Really? There's a women whose husband bashed her to death. The lucky one is with a husband that just put her in a coma. And yep, capitalism is booming. The whole show is on sale, always. Right down to the last breath of air. Until there's nothing left to sell. What could possibly be better than that? In a nutshell.
I said "...in comparison...". You don't think the dutch fucked over the indonesians? Pretty sure there was much (probably way more) raping and killing by the spanish.
Colonisation was a race, a slicing up of the pie, a competition of colonisation, as superior technology facilitated the land grabbing expansion of european ways (not superior culture I conceed).
The indigenous wonderland you so passionately describe (not wrongly...probably...) was going to have to face the modern world and its ruthless ways at some point.
You think the blackfellas would've faired better under the dutch? The spanish?
Somehow I doubt it.
Or maybe they would have, as the dutch ruthlessly kept the societies seperate. Allowing culture to remain.
But ask the indo's who's better off. Show the blackfellas how the indo's live now, and ask them who's better off. I think you'll get a consensus. All up for debate, yes, but the sight of poor grovelling indo's seems to have a profound effect on most people, creating a general consensus.
Yes capitalism is a nasty beast. But what's the alternative in a dog eat dog race?
You're an idealist to the extreme my friend, which is admirable...but naive...or at a minimum, one eyed and dismissive.
That's sad, that's not even funny. Don't be so lazy! Take off the blinkers. I bought up all about the dutch in Indo, with dutchie ages ago. Get off your butt, take the shades off, and do some homework. Its all here, video evidence too.
The Indigenous Australians are very thorough. They look at the big picture. When you study what occurred here, properly, that is colonialism, you study and compare, contrast, the whole of it, from every angle.
And yes, I dismiss bullshit always.
If you can't accept, or entertain the idea of an alternative, better thought, you are trapped, ruled by lesser thought.
This might come as a bit of a shock to you crypto, but just because you say something, and post some two bit youtube vid doesn't neccesarily make it so.
It may also come as a shock that not all of us have so much free time on our hands that we will trawl through years of swellnet forums to find quotes, jokes, flippant remarks, and other various misconceptions to belittle other posters and inflate one's own ego.
I meant you are dismissive of context not indo d.
Dismissive of the context of the world at the time of colonisation. Dismissive of science, belief, and the possibility that some of those poms had good intentions based on the knowledge of the time. Dismissive of the possible goodwill of the occasional christian. Dismisive of human nature - indigenous and colonialist. Dismissive of the marvel of that screen and keyboard you love punching info into so much. And dismissive of the fact a lot of blackfellas don't mind a bit of marveling at the wonders of that technology too.
You are also dismissive of any other opinions or learned positions that don't align with your (somewhat narrow) education and perspective
You should know better, judging from the shit you write. The theory that guides you tells you otherwise.
massive ego, thats all. could be all an internet show though. who knows maybe his wife keeps his balls in her silk purse.
intelligent folk understand that they don't know everything.
be intelligent CK....your clients will appreciate it.
Geez the division here is fugly as usual. Where's the love? Folks waxing cold on each other.
Here's a change of direction to argue over.
https://www.collective-evolution.com/2018/08/22/lets-discard-the-right-t...
"But it all comes back to us getting beyond taking things personally. If we get insulted by what someone says, we are not well placed to respond objectively to it. The point being made here is not that we should condone hateful, pejorative, negative speech; we are as free to make our feelings known about another’s words as they are free to speak them. Like the old saying goes, ‘I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.’
As awakening beings, we need to recognize that dealing with points of view we don’t agree with is essential for our growth. If those points of view happen to be laced with vitriol and judgment, all the more reason to allow them to be aired and, to the extent that we are able, to respond with equanimity, if not with compassion. This creates the possibility for understanding, growth, and healing for all."
https://www.collective-evolution.com/2018/08/26/list-of-products-brands-...
Also another news aggregate site here that is interesting. Requires some thinking though.
I didn't really want to give Crypto what he wanted which is to turn this and any discussion into a discussion on Indigenous issues.
But seeing it has, could you please just answer one question.
You always want to paint a picture of indigenous culture as some peaceful utopia before colonisation, its one feature you always bang on about.
But I'm curious what do you base this on?
Maybe I've missed something but all we have to go on is:
1. Word of mouth handed down generations (and we know even from one person to another stories and accounts change, probably the best verbal accounts would be tribal law, which doesn't agree with your view)
2. Recorded history (which doesn't agree with your view)
3. Cave art (which records battles between tribes)
4. Artefacts (we know in many areas they had shields)
5. Probably the most reliable, thousands of bones of men and women going back thousands of years that show unusually high rates of skull fractures especially in women.
Off course I will be labeled as racist and typical white fella slur or something for believing what we know from the aspects above, and other aspects.
But I'm curious what you base your view on?
What evidence do you have to support your view?
What’s what ?
Southern Australia is freezing cold in winter that’s what’s what.
If my nomadic , subsistence surviving ancestors from the last couple of hundred thousand years had access to a modern four wheel drive towing a boat full of surfboards and fishing rods in weather like this they would be that stoked it’s not funny.
Thank you science and those critical thinkers that made this life possible.
Hope everyone is warm and scoring.
Indo I would be interested in the evidence for the assertions you have made. Can you provide links?
there are some really annoying prigs here, you can predict with 100% accuracy what they will say on a range of topics and when you attempt to drill down and get real information from them on why they hold that view it ends up to be froth so why bother.
"there are some really annoying prigs here, you can predict with 100% accuracy what they will say on a range of topics and when you attempt to drill down and get real information from them on why they hold that view it ends up to be froth so why bother."
You could be talking about yourself there guysmiley. In fact I think that paragraph refers to you more so than any other contributor on here. Ambiguitguysmiley would be a more fitting term.
I'd like to see where he got that info too blindboy. And the same for the crypto claims. I suggest a reference bout rather than the usual slur fest.
I'm thinking the truth is somewhere in the middle.
Which wouldn't reflect badly on aboriginal people. It would just show they are plagued with very human problems, just like every other race (if I may be so crass as to use that term, because you know...race doesn't exist and stuff....)
touche sypkan! so true, and the staggering lack of insight/self-awareness for gs to say that without looking in the mirror says it all really.. ive always figured gs for an old teacher,used to think he was "down with the kids" cause he surfed, still pining for dons party and maintaining the rage over gough
No I am dismissive of you and your midnight, sleep deprived, so proven mentally deficient ramblings sypk. The system and culture you praise so much, awarded me the highest honors when studying, and commenting on colonialism, at two universities. That's just fact. In doing that, I had to demonstrate the ability to quickly access, and assess information, prove it as factual if I chose to use it, and comment on it in a relevant way. So, accessing something from the swillnut club files, whilst it may be shockingly exhausting for you, sypkly, and beyond your capabilities and ability, is extremely simple for me. That's all.
So it is simple for me, for instance, to highlight one of the greatest examples of delirious, arrogant, unbridled stupidity by presenting the dreamers 'bitcoin' bullshit. Where he documented one of the most insane examples of driveling swillnutting, arrogant, uniformed, fiction passed off as fact, bullshit ever. Swillnutting magnificence about being an intermediate, yet expert 'trader' (sic) in just a few months of googles, whilst deciding that he wouldn't produce any details of any trades to the tax department, because, fuck them, and because intermediate but expert 'traders' (sic) don't need them anyway, and he couldn't be fucked either. All while he lost his money. So yes, I dismiss him as at best, a fucking ludicrous imbecile.
You however in presenting this new, fictional, completely evidence and research free, sypkly, waltons meets Mary Poppins version of colonialism, have perhaps even eclipsed the dreamer. All whilst you flippantly dismiss the attempted genocide of 60,000 years plus of unmatched, continual human Cultural success. Not just one Culture of people living harmoniously for all that remarkable, not even remotely matched time, but hundreds and hundreds of Traditional Indigenous Australian Cultures of men women and children, human beings, and all of their expertise and wisdom necessary to produce such an unrivaled in human history, success story.
Colonialism here is relevant to the discussion of our 'advanced' imprisoned treatment of innocent children, because as usual you miss the big picture. Because of the production of keyboards etc, children all over the globe sit in misery and slavery, in prisons dressed up as work places, so that you can play 'I'm marveling' in glee, like a brain dead moron, whilst parading around as Mary Poppins lost brother. And while, because of your Mary Poppins outlook, pollution, and destruction of the planet is ever escalating.
With all your blithering you must sooner or later grasp that it is you who belittles yourself. Your thoughts, not mine.
So, consider yourself dismissed, again, sypkly Poppins, you ludicrous fool.
I just got back from training people hapless. Heading off soon to do the same. Again. Around 2,500 or so hours of it this year, and the one before, and before that, and before that, and before that, and so on... and on... and on... and on... Sleep fool. But seeing as you have pooped your scone out of your hole, in the wee hours rather than sleep, if you want to assess my clients training, ring the office, they will tell you that I'm booked out, and put your name on the long waiting list. If you mention that you are hapless the swillnut, in a nutshell, you will be quickly dismissed. Again. And, again, feel belittled if you must, but that's just the real world, the one when you leave your swillnutting one.
So bottom line, innocent kids are imprisoned here, and globally. What else should be needed to to be said, to self proclaimed, 'advanced' examples of humaneness.
you have to do better than that poindexters.
don't care what point of view you have but please let it be informed and preferably balanced. sprouting off what you get in your personal echo chambers doesn't cut it.
as a political commentator correctly noted on the weekend, "the great anchor on Australian democracy is compulsory voting forcing the major parties to appeal to the middle". anything else is noise whipped up by the reactionaries in the media and politics so if your pinning your hopes on a dutton or a hansen you will be bitterly disappointed. besides, lets just see how many of those boneheads are in parliament come the next election when the usual rules apply.
Notice how Crypto knight still hasn't brought up any evidence whatsoever to support his view of some peaceful perfect utopia that he brings up again and again and tries to change every topic with.
No surprise that his recent post is just another post trying to attack and insult people, spinning complete BS and lies on non relevant topics.
He claims to be an expert on the topic, gone to two universities studying the area, highest honours, but yet can't provide one thread of evidence for his view???
If i had studied some topic and got honours, id be able to set the record straight with evidence and facts extremely easy as would anyone else.
The reason he can't is because his view is not based on facts it is only based on the emotion of how he would like to believe things were.
@Blindboy unlike Herc yes i will try to provide some links.
And I will try to provide links that are not just opinions but have some evidence.
Although I'm sure whatever i provide some will critique as not reelable etc.
"the great anchor on Australian democracy is compulsory voting forcing the major parties to appeal to the middle".
So what are your thoughts on the opinion that poorer and less educated people would tend not to vote if voting was voluntary?
This would skew the political system (further) toward the well off and well educated.
Shit, I would've guessed that preferential voting in the House of Reps would be way more of a handbrake on "democracy" than compulsory voting.
Or the effect of political donations.
Or a tame media.
Or dodgy party pre-selections.
I have provided numerous links here.
Meanwhile, could the ludicrous, dreaming, dismissed imbecile also 'try' to find the documents proving why, as he asserts, expert traders don't need to provide details of trades to the taxation dept, and why they can't be bothered keeping details of any trades, and why they just think its a funny story to tell the kids when they lose all of their money? And, in losing his money, as an intermediate expert trader, how he drew an income, That he didn't need to show the taxation department, from his earnings as an intermediate expert trader, that he claims he became in a few months of googling?
Krill, Rolleiflex twin lens cameras and the poems of Robert Desnos . . . and somehow find the nexus to an ancient culture. Whatever is stated in this forum is sooner or later hijacked to one person's often vile, incoherent treatise and the looseness of association is palpable. Tritrate the Fluphenazine.
Okay I've tried to cover my points, and tried to use non bias sources where possible Indigenous websites etc
Most or all of this is pretty well known and documented and not really disputed, some just to what extent for example some may say tribal law allows payback in the form of rape etc, some say not.
Anyway i think it's pretty clear that violence was a part of Indigenous society before white fella came, ad not the peaceful utopia Herc likes to paint.
1. Tribal law & other things like payback bashings, promised brides etc
Providing a link to an Aboriginal website, so you are getting the most tame version possible.
https://www.creativespirits.info/aboriginalculture/law/tribal-punishment...
Promised wifes
https://www.theage.com.au/national/rape-puts-pressure-on-aboriginal-law-...
Now does that sound peaceful utopia?...Like to be a promised wife?...
2. Tribal warfare
We know from written accounts tribal warfare happened this website documents written historic sources http://austhrutime.com/feud_and_warfare.htm
Obviously we know about the frontier wars, which were not just one sided, again this link documents Traditional aboriginal warfare between tribes with sources https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_frontier_wars
3. Okay the cave art is harder to find as searches don't really bring up pics you want, and i don't have time to go through pages pf pics of rock art.
4. Artefacts
Most weapons like spears, clubs etc were obviously mostly for hunting even if used in tribal warfare, but shields serve no purpose in hunting, shields are only used to protect against others humans during warfare. https://www.aboriginal-bark-paintings.com/aboriginal-shield/
5. Bones
From the book by Paleopathologist Stephen Webb
http://www.australianarchaeology.com/journal/review-of-palaeopathology-o...
Paleopathologist Stephen Webb in 1995 published his analysis of 4500 individuals’ bones from mainland Australia going back 50,000 years. (Priceless bone collections at the time were being officially handed over to Aboriginal communities for re-burial, which stopped follow-up studies).[15] Webb found highly disproportionate rates of injuries and fractures to women’s skulls, with the injuries suggesting deliberate attack and often attacks from behind, perhaps in domestic squabbles. In the tropics, for example, female head-injury frequency was about 20-33%, versus 6.5-26% for males.
The most extreme results were on the south coast, from Swanport and Adelaide, with female cranial trauma rates as high as 40-44% — two to four times the rate of male cranial trauma. In desert and south coast areas, 5-6% of female skulls had three separate head injuries, and 11-12% had two injuries.
Web could not rule out women-on-women attacks but thought them less probable. The high rate of injuries to female heads was the reverse of results from studies of other peoples.[16] His findings, according to anthropologist Peter Sutton, confirm that serious armed assaults were common in Australia over thousands of years prior to conquest. [17]
Additional reading on the subject relevant to the topic with additional sources quoted.
http://quadrant.org.au/opinion/bennelong-papers/2013/05/the-long-bloody-...
"the great anchor on Australian democracy is compulsory voting forcing the major parties to appeal to the middle".
I see anchor in this sense as a good thing, like a fundamental tenet to protect the rights of all and accordingly I agree that its a protection for the less well off and poor against big capital.
I also agree, preferential voting is another anchor that helps balance out extremes of political thought ....... it is noted the only people who argue against compulsory and preferential voting are those on the reactionary right who mount spurious arguments about personal freedoms.
Political donations need urgent reform and a federal ICAC would solve current problems.
We also need a strong diverse media, something we don't have.
Thank you ID for the links and the effort.
Looking for more 'human' behaviour recorded, I can only add from research done on George Grey's adventures on the west coast as part of my undergraduate degree. The guide/translator, from the Albany area, referred to the midwest locals as "bandy legged creatures that eat dirt". Obviously not too impressed.
Evidence of agriculture was encountered around Dongara with something similar to yams being grown, and huts were discovered which suggests a permanency not usually attributed to these people.
In all my travels & snippets I've found I am most in awe of the stories of Tarkinner women, who would dive the west coast of Tassie for abalone - a job which surely had a few adrenaline rich moments. Equally profound are whispers that suggest they had good knowledge of the ley lines of the planet.
Sorry for working by the moonlight crypto. Yes I was keeping some strange hours, doing the airport transfers shuffle, in search of some waves funnily enough. God forbid someone on here - this here surfing website - actually doing some surfing. Try it sometime mate, you might actually loosen up a bit.
And... I've tried to avoid spruiking my academic record, you're not the only one with a string of HD's to show off. Most of us just don't go there, you know posting it, publicly, for all to see. It's really not that becoming of a lady...or even a fuckwit for that matter, but each to their own.
Besides, I found the whole academic experience closer to classes in conformity, rather than the development of any real critical thinking skills, or even encouragment for the nourishing of intelligence. The whole academia world is a bit of a hoax, with some real issues to be faced, but you've clearly drank the identity politics kool aid, and sucked some supervisor private bits, and its served you well. Again, each to their own.
Yep, more diversions, distractions and general dis- ing from the usual suspects. Rather than seriously argueing a topic. If one really cared about all this shit, as much as themselves, they'd take the opportunity to educate and convince, to address issues, to evoke change, but nah, its all egomania and childish tantrums.
Balance guysmiley? Coming from you? I won't even go there, because I do respect you...a little...
For the record crypto, I haven't denied any of the things you're rattling on about, as you desperately put words in my mouth. I'm just up for discussing things, because I'm interested and involved in aboriginal issues.
I've said it before, many aboriginal people seem to now want to move away from this constant negative narrative the left has obsessed over, the 'black arm band' view of events if you will. As it hasn't overly served them well, with stan grant being a prime example of someone trying to change the discourse. Decades and decades of wallowing in misery, whilst the situation just becomes more dire for many aboriginal people, has had neglible outcomes. Many have also improved their situation, so not all is lost, but whilst there has been this obsession with identity politics and political correctness the world has moved on, and it has actually been a hinderance to many communities addressing issues. This has only been compounded by neoliberalism, globalisation, and associated mass migration.
I'm all for a treaty and addressing of injustice, but I believe this horse has well and truly bolted. As the right has slowly adopted the left's vanacular of identity politics (begrudgingly at first), but now it's turned shit on its head. Capitalising on its capitulation. Making any suggestions of special treatment for certain groups unpalateable to say the least.
But you guys keep fighting the good fight. The good fight circa 1988.
https://www.swellnet.com/forums/wax/381069
I post the above again, as it irrefutably highlights the dreamer's continual delusional ideas regarding extremely self fulfilling, small sample googles, and his resulting assertions of expertise. Which, whilst it can be hidden behind in this no consequence swillnut environment, had real consequences in the real world. In the real world, the delusional dreamer had no where near any expertise, and real world assessment quickly produced a fail, based on the reality of bias, and just a small amount of incorrectly comprehended, googling. In a nutshell, the delusions quickly caught up with him.
Next, where did I say that Traditional Indigenous Australians never had disputes dreamer? please produce those words? That is more of your blinkered, racist bullshit. However their record of 600 or so distinct Cultural groups existing together in a peaceful way that outlasts any other cultural groups record by miles and miles, and was still doing so until British Invasion is very real, as I highlight.
Like your bitcoin fiasco, you ignore mountains of evidence of peaceful interactions, even with foreign visitors and try to satisfy your racial bias, by painting the false war mongers picture. And yes Traditional Indigenous Law was nothing like ours and contributed to that unmatched success rate, as I have posted before. Including your link.
You ignore the irrefutable mountains of indisputable European evidence, monuments, statues, art, ceremony, glorifying war, and the results. And brush over struggling to find anything remotely the same in Traditional Indigenous Australian Societies.
The links below are backed by extensive reference lists, that you requested.
https://aifs.gov.au/cfca/sites/default/files/publication-documents/cfca2...
https://espace.library.uq.edu.au/data/UQ_179979/Amy_Humphreys_Honours_Th...
'Accounts such as these gave voice to humanitarian allegations that Aboriginal women
were ‘the ‘victims’ of men’s low morality’, without control or choice over ‘their
sexual partners or their lives’ (Hunt 1986:116). These victim rhetorics reflected a
social view that Aboriginal people were unable to make the ‘right’ moral decisions
since they were childlike in nature, which helped to enforce paternalistic government
policies, like the Aborigines Protection and Restriction of the Sale of Opium Act
of 1897 (Evans 1975:118; Hunt 1986:109, 116; McGrath 1980:246). Likewise Hamilton
argues that colonial discourses on male brutality in traditional Aboriginal culture were
used to enforce paternalistic policies and: was one of the main humanitarian arguments on which missionaries and others based their claims for smashing Aboriginal culture. The men were violent brutes, the women abject pawns in games of male political power (1975:167).
Evans argues that discourses on Aboriginal male brutality also alleviated guilt for
colonists who ‘conveniently believed that native women were merely subject to
capture and brutal oppression by their own menfolk, [so] they did not see very much
wrong in behaving similarly’ (1975:106). Rhetorics on the victimisation of Aboriginal
women became increasingly important for paternalistic government policies, which
used this rhetoric to argue for the ‘protection’ and control of Aboriginal people;
Aboriginal women in particular (Hunt 1986:109, 116; McGrath 1980:246; 1987:83).'
In a convict society with few women, Aboriginal women were forced to assume a
sexually participatory role. Historical discourses on Aboriginal women’s sexuality
were wound up in a context of racism and sexism, where the objectification of
indigenous sexuality was used to assert white privilege and power, with a ‘destructive
effect on indigenous gender relations’ (Saunders 1991:158; Tuhiwai Smith 1999:39,
151). By deconstructing the functions of Aboriginal women and placing them in a
disempowered and sexual role, the political dehumanisation of Aboriginal women was
achieved to assuage guilt over colonist’s behaviour and policies towards those they
represented (McGrath 1984:237). However, the voices of Aboriginal women are not
heard or represented in the colonial moral discourse which objectified and constructed
them. In the next chapter I assess the implication that colonial discourses of the
victimised, vulnerable and promiscuous Aboriginal woman prevail in contemporary
media, with similar consequences.
http://lib.oup.com.au/he/health/samples/hampton_indigenousaushealth_samp...
'Cultural identity was based on language, belief systems, social/kinship
structure, social behaviours, and links to land. Discrete bands linked with
other bands, connected by marriage, language, and country, into broader social
structures inextricably connected to country by Dreamings which defined their
belief systems. Territorial squabbles were uncommon; there were strict laws
regulating inter-tribal interactions and offences against individuals.'
'The series chronicles the history of contemporary Australia, from the perspective of its first people, or Aborigines. The series is essentially a synthesis of well documented historical information.
http://www.sbs.com.au/firstaustralians/
https://www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/program/first-australians
It relies heavily on archival documents and interpretations from historians and members of both the Indigenous and European community and leaders. The story begins in 1788 in Sydney, with the arrival of the First Fleet and ends in 1993 with Koiki Mabo's legal challenge to the foundation of Australia.
The series comprises seven episodes, in which it explores what unfolded when the oldest living culture in the world was confronted by the British Empire.
It explores the lives of particular individuals and uses their stories as a vehicle to explain the larger situations of the time. It explains violent aspects of European settlement of Australia, such as killings, battles, wars, as well as acts of friendship and decency between the early European settlers and Indigenous Australians.
Indigenous Australian history has until recently been clouded by the "great Australian silence" where ignorance of the real history of Australia can be seen as a way for non-Indigenous to hide shame for their own history.
In this respect it has been controversial in that many of these stories have not been portrayed on Australian television before and the Indigenous Australian perspective of European settlement is confrontational for many.'
'This exceptional seven-part series reveals the history of Australia through the eyes of its original inhabitants and - given they comprise the longest-living civilisation on Earth - there's a lot to cover.'
Sykply Poppins! who said HD's? Now you are belittled and ashamed of your academic record too! This is your idea of a surf trip aye!!! Me. I'm your 'surf trip'. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Fucking hilarious... You said nothing again! Dismissed again.
Extrapolating 60000 years of social and anthropological history from extremely recent oral accounts and irregular archaeological discoveries......funny !
Wow, you got through all the references quicker than the dreamer became an expert trader, when he didn't. Couldn't find any war monuments, galleries, invasions, nothing anything remotely matching the unlimited evidence of glorifying war and violence, unlike european cultures could you. That's because it never existed in Traditional Indigenous Australian Cultures. Its your 'weapons of mass destruction' good 'ol boyz story. Mountains upon mountains of sacred sites and meeting place evidence though that you somehow missed.
Plus women are involved. You already told everyone how you you sorted the last 'uppity' Indigenous lady out. After your psychopathic red mist story. Shall I post that shit again?
That 60,000 years minimum, unmatched story really eats you up. The clan boyz don't like it one bit! Plus, now you have to deal with all the real evidence about the massacres. The ever growing real horror story. Red necked clan boyz don't like that either. But its reality. Not like your east fucking Albany bullshit.
Kids in prisons too. You'll sleaze and bullshit that away too.
You posted your own academic transcript you moron
Days in airports with nothing to do but blurt shit on here...
" I'm your 'surf trip'. " ....only in your head crypto...only in your head
It’s a wonder he can go on living with the amount of hate he has for the country he chooses to live in
Wow thank you Herc, didnt see that coming, I think we actually got somewhere this time, faced with facts Crypto has basically back pedaled and actually admitted for the first time before white fella it wasn't how he paints it as some perfect peacefully utopia.(or as close as you will ever admit him saying he was wrong)
It was just like any society that had problems and issues and disputes especially between various clans, to what extent we may possibly never know. (was it similar to the levels of violence seen in places like PNG? not completely unlikely)
BTW. nobody ever claimed it was only violence and no peaceful interactions?...Im myself have provide information and links in the past on swellnet about how Indonesians traded or got permission to collect sea cucumber up north.
Now when i get the time, maybe i can waste time digging up cryptos/hercs threads were he has previously denied this, but for now I've got to go do some work.
My personal opinion and one others share is that the root cause of most problems around violence seen in Indigenous communities has it's roots in past culture.
What is more likely current problems high levels of violence in particular domestic violence are magically a result of white fella or a continuation of thousands of years of past culture?
It's no different to PNG and Papuan culture, you can blame it on colonisation or poverty or this and that but compare Indonesian culture to Papuan culture and you have two totally different cultures, you have Indonesians many of which are as poor as can be and suffered colonisation etc but don't have unusually high levels of violence among common folk, then right next door you have a country PNG and Papuans with some of the highest levels of domestic and sexual based violence in the world and very high homicide rate, and city that often ranks among the most dangerous in the world.
Is it about skin colour or DNA...NO its about culture, thousands of years of culture, something that just doesn't just disappear change quickly overnight.
Wow, look at the little flock of bullshitters! Starting with another midnight 'surf' holiday run. Nah, I said awards sypkly poppins. Ya bullshittin' again. But, find that transcript anyway, seeing as:
'Days in airports with nothing to do but blurt shit on here...'
Aye hang on, didn't ya just say...
'It may also come as a shock that not all of us have so much free time on our hands that we will trawl through years of swellnet forums'
Ya fuckin' bullshit artist!!!
Look where you are corkhead, I am your fuckin' 'surf' holiday... again... in a nutshell!!!
I agree goofball when I read this shit, I thought the same fucking thing,
https://www.swellnet.com/forums/wax/12736
Then I thought 'ang on, wonder if he's just bullshittin!' Then I read all about his special ops shit, and his bad boy, connected lime stone savvy... But when he came up with that east Albany fucking hilarious bullshit, I knew he didn't have a clue, that he was just swillnut bullshittin! Again!!! In a nutshell. Hey goofball, anyway, how'd ya go miles and miles away on the day the ski's just took over ! Hahahaaaaaaar!!!! Fuckin' skis straight through the guts of it, you bad boy squwarkers just fawnin', bowing, clappin' and cheerin' and gooin' and gaaing!!! How did ya go... now ya got the craft to make it easy... Ya didn't go at all did ya... they reckon ya didn't... oh well, still trying to figure out which way up them wrong colour fins go!! Oh, no... you weren't doing the swillnut ulus death swim that day... again... on ya crafts...
Kids in prisons goofer...
Ya gotta find them links dreamer. But you know I said that all along. Even though ya swore ya'd never read what I said!!! Again!!! Ya bullshitting. again... and again... and again...
60,000 years. No collapse at all because of wars and violence, despite your weapons of mass destruction, war machine bullshit. Not like euro history, the paraded bloodbath, glorifying war, and death, and collapse after collapse, after collapse. And while you're fruitlessly searching for your bullshit claim, again, seeing as you've read all the references, dig up them bitcoin boogy ones... your intermediate expert pile of imbecilic bullshit... again. Off to work ya reckon dreamless... oh fuck no... what have ya googled now... oh, no, fuck no... not fuckin' that... fuck no... not that... FFS... fffaaaarrrk...
Again though, bottom line, kids in prison, innocent kids. Around the globe. The truth. In an 'advanced' 'humane' society.
Ha ha your a goose Herc, I'm not sure why you bring this Bitcoin thing up all the time, the bitcoin thread is there for all to see, and i was open and honest the whole way through my journey, i never claimed to be an expert or understand it all or be a trader, it was a ride i took, and i guess one I'm still taking and one i don't regret, as I've said before it was money i got basically given, and not hard ernt money (although off course i do wish id cashed out back in January, but if you think it eats me up or hurts, you are wrong).
You always try to personally attack me, before it was about having Dutch ancestry, It's annoying but it otherwise doesn't bother me, there isn't really anything you can say that would really get under my skin..keep trying if you will, but it just makes you look silly petty and immature.
You would be much better just to try to prove me wrong on the topics we discuss..
BTW. you should actually do a bit more research on you claims of children being locked up, nobody has ever been locked up (unable to leave) all people in detention are free to leave at anytime they have been offered different resettlement options and always have the option to return home or to refugee camps (we even pay big dollars to help people resettle, many have taken these options up), there is no children locked up in any detention centres both centres at Manus and Nauru are open centres 24/7 and on Nauru 70% of people live in the community just like Nauru locals.
Wildflowers going nuts this year . You’d have to be dead to not have your heart gladdened by acres of nature’s displays of beauty as you trundle around the joint.
Ever heard of timezones wise one?
Yep, even with all that time on my hands I'm not gonna go trawlin for shit to catch people out, because its tedious, and...well...a bit lame.
I'm talking about before crypto. I'm pretty sure you posted your academic transcripts, you know back when you posted that reference from your mates grandma for mowing her lawn or something like that. Strange behaviour, but good onya.
Anyway you're sucking me into your vortex now and I don't need to justify anything because I know what happened. It was fun for a while crypto, you do make me laugh, but then you get nasty, so I'll leave you to it. Thanks for the references
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