Blood surf
Just in case something I say later is taken out of context, let me make it clear that I believe violence, or the threat of violence in the surf, is always wrong. It can never be justified. Dangerous, disrespectful or provocative behaviour does not change this. There are other options for dealing with it based on engaging those responsible rather than confronting them. Those of us given to impulsive behaviour may find this difficult but it is a skill worth practising and developing for many reasons, most of which have nothing to do with surfing.
Over the weekend a feature called Blood Surf was published in the Fairfax Press. It uses the story of a vicious and despicable assault in the surf at Snapper Rocks to discuss violence in surfing culture with the clear inference that this is a serious problem. The issue, for me, is that the evidence presented by journalist Frank Robson is unconvincing and directly contradicts my own long experience and, I suspect that of many others, surfing in crowded conditions.
Robson recounts the well known incidents involving high profile surfers that have occurred over the last four decades beginning with the 1977 assault on Rabbit in Hawaii, including the assault on Nat Young at Angourie in 2000. He then quotes the views of Bruce Lee, Paul Scott, Sean Doherty and Phil Jarratt which are interesting but do not add anything to support the view that violence in the surf is a problem. Lee gives a pretty standard view from a local to the effect that those showing a lack of respect will be "verbally tuned" and yes, (shock, horror and enormous surprise!) this may involve swearing. Doherty gives a straight forward description of the hierarchical structure that exists at most populated breaks. Jarratt lists those, relatively few, locations well known for intense aggressive localism and states that they are unpleasant places to surf. Scott asserts that the lack of regulation is the cause but that there is nothing that can be done about this.
So the evidence presented simply does not support the assertions that ".....surfing has a history of bloody violence..." or that " Countless other surf punch ups go unrecorded...." If other evidence is available to demonstrate that violence in the surf is a serious problem, Robson has not been able to locate it. So while we know that a very small number of serious assaults have occurred in the surf, or as a result of conflict that began there, beyond that there is only opinion, anecdote and guesswork, which are apparently all that are needed to slander a whole sub-culture in the mass media.
I have spent a lot of time surfing crowded breaks over the last 50 years. I have been part of the crew at a highly localised break. I have surfed other heavily localised breaks in Australia and Hawaii and over all those years I am struggling to recall more than two violent incidents that I have actually witnessed, both of which occurred decades ago. In my opinion, in most places, most of the time, there is far less aggression than there used to be. Changes in the wider culture and the age and gender composition of surfing crowds have moderated the testosterone driven aggro that dominated many locations when the average surfer was a 23 year old male.
Surfing is not an unregulated environment, it is a socially regulated environment. Standards of behaviour are set and maintained by the approval and disapproval of other surfers. This does not result in perfect behaviour, but in my observation it does a pretty good job in restraining aggression. Localism, despite its poor reputation, is fundamental to this process. It is the surfers who are out there regularly who set the tone and maintain the standards at different locations. They have every right to "verbally tune" those who would degrade them.
In the circumstances violence in the surf, if it is an issue at all, seems to be of such a low order that it can be dealt with effectively by existing laws and procedures. The simplest of these, ignored by the victim in this case, is to go to the police. Reporting the incident will not inevitably lead to a charge or a conviction but the police will treat it seriously and leave all those involved in no doubt about the possible consequences of such behaviour.
If anything then, this story aggravates the issue by giving a high profile to another case of serious injury, like Nat's, which the victim chose not to report. This is not blaming the victim, people make their own choices for their own reasons, but anything which adds to the impression that surfers should not report serious assaults is part of the problem, not the solution.
Cliched, recycled surf rage stories in the mass media serve no purpose beyond filling a few pages in the weekend magazine or a few TV minutes. They remind me of two old sayings. The first is that to solve a problem, first you need to find one, which they so far have spectacularly failed to do. The second is that if you are going to write, write about something you know. If Frank Robson knows anything about surfing he did a good job of hiding it. //blindboy
Comments
Frank Robson needs a punch in the head.
Nah not much violence really, most of the dudes who need a thump are already giving themselves upper cuts, daily, about something, anything, everything or nothing. They're doing the job on 'emselves just fine.
Nat's thumping was a long time coming, and the guy that belted him should be bought a beer.
Sid suggests surfers carrying Tazers. If someone drops-in, it should be legal to Tazer 'em .
errr, hang on, Sid would be getting Tazered regularly.
"Frank Robson needs a punch in the head."
Best way to start this thread. I reckon there's two things happening. 1) despite what Franky Boy thinks violence is less now than the 3 decades previous, and for the reasons BB says (changing demographics etc), but the ever increasing numbers are driving tensions up at select places like Snapper, Pipe, and a few SoCal joints.
Still, even at those places , I'd imagine the violence would be less than it was in the 70's and 80s.
Nailed it BB.
In essence, it was a classic slow news day beat-up by a press desperate to maintain relevance.
I still can't work out why Morlock didn't call the cops, or if not him, one of the many, many witnesses. Something smells fishy there.
OT - but this was pretty funny...
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/ben-flowers-shocking-double-p...
Most point breaks have a "self appointed owner" of the break , the face of the owner changes from day to day.
Those who drop in never seem to know what the problem is .
Most of the time some friendly advise, that people who drop in are not welcome will suffice.
Those who do not listen and continue to wonder what the problem should not act so surprised when the last straw lands on the camels back.
Mantra: Violence is wrong, violence is wrong! :-}
Something doesn't seem right, that's for sure , FR..... But deliberately spearing someone would have not been tolerated back in the day.... Some blow ins were surfing with us locals at the stormdrain bank in Coolum, geez, 14 years ago... Right in front of the traffic lights... Middle of town.... A few choice words were being thrown around, not by the locals, but by blow ins against blow ins.... This one long haired throw back was getting really irate at another guy.. They didn't know eachother.. Hassling, dropping in on eachother, fading... Me, spart, Fraser, Noel could see it was a powderkeg.... Sure enough, Throwback gets dropped in on by this guy in retaliation, and throwback deliberately spears his board at him, missing him by fuck all.... That's when us locals stood in, just pasting the guy... Calling him a fuckn coward... Told both of them to either go on the beach and sort it, or shut the fuck up and surf.....
In hindsight, probably should've stepped in before it got to that stage, but hey, catching waves, chatting to mates, sat morning gossip.....
Anyway, never saw throwback again, but the other guy from brisso still used to come up now and then, which got him some respect after being served.....
Fair point BB … the journalist is not a regular surfer. I would also suggest this reflects badly on Fairfax. They are not the most reputable for factual reporting. Bear in mind, the article has to pass editorial, so Fairfax needs to taken to task on this.
I've never seen anyone spear anyone with their board.
Heard of it a few times. Seen plenty of punches thrown. As BB noted, far less violent aggression nowadays. Kids aren't interested in perpetuating the violent ways of their adult role models, thank god.
Spearing someone with a board is assault with a weapon. Again, why did none of the multiple witnesses to this crime report it?
I was a novice learning to surf at Kings Beach, Caloundra. I took off on a wave, went over the falls and surfaced to be punched squarely in the face by the craziest, snarling local you'd ever come across. 'You don't ever fuckin' drop in' he screamed at me and I could barely make out his face through the tears, the stars and the blood. Didn't stop me surfing but taught me a pretty big lesson. In retrospect, a real hero punching a 15 year old kid.
In 35 years of surfing I've probably only ever seen two punches thrown (I was on the receiving end of one) but heaps of verbals. Most people on the receiving end of the verbals usually deserve it.
This story is a beat up and I reckon there's more to it. But the bloke that speared the board- fucking tool.
Mate, I've seen blokes deliberately run over blokes...... Ugly stuff....
But when the surf is serious, and not pissant stuff, things change.... Always seems to happen in smaller surf.....
But in the big stuff, when someone has dropped in on you.... Next wave a simple drop in and fade then into the impact zone usually fixes the problem...... No words needed.... ;)
BB, good article. I've seen boards speared at people and punch ups in and out of the water. Perhaps its less these days but I'm able to be far more selective where and when I surf. Oddly, have seen some really aggressive behaviour amongst older mal riders in the last year or two. I still don't get why that guy didn't go to the cops.
TB, you ever consider a career as a comedian?
Despite the issues drop ins can cause it is generally accepted on the occasion around coolie, it just happens. Serial drop ins will have words said and old mate should have said something at the time and let it go rather than wait months to sort it out (who does that?? Sounds like Burleigh behaviour).
Further, I believe old mate should be charged by the police for the simple fact that he wasted the time and resources of the hospital and surgeons in sorting out his inability to function in civilization.
I definitely see less aggro now than years past, thanks BB for pointing out why. My old flat mate received a fractured skull from a board deliberately kicked out at her by another girl when she was paddling out (back in the day, not in Qld).
Being a generally agreeable fellow, the biggest risk I normally face is someone paddling for the shoulder instead of to the foam when I REALLY don't want to go around them, or having someone "crab dive" instead of duck dive with their board spearing back out as you pass by.
I would've liked Frank to ask why he wasn't going to see the cops. Something about that doesn't seem right and it leaves a gaping hole in the story.
It may equally indicate that reporting violence to the police is not a comfortable experience, especially given the dismissal people who do report violence may experience from the police themselves for doing so e.g. "man up".
Well whatever the reason is tell the readers. For mine it's a flaw, a hole in the story, and one that gets filled with the readers imagination rather than fact.
Stunet, numerous surfers have reported these incidents to Police about people dropping in and flicking the board at people "Surf Rage". Problem is that you need to prove the intent at the time of the incident. Good luck in proving in court that someone took off and purposefully flicked a board at you. "I fell off and my board hit him", let alone get someone to turn up at court who was a witness to it. You know how society is - we all see things that are wrong but don't step up and say something because we just say it does not involve me.
So, there's "less violence now than before" hence everything is OK? To draw attention to violence - even if beat up - is over the top? How about rather than being defensive stepping up efforts to get rid of violence? No? We wouldn't go that far because that may mean losing our "hard-earned" privileges in the surf? There are other ways of organizing line-ups rather than violence e.g. skill some surfers show and guidance.
The Fairfax journalist couldn't locate "evidence" but what BB provides to contest the journalist's is his own anecdotal "evidence"? Regardless, nearly all experiences of violence in the surf will go unreported because they are considered part and parcel of the culture (see?) and too minor to report to police. Young surfers continue to be taught to "suck it up".
Comment section has already got accounts of witnessing violence or being part of it. BB himself notes two occasions, even if over a long period of surfing.
Even if only some people have been unfortunately part of violence - even over an entire surfing life - it can be traumatic. I have been both speared by a board, punched to the head, and chased out of the water, etc. And, even if I say so myself, I am hardly an intimidating figure and follow the "rules" to the letter.
Further, violence doesn't have to literally occur for its effects to be felt - the effects of violence. Some surf locations and their hierarchies are policed by the ever-present "threat" of violence, so the actual violence is doing its job in perpetuating certain effects - maintaining particular arrangements of power.
So, the premise is correct. Surfing does have a history of violence and the culture (albeit this is some homogenous term and many surfing communities are different) has relied upon it for "policing" the water and belonging, as well as its own myth-making.
We should decry all violence - or, wouldn't we go that far? Because, well, we "need" it otherwise it would be anarchy, right? So, what's that tell us?
clif, my evidence is anecdotal because that, as far as I know, is the only evidence that exists. Maybe some law student will do a trawl through the court records to find out just how many assaults are related to surfing but until that happens it is irresponsible and unfair to assert that surfing culture is violent.
Only a tiny percentage of assaults would be reported. So evidence from this source isn't going to tell you much. However, as we can see even in the few comments here people have had at least one encounter in the surf and know of more. People also know there is a threat of violence if they transgress. Again, evidencing violence. Then there's the myth-making built on the back of well-known instances of it. The prevalence is of course debateable. Nevertheless, violence plays a role and as you note in your article it shouldn't be - not a lot nor a little and we should all work at ridding it of any (same with broader society). One instance of violence is too much. I mean, you don't play other sport and participate in other activities and have the possibility of violence as second thought. I am not defending the article but questioning why the premise of the article can even be reached even today.
I might add, having been in Admiralty (HK) and going back tomorrow I have been in awe how people have mobilized non-violent tactics. If it's possible in such a high stakes arena then we could think more of how to do such elsewhere? Then again, maybe I am simply caught up in the fervour of the moment. These people are inspiring.
Can't say that I have ever worried about violence in the surf clif. I think we live in a violent society as shown by domestic violence and drug and alcohol fuelled violence on the streets. Some of that does end up in the surf but at a low level and it has its roots in the common culture of violence rather than in surfing itself.
I understand your point, and agree. However, sometimes I do worry about violence at some spots and sometimes localism (a feature of surfing) is the root cause for a use of violence (even if that way of dealing with issues - violently - is learned both in surf culture and in the broader society. Anyway, good article. Grounded and holding people generalizing and passing judgement to account. Thanks.
Thanks for the article BB.
The thing about " locals setting the tone and maintaining the standards" in some line-ups is all good, so long as they are not contributing to the tension by taking more than their fair share etc........
Well the big hole in the story is this.!
Hearing from a bloke who knows a bloke who knows old mate.
Old mate was doing the thing with old mates girl on the sly, which old mate found out about this after the first altercation.
Not from the horses mouth I might say, just gossip amongst.
Bumper stickers and fridge magnets are coming out
" Don't surf here Whilst doing the thing Whilst I'm surfing"
I suppose the next step is "go pro name and shame"...... On social media.... Shamed in front of the world.......
If the police charged this bloke...I think you would be hard pressed to get a guilty verdict in court, a half decent barrister would twist this into an unfortunate accident.....
Mmmm, not sure about that. If the facts reported in the press article are correct, there would be witnesses. If they back up the story, even a decent barrister would be hard pressed to argue there was a proportional response to verbal provocation in the water, even without adding in what subsequently allegedly happened on the beach.
So unless Stu's right about there being a gaping hole in the facts, I can't see why this is a simple case of aggravated assault and grievous bodily harm.
Agreed Rabbit, there's localism and there's localism. I'm sure people here have been in breaks which just 'work' because every body out seems prepared to respect the order in the line up, basic etiquette and each other while on the contrary some breaks can just be a nightmare with locals being completely out of line and the wholes scene is just a shitfight. I've been in breaks like this where locals don't think twice about dropping in, snaking or being overtly aggressive for no/reason other than they are 'local'.
I'm not sure about the changing demographic influencing the behavior toward lesser violence, perhaps this is right but in this case the guy speering the board was around 50 ffs and it has been my experience of often older guys being agro, locals or otherwise.
B.B do you think it is merely coincidence that this article is dredged up on the back of failed efforts for permits/licensing? Certainly provides a good case to sway public opinion.
Not sure if there's nefarious intent, but I questioned the timing of the article insomuch as it referred to Phil Jarratt's recent book "That Summer at Boomerang." Phil has written another book since then "Bali: Heaven and Hell" so the article may have been written a while ago.
That makes more sense - sellin papers and sellin books.
I have seen a rise in violence in the surf, in line with our society as a whole due to the new drugs.
http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2014/s4078231.htm
http://www.smh.com.au/national/health/study-links-ice-to-violence-201405...
When I lived in Ballina, I saw lots of phsycho, bug eyed kids screeching their brains out in the surf. A local friend from there got set upon by a pack of drugged out kids armed with golf clubs, whilst walking home up the hill to his house in Lennox. He can look after himself no problems, but said a car just pulled up, he figured someone was going to say hello, and next thing he's being smashed in the head with golf clubs. Apparently they, the local surfers had some meeting about it, the ice issue with the kids. I've seen its effects on people in the surf, and outside, all over the place. It creates the mindset of paranoia, who gives a fuck, and invincibility... 'hard core', 'entrepreneurial' mo fuckers.
Flicking a board at someone is just wrong no matter which way you look at it. I think it's the lowest of the low as far as surfing goes
My old man had a board flicked at him in the late 70s. Broke his jaw, pierced the inside of his mouth, and gave him 100+ stitches. A low act indeed, although he was riding a surf ski at the time so...you know.
Taking on TBs and others angle I suggest we refer offending article to Media Watch; they'll get to the bottom of it.
Stu, that's a big call publicly admitting your father rode a goat boat; still didn't deserve the board flick.
Maybe , maybe not. He wasn't in sluggoes was he ? That's you're clincher.
While we're being brave about it I'm willing to own up to similar crimes being committed by my own father. Oh the horror. Love ya dad.
But please don't ever do it again.
Of course he was in his sluggoes. My old man did everything in his sluggoes: mow the lawn, fill the car with petrol, go shopping for groceries. Fucked if I know where he kept his wallet. Down with the budgie perhaps?
But in his defence he did make his own skis. None of the those short Aero wave skis for my old man. One of my abiding childhood memories is of hanging in the garage while Dad glassed a freshly shaped blank, unrolling sheets of itchy fibreglass while slopping buckets of toxic resin...and his only safety wear being a decades old pair of sluggoes.
You're painting a vivid picture there Floyd. I hope for your sake the fruit fell a long way from the tree, at least in the sartorial stakes.
Full surfer/hippy trip much to my dad's amusement ……
You're taking the piss ... right ... floyd? lol
Bugger world issues and the propaganda-motivated reporting of them, surfers have been aggrieved, the whole culture slandered! Quick ... rally the media watch troops!
I heart surf skis
our history before legropes was one of ..." you pay the consequences if you drop in," which down here ,long swims,and then find ya board on the rocks......all because someone dropped in on you and you didn't get round the section lost your board,you had to swim in retrieve your board,hope the fin wasn't broken ...or your board wasn't too damaged to paddle back out.
One of the ways to avoid the swim was to kick your board over the top of the wave and hope the offshore carried it ,so you quickly get back in the lineup.
Of course a few drop ins got bds in the back of the head/back......and or a screaming surfer pissed off because he was hit.
In these days gone by it was also socially acceptable to go down the pub have a few drinks ,have a fight see how good or bad you were then buy the other a beer.....
what I saw as kid...was a pretty violent sport , but you were made to be responsible for your actions....and dropping in was a low life act....
We live in different times now...and there are still a few ol feral fossils who are caught between ol school " take responsibility for your actions,warts and all"......and todays laws which ...even threatening someone verbally is assault.....
Having surfed trestles the last few years....and one of the downsides there is ....there is no pecking order...police are called even for a minor incident...any Kook can drop in anytime and there are no repercussions from his behavior.....so its a complete shit fight....with little or no respect.....
Its pretty clear that this guy did not call police,which he should have.....
as for Nat and rabbit...they got what they deserved...in fact rabbit was lucky to get off so light.....
.
From what I've seen through the media, it looks like you've got to have a mile wide masochistic streak to even paddle out at Trestles. No matter how often it's referred to as a " skatepark ".
Sounds and looks like a shitfight. That's the egalitarian nightmare that any one that hasn't put in the effort to become proficient dreams of though.
Brutus have you read Chas Smith's 'Welcome to Paradise Now Go to Hell'? Interesting take on this topic in Hawaii.
haven't read it but seen and heard the result......not happy the boys in Hawaii........haha
I disagree totally about both Nat and Rabbit. Violence is not any part of the solution to rudeness or bad behaviour. In the surf. I don't know much about Nat's case but Rabbit was a skinny lightweight who got bashed by how many big brave boys? I can't remember maybe you know but anyone who takes part in that shit is a coward.
Hi BB.....Rabbit insulted and called out the hawaiins......bustin down the door was one of the most infamous periods in surfing history...the aloha spirit was never the same again...I lived these times and and have first hand experience of this period...rabbit was lucky....
Nat hit the 21 year old son...split him open needed stiches...and dad being half the size of Nat fronted him and the rest is History.Nat has a history of picking his mark....and this time he picked on the wrong guys...
there seem s to be a lot of people here saying that there is never any cause for violence....its human nature......
Violence as "human nature"? Wrong. If that was the case everyone would be violent and resort to it and they are not and do not.
brutus I arrived on the North Shore immediately after the bashing and spent the whole season there including a lot of time surfing and hanging out with Rabbit, but the point is, whoever it is, whatever they say or do, violence is the wrong response.
I was there in 73/74..hanging out with Reno and BK....so I got a bit of a different story ,from the Hawaii point of view....
so if you kid was being bashed in front of you.....you would......???
I would do what was necessary to prevent it brutus and if it was in anyway serious, I would then report it to the police. I can understand that rush of anger when something happens and how quickly it can turn to violence but what happened to Rabbit seemed much more cold blooded than that.
"what was necessary".......if it was serious......so maybe the interpretation of whats serious...we will get violent to protect our loved ones??
I am not sure if you really understood how deeply the boys from Hawaii offended and insulted....I know there is still resentment in Hawaii from this time....they were really hurt and reacted in what was acceptable at the time.....just lickins,nothing broken...no long stint in hospital.......at the time just a smack in the head......
I think the attitude is that we will respond to violence with the restrained force necessary to stop it continuing. And it was never clear to me that he had been disrespectful in anyway other than surfing the way he had grown up surfing, with that cheeky contemptuous attitude that was encouraged at the time. If that was the only issue then there many many more appropriate ways of dealing with it. I heard rumours that there were other issues that had nothing to do with surfing but he never talked about it and I never asked. I never read "Bustin' Down The Door" so I don't know what he said there. It was all a long time ago now and here we are still talking about it which backs up my point that if surfing really was violent this incident would have been overwhelmed by dozens of later ones.
Hi BB we are starting to sound like a pissing contest.........my opinion on Rabbit ,Kanga etc is from the Hawaiin perspective and I often get quoted ...saying," a bunch of blokes fired up and thought they busted down the door in Hawaii and were better than the locals,but what they saw behind the door was a bunch of angry Hawaiins ,having had their culture insulted ,the blokes turned around and ran home with their tail between their skirts!"......
this was an embarrassing time for Australian surfing.....as the best surfers in Hawaii those years were the Hawaiins........
as for restrained violence....its an emotional reaction and very hard to control,interested to see what Stu reckons if his kid was being bashed or raped do you go down the pacifist track?
.....as for "if surfing was really violent the incident would have been overwhelmed by dozens of later ones."..............most have not hit the headlines , I have seen a hell of a lot of fights etc in Hawaii,cars burnt out,guns pulled,guys bashed ,speared.......
Yep, violence is the wrong response, but "fight or flight" has been with us since we started using our hind legs.... We are animals... People forget that....
BTW, is a bloke who lives at Tugun but throws his weight around at Snapper considered a "snapper local"? Isn't his "local" Tugun beach?
Noosa is an oddity.... I used to laugh out at Granite and Ti tree when guys got pissed off, throwing up the "local" thing..... FFS, Granite is deep in a national park..... No one lives at granite.. Hardly anyone lives in fucking Hastings st.... We all drive to the National park.... We're all visitors, even us guys from Coolum..... Just because some are in a position to surf Boiling pot more often due to flexi time, or being on the dole or whatever, doesn't make them a "local'........ It makes them lucky.....
If you live in the gatta, sure, snapper is your local..... But you have to realise the gold coast only exists because of tourism.... Blow ins are a way of life.... bread and butter for the community..... if you can't handle it, do what FR did, what Uplift did, what I did...... Move to a less crowded area.....
Clif, surfing does have a violent history: it's polynesian roots are steeped in rigidly enforced laws of taboo/kapu with violent consequences for infractions.
Fact is, surfing is hierarchical by nature and that's hard to stomach for modern democratic ideals, especially for late-learning beginners who think they have "equal rights" in the surf. That kind of entitled attitude expressed in the statement : "oh the surf belongs to everybody" produces the kind of chaos that is far more dangerous than a pecking order, even one enforced by unsavoury means.
Where I surf , with a reputation as a sometimes violently local surf break, sees far less violence now. an accepted premise amongst long term surfers. But regulation occurs far more frequently, mostly due to increasing crowd pressures from people unable, or unwilling to show basic respect to local residents.
I reject your premise that violence or even the threat of it is necessary for regulation of dangerous chaos, but some sort of on the spot verbal education of people putting others in danger through their actions is.
This is unclear: "I reject your premise that violence or even the threat of it is necessary for regulation of dangerous chaos, but some sort of on the spot verbal education of people putting others in danger through their actions is."
That is not my premise i.e. "violence or even the threat of it is necessary for regulation of dangerous chaos". I was saying that this is a commonly invoked premise and leads to the persistence of such practice. My point was I reject it and promote alternatives that have been used and are effective i.e. verbal education - even if it may get heated.
For argument sake hehe:
Perhaps it is precisely the "unwritten rules" of the hierarchy are what causes chaos as it is not clear to beginners etc. and takes considerable time to learn i.e. the pecking order and who is and is not a local isn't always obvious or clear (sometimes, not even to locals!). I think that is why those cultural laws of the surf signs were a good idea, albeit they said nothing about local "rights".
What if it was the rule everyone had to simply wait their turn (including locals) given that everyone has an equal right to the sea - an easy rule to understand. Blasphemy! Outrageous! I know, I know - unrealistic - but it is interesting how this "equal rights" model is effective at times and result in some of our most favoured surfing experiences.
I have a dream ...
:)
Yes, effective as hell when there is no one else out Clif.
I think you are confusing equal rights with uncrowded surf. Two very different realities.
But I agree in principle. Abolish all hierarchies, even the ones that govern academia.
Let all the common people write academic papers and have their voices given equal weight to those who have put years into gaining expertise and PhD's.
let skill, merit, time served count for nought.
Yes, exactly. People do that, anyway.
Abolish hierarchies (Including academia hehe. Blow up the university!)
Skill, merit, and time do still count but they needn't be imposed on others or legitimised or governed by those who believe theirs are authoritative because the current predominant formulation favours their particular interpretation of what qualifies as skill, merit, and appropriate commitment.
Fun for all. Softtops to the top of the point. Patients treat psychiatrists. Taxi drivers run the country. Politicians ... well ... I got nothing there.
Free ride your comment on 'late-learning beginners' is so true in Bali with the Euro's. They have literally no idea, drop in, run over, throw their board isn't it great fun in the surf. You do your block at them and they look at you like your a psycho killer. Surfing has few rules and anybody should be able to follow them. Don't drop in is pretty simple. A mistake is cool, a habit is not.
@whaaaat, do you remember a similar scenario that happened on your old coast
a gent i'll call the Saudi one purposely flicked his board at a younger surfer causing injury.......all in front of a witness.....a fellow kneeboarder surfer i'll call the mules dad.....off to court....nah nothing to answer for......off scott free.
Ben or Craig may remember ?
Udo, I heard about the incident, but not the subsequent court case. If I remember correctly, the bloke you call Saudi was at least two snags short of the full barbi. Was his mental state put into issue? I surfed at the same time with him once: psychotic. Seriously.
I remember that one udo, he was straight back out there soon after flicking boards again that were the size of SUPs.
No, this article is all wrong. The answer is more government regulation, and a pay to play system at the most crowded breaks. We all need this for the safety and continuation of the sport.
The Gold Coast idea of charging for surfing crowded breaks is a great idea to stop surf rage and violence. It should be adopted all over Australia. The rate charged needs to be set fairly high, at a level where the unemployed and underemployed will have to really think about the opportunity cost of surfing. i.e., can I afford to surf this week and pay rent/food (shouldn’t I be looking for a job anyway).
This will also allow those who have money, either from their own initiative, or because they come from money, to pay to play, and with epic uncrowded waves being a valuable commodity, I am sure they will.
The social and economic benefits of such as scheme are obvious: dole bludgers will find jobs, council coffers will rise. This means more government spending on infrastructure and other important things such higher salaries for its staff, and also to hire more public servants.
We shouldn’t just stop there but. We should also consider a surfing licence where:
-so many hours of swimming must be completed each year (logbook);
-so many hours of volunteer lifesaving should be completed;
-completion of various courses e.g. learn to surf course for starters followed by a resuscitation, first aid etc (all courses must expire and be renewed to keep the economy rolling).
-a different course for every different type of surfing equipment i.e. if you done the Malibu course than you must do the short board course to ride that;
-insurance;
-Further, every course must be provided by accredited trainers;
-licence fees should be adjusted to inflation, or take account of Council budget needs, or should just rise annually in any case, as it will be needed somewhere to pay for a larger bureaucracy;
-Steep fines for those in breach, or confiscation of surfing equipment. Perhaps even better, how about mandatory jail sentences for breach, if not in the least for surf rage.
-Lockout could even be considered (it works in the
nightclubs apparently). If you are not at the break by a certain time, or if
the break is at full capacity, you are barred, or have to line up. Perhaps an entry card system, only surfers with health care cards between these hours, those with pay slips showing an annual salary of over 50K between these hours.
-Beach Bouncers will also be needed. Or local life guards will have to also do some security/police training. We all know many of them like to tell people what to do, so they will particularly enjoy the extra powers;
Gold Coasts Surfing Council
The surfing council, the body to discuss this, should include people like Rabbit, Joel Parkinson, Mick Fanning etc (only people who or did once rip in the surf). That is, the same people that have surfed more incredible waves all over the world than any average joe, and who are self-entitled to continue getting more good waves at home than anyone else. After all, Rabbit himself was saying Joes and Mick should be jumping up and down about getting Kirra back to its former glory because they have the skills to get minute long barrels. Don’t worry about everyone else that won’t be able to take off on the very small defined take off area, and won’t be able to enjoy the much more user friendly Superbank (because we all know you can’t really have both).
Prominent businessmen who may profit from this scheme, and government organisations that will profits, must also have their say. Finally, don’t forget Kelly Slater (who is not from Australia but who knows a great deal about surfing), who must also be heard on how to manage Australia’s beaches.
This is a great idea from the Gold Coast, and they should be proud of producing this precedent, as other councils and governments around Australia will also look to surfing as a possible income stream. Moreover, other arguably more crowded breaks around the world, because they have larger populations of both local and tourist surfers (take parts of Europe, Brazil, Indonesia and USA for instance) can look to this brilliant Australian policy (started on the wonderful Gold Coast) as something they should consider adopting.
That reminds me of one other important thing: life jackets for rock fisherman. Seriously, we can’t just draw the line at fisherman. There are always spectators on the rocks nearby fisherman, whether family or friend, or even a stranger interested in the size of a catch, and these people are also at risk. There should be new laws that state anyone who goes on rocks in the immediate vicinity of the ocean must wear a life jacket.
This will also include surfers who enter the surf via the rocks.
But why stop there, people can die walking along the beach. People have been washed into dangerous rips from storm surges or large waves when they were simply standing on the beach. What value can you put on a human life? Any new laws should really make it illegal to enter a beach (stand on the sand) without a life jacket, and this jacket must be worn by everyone at all times…..
All we need is more articles, radio and tv shows, telling us about the dangers of surfing, rock fishing, or even walking on the beach, and these things can come true. So come on swell net, why not jump on the bandwagon with everyone else, cause even writing against your still promoting it.
SempleC…a very 'funny' article.
and this jacket must be worn by everyone at all times…..
And be high visibility
Moth do you the remember the injury the surfer got ?
My high visibility jacket says "kook in progress". Warns everyone in advance. Works well.
I've got one that beeps loudly when I'm paddling out.
Surely the rise of virtual surfing in the post human world will take care of over-crowding.
From memory (which isn't so good) 'mr reid' copped a fractured skull and 35 stitches across the top of his nose and forehead.
For sure, freeride. I have just surfed "the Right" courtesy of Mark Mathews.
Whaaaat with the highly visible jacket on saying " ... "
Lots of factors to this... Lifto touched on the drugs. But that's only one small bit of the puzzle.... "Soccer mums and dads" aren't on ice, but some of the violence and vitriol on the sidelines is quite bizarre.... Don't know what's worse, and sesh at 3 foot snapper, or under 9's...... Poor ref.....
Lots of pent up emotion in society these days.... "When I'm surfing, I forget about all the problems on land"..... Bullshit.... Some people take their hidden angst with them into the lineup... They often don't even realize it... Subliminal... I know I've done it... Bet everyone has.....
Then there's another point I have touched on in the past, ruffled a few feathers too... Us surfers on a whole are incredibly selfish individuals.... MY break.... MY wave.... MY pursuit... ONLY a SURFER knows the FEELING.... Cold turkey for a drug... The drug den that is snapper has 300 addicts looking for a fix, but only 20 injections are available... And what makes it more perverse is that this addiction has a narcissistic element, where the addict wishes that everyone see's him get the biggest injection, and will even film the "hit".....
Some of us ween ourselves off the narcissism additive, and move to isolated regions, where we are free to inject daily, without having to share...
We occasionally have cravings for "recognition"..... But it subsides.....
Yeah your all a bunch off shellfish cunts.
Under 9s soccer Mums and Dads are on ice for sure, kick it johnny, score johnny, use ya glass head johnny, puff it up boy not long to score, just another one point johnny..????
lol.... :0) Are you blind,ref?!!??? My kid got fouled !!!!! Fuckn white maggot!!!!!
Don't worry... Everyone gets a medal.... Even the losers........
That in itself creates problems.......
Hang on a minute, my boys not Nazi..????
He's got a little hat on his head mate, covering his bald spot.
I used to reff soccer when I was about 12-13. I once had a 40+ year old dad try to follow me to my bike rack and threaten the "beat the shit out of me" because I missed a foul and his son sprained his ankle or some crap.
Crack heads the lot of em, they must all deal too because they drive those stupid Land Rover Sports that never once leave the bitumen.
Foxy speared me in the leg @ B-Rock, when I burnt him once, he reckons he didn't see me, but I ain't so sure, and reckon I didn't see him (winks all round). 9 stitches and carry the scar proudly in back of thigh, cos' ya shouldn't burnt Foxy @ the 'Rock, ha. We is good mates for long time.
Now, getting back to carrying Tazers...Uppo! you'd be the first bloke I'd Tazer, cos you heaps tough n powerful from eatin' all them eggs.
Actually, thinking about it, being speared by Foxy in the leg, felt like being Tazered, which I prefer to being capsicum sprayed.
Sid is that big Foxy from Bendelong, Ulladullah ways???
I used to surf with him a lot, if it's the same bloke?? Good surfer and took no shit in the water!!!
Most commenters here have implied that the people getting beaten up are people who’ve done something wrong and that the locals who frequently beat people up are defending the rules of the surf (if a little too aggressively). This is not always true. Many times the locals are the ones dropping in, frustrated by increased crowds and feeling entitled to a lion’s share of waves. In this case, those standing up to them for their right to a few waves are the ones getting beaten up.
I had my board destroyed and a hit to the face after being chased to shore in a situation just like this a few years ago at a very crowded beach that I’ve lived and surfed at for over 20 years (20 years despite me obviously never being ‘one of the boys’).
As for the comments about going to the cops – how’s that going to play out when I next paddle out AT MY LOCAL and run into the bloke I pressed charges against and his mates? It’s a good way to never get a wave out there again at the least if not get assaulted again.
I disagree Harryc. The police are pretty good at dealing with violent offenders and once they have been charged they risk losing their bail if they approach you again. As for the others, bully boys usually have a few hangers on but no real mates while your behaviour in standing up to them will likely earn you respect from many of the other regulars. Your response is what they trade on, don't give them the satisfaction.
Harry a similar thing happened at a local break a while ago when an old established surfer decided to take up SUPPING. He went out amongst a group of younger semi locals and hogged the waves. They spat it and fronted him in the car park arguing the point. He is a big guy and can throw a punch which he did. The young guys told the cops and the shit hit the fan. This older guy is also a solicitor so it got messy. Upshot of it is nothing was done but the older guy is very sheepish with that F...in SUP and does his own thing well away from surfers now. No charges but it did work.
yeah, FUCK the LOCALS, Tazer those cunts too.
Tell ya what my wife would've looked a lot worse than old mate having a cry over a sore eye.
FFS, harden up.
Welly wtf do you mean by this comment? I've read it about 6 times and I can't figure it out.
Are you calling this a "sore eye"? I think it's a little bit more than that..
And the wife bit??
Or are you just taking the piss? ( I hope so)
For sure GF;)
The polynesian tradition of lineup domination through intimidation and threats of violence is alive and well in NZ. Fair enough , they were here first and us honkeys stole there land and cant fight as good so we just suck it up and tempt fate on the regular when certain people are in the water. Its a fine line between pleasure and pain.
As for letting travellers and numpty fuckin gits with two clues share set waves after a 5 week hitch of 12 hour days , fuckin dreaming.
Spend half your life earning your spot in your local line up to give it away for some PC sharing shit, yeah right. Do your time and earn your spot. As for the violence thing, there is a big difference between spearing a board into someones face and a clip in the carpark for a severe breach of protocol.
........I disagree inzider, once the violence starts you don't know where it will end. Clip the wrong person and you might be stabbed.
I agree to a point BB , gone are the days of good old one on one fisticuffs followed by a handshake. Luckily most surfers around the joint over here arnt of the weapon carrying kind.
Oz is probably a different kettle these days. than it used to be. You guys have way cheaper hard drugs and way more crowded line ups to nuture random acts of aggression.
More than that BB :)0000PPPP ;):):))))0000
You honestly don't know half of would go on.
Not fair enough despite the dispossession.
And here is me all naive thinking however is on the inside gets the wave. Inzider it is bullshit if someone has been patient, not hassling finally gets a wave and is on the inside and locals drop in on him just because he lives out of town. That is plain and simple bullying and sucks by any standard. Extrapolate that and you will be baking people in ovens.
Whaaaat, have messaged you on your gmail acc.
Just as a matter of interest BB :
"Just in case something I say later is taken out of context, let me make it clear that I believe violence, or the threat of violence in the surf, is always wrong. It can never be justified."
What about in clear cases of self defence? Is violence justified then?
I'll second that question.
Look, as Brian said, 'Blessed are the cheese makers'. It's easy to say, yep, provided it's a proportionate response, self defence is justified. And it might be, sometimes.
But then there's the great unknowns: what if the other guy has a knife/ eggshell skull/ heart condition/ brother who wears Hells Angels' colours / a baby who'll grow up without a father when you're charged with manslaughter.
If you can possibly avoid violence, do so. If you can't, make sure you're sure.
I'll agree with that whaaat. In terms of fight or flight I am a firm advocate of flight. Run away, paddle away, just get out of the conflict zone. In terms of self defence I suppose you do what is absolutely necessary to protect yourself and no more, but that is a judgement call under stressful conditions so it's the last resort.
A sore eye!!!!
FFS
I WOULD OF DROWNED THE CUNT
How's the head this morning welly? you seem pretty drunk.
@udo & mothart
I was in the water on the day in question and the drop in was purposeful due to a complete lack of respect for a former Australian champ. You drop in and you face the consequences, the game many of us have played at some stage at the break in question.
The growth in enthusiasm for surfing brings the unfortunate side effect of players not understanding the 'rules' and a belief that 'I can surf where ever I like and how ever I like'. Schooling-in with a few wise words can work wonders. Tail riding mal riders need a lesson in cultural sensitivity.
Perhaps Mr Fucking Andrew 'ARAB" Mcardle should have spoken a few of those wise words and not assaulted somebody with his surfboard of sup proportions.
.
'Rabbit was a skinny lightweight'
Blasphemy!!! Experts said (after much scientific analysis) that he was the worlds greatest athlete that could dominate any sport he chose to! Now its come to this! Give the guy a break.
For once I am totally speechless. Running, hiding, being beaten up, picked on, knuckled, knifed, having 'locals' order you around, being pulverised and terrorised and ordered around by Arabs, snivelling, grovelling, remotely acknowleging surfee rules, cultures, gangs, mates, dogs, ninjas, guns etc, etc etc etc is something I have zero experience in. Sure, squwark ups happen regularly in surfing... its an integral part of the 'culture', but dont they always end in a nano second? Although I have to admit, bricky attacked me once, after I ran him over in our heat at the hotty. I honestly didn't know and thought I had some seaweed wrapped on my leg. Turns out it was bricky. He just slid off into the depths in embarrassment. Well, there was the time wordy climbed on to the roof of his fourby, in full view of the carpark, and in his hysterical state sqealed out if I didn't leave him alone, I wasn't allowed to come to his house. Heavy.
'Taser' lifty? Who knows, nothing else has worked, maybe that will.
Surf spots make a difference too. Great wave, but fucking lennox was a classic comedy capers. The goldy's the same. Like fathander outside corner, fifty or so people, of any age and gender, on any type of water craft, can catch and take off on the thing at once. Except at lennies and the goldy, they can all just lay in the white water, a hootin and a hollerin, eventually making their way to the face and claiming the inside... only to see another geek burst out of the suds doing the same thing. I've never seen entertainment like it.
If you want to avoid violence in the surf, just paddle out with lifty. Its miraculous.
Apart from my next 500 or so words of absolute dribble.
See, just another squwark up, then, like it or not, 'love is in the air'!
great article BB - i blame skyhooks- ego, is not a dirty word.................
No one believes me....!!!
The fact was all to do with their cock...
Seriously now, in my eyes it's pretty lucky old mate never lost an eye or two???
If he had lost an eye or vision would of circumstances have of changed toward the culprit..?
Do you reckon he would keep an eye out for the culprit?
I know you and eye would Floyd;)
Heres a short list of some of the things that I have seen cause a lot of injuries in the surf. Violence would be right towards the bottom:
- people out of their depth who throw their boards to go under a 'big wave'
- risky take off with others around and again a loss of control and board
- bloody jety skis in non remote areas and in conditions that don't need towing in
- drop ins
I have seen some horrible behaviour in some surfers, but physically punching on is so rare in my opinion. The media loves covering fights because people are intrigued by it and there is usually over dramatisation and a lack of actual facts that go into the stories. Violence is horrible, don't get me wrong, but it gets so much media attention because its like a car crash, you can't help but watch. Its the same way media will focus on a fatal shark attack rather than something deemed 'normal' or 'boring' such as famine or disease.
oh yes, and out of control SUPs
Fuck, if grant denyar is on ice the soccer mums ptobably are too! Well they are probably not 'on it' but they have had it, back in their dance party days, and now are living through the psychological and societal changes that came with it.
BB is right when he points out the incidence of physical violence in surfing is low. Especially when you consider the nature of surfing ie. Mainly males competing for a scarce resource in some primal display of skill, add cameras, fame and money and its trouble waiting to happen. I think cliff is right in pointing out there is an unseen violence and power in localism, for better or worse. Its interesting BB likes to write about all things polite and pious, then in surfing articles seems to advocate the merits of localism while ignoring the negatives and intimidating nature of localism. The nature that allows locals the lions share.
As one poster pointed out, you can be a local, but if you are not in the cool kids club you are regarded as a nobody. For a 'nobody' to engage someone over poor behaviour the nobody needs to be very brave or a little crazy. From my experince these brave crazy 'nobodies' often end up in a bad situation when they were the one in the right.
sypkan, I think the positives of localism outweigh the negatives in most situations. It is the fairest and most effective method of sharing the resource available , so until someone comes up with a better way, yes I am in favour of it. The "cool kids club" most places these days has an age range from sub-teens well into the fifties and in my experience is not a closed shop. What perhaps some people miss is that social skills are probably just as important as surfing skills.
The other aspect of localism that people miss is that it is set up to develop talent and, yes, that means the better surfers tend to get the most waves. If people think taking turns is the way to go......maybe they should try tennis because surfing has never been like that once the crowd reaches a critical point. We are all happy to take turns when in provides waves at a reasonable frequency, beyond that it is always going to be a game and the people who know each other and know the break will do better than others. If people find that unacceptable it's just bad luck. Complaining about it is as useful as complaining about the weather. But maybe wave pools will happen and then waves can be divided up on the same basis as any other commodity.
What? He with the most money gets most of the commodity?
Exactly. It's the capitalist way. Find something rare and beautiful, debase it, mass produce it and sell it cheap. What? You didn't think surfing could escape did you?
Its hard to argue against this logic, it makes a lot of sense and truth be told its what happens at my local breaks although I still tend to arrange my surfs at places and times where there is only a few out. I'm also happy to call it day after get my reasonable share. So I guess localism does work but the extreme end of it is flat out ugly. A very good friend witnessed a extreme bashing in the surf and was himself punched in the back of the head and told to fuck off while paddling out without warning on a recent trip to Hawaii.
I don't get violence in the surf having seen a fair bit over the years and I don't get why this guy didn't go to the cops. Is there more to the story we haven't heard about?
However, the side of localism - insisting on lions share - carries over into uncrowded sessions. This is when it particularly gets people's ire - when this gets over the top and when questioned local crew get aggro. "We" are not all happy to share waves when waves are uncrowded. Some people are just tools, I guess.
Yes, it is always going to be a "game". The point was it is a power arrangement - as all social situations are - but how do we omit violence from the repertoire of tactics used? As it is, some locals who "belong" continue to resort to violence and associated intimidation. It would help matters if other locals were to show how this shouldn't be an option. Also, other surfers sharing their knowledge more freely could help e.g. to beginners.
Unfortunately, some local crews are a closed shop. A shame, really. Glad yours isn't.
About 10 years ago I was in town for the weekend and decided to go for a surf on the midcoast in Adelaide's southern suburbs. It was the same crowded break the 'Arab' incident took place that was spoken about earlier in this thread.
One of the local guys was surfing with this jagged broken nose on his board and ended up dropping in on me, but I didn't call him off.
I just continued to surf along behind him. It's the mid after all, 2ft and nothing to get upset over.
Then he did this cutback towards me, ran into me and fell off!
This was no accident, the guy was too good a surfer for that. I must weigh 20kg more than him and have pretty good balance so he just bounced off me and I kept surfing the rest of the wave.
When I kicked out my foot felt a bit weird so I looked down and saw blood gushing from the side of it. The knife like nose of his board had torn an inch long deep gash in my foot!
I found out later that he regularly surfed his board like that. He must of thought it was a good crowd control tactic.
I went in and drove to the hospital to get stitched up. Ended up costing me a week off work as I couldn't get a steel capped boot on my foot and I lost $1000 in wages.
I was pissed off.
So I went back home to Yorkes to heal and let it be known to some mates who knew the guy that I wasn't happy. And I waited.
If I'd seen him soon after it may have turned ugly but about 6 months passed and one day I was surfing one of my home breaks and who should paddle out?
His face just dropped when he saw me but it was too late to squirm his way out of it and I lost my shit and verbally tore into him.
I let him know that he cost me $1000 and fucked my foot up pretty bad and he was back peddling (or paddling) at 1 million miles an hour, remorseful and apologising.
I said that I didn't care about the drop-in but why did he run into me?
He admitted he was just trying to scare me.
Anyway I just left it at that but me and my mate didn't give him any waves after that and just paddled around him like he wasn't there. I let everyone down here know who he was and what he'd done.
I've never surfed the mid since, to many fuckwits down there these days, but I've also never seen him down at Yorkes again either?
I hope he is enjoying his surfs on the midcoast or Dribbleton or wherever he surfs because he won't be getting any waves or respect from myself or any of the locals down here any time soon!
Meanwhile, at the top of the tree, 'educating' all and sundry, much, much, much more important violence, is unbelievably overshadowing even surfee violence. Our democratically chosen rep, our mighty leader, phil's boy, 'tone', (some would say 'he's all we've got'), has squwarked up, and officially, globally stated that he will flatten pute's. Pute's of course is pissed off, and has threatened to use his pro judo and wrestling talent, and so one of his boys reckons that he will go man on man, and stomp and submit 'tone'. Unfortunately, 'tone' is in squwark down mode as we speak. Not a good look for aussies... or phil...or the fearless, and proven killer corgis. HBO and Showtime are rubbing their hands together in glee. This will be the fight of all time, and just needs to be handled and marketed properly, obviously only using the appropriate amounts of violence necessary, to break all ppv records.
Thats funny, and sad. You would think, yeh, funny, but as if. Yet here we are, 2014, peak time, and as if, is actually as if, for real.
The saddest part is when brushing our teeth, getting ready for the morning, as we look up, we look into the eyes of those responsible. As much as we may deny it, 'tone' is our doing. We put him there, ala putes. And phil, and liz, and the corgis. He made the rep side, he is the rep side, because we set it all up. We wear 'tone' and putes.
And as we look up in the mirror, obviously, some, well, most... perhaps unfortunately, are going to see different things. A chosen few, like me, are 'blessed', so to speak. Again, I never asked to be better, I never asked to be special, and for that I make no apology as I burst out the door, 'tone' or no 'tone'.
uplift ...... for services to black comedy I nominate Tony Abbott and Tony Barber as comedians of the year closely followed by nominations to nick3 and grocer (although I'm left with the uneasy feeling that I have just nominated the same person 3 times).
hey welly, nah Foxy from Vic, not 'dulla.
Sunny G. used to make a real dick of himself when he visited Goldy in his younger days, he beat up a bloke at Burleigh after a drama. It was well documented in local press, even vid footage from memory, don't think it went down to well. And Johnny Boy G, was very uncool, which I found interesting since they both came from a place where respect is demanded. That didn't seem to transcend onto their own travels, but there you go.
My home goldy break was always kaotic but mellow. Not sure that can be said about the next gen that came thru after, heard some things that disappointed me.
Anyway, bring back the biff. And Tazers. Then chuck in some meth.
Here, Here.
I would like to say something most probably think but most not keen to talk about
1) Being a local should mean absolutely nothing. It shouldn't guarantee you priority or the right to drop in. Why does someone who has surfed a break for a long time deserve to be treated any differently?
When someone says they are a local I have a laugh to myself at them expecting that actually means they are entitled to something.
This doesn't mean I don't show respect. I don't drop in on anyone and I don't snake paddle. But if I'm in position I will paddle hard and call you if you try drop in. I have no problem in doing this or others doing it.
I do have a tendency to give more respect to older (50+) guys. Not out of a rule but just because I think its a decent thing for an Aussie bloke to do. If an old bloke is paddling I sometimes back off out of respect, not for some local hierarchy.
Also you can't expect to catch a set wave then paddle right back to the peak without giving others some priority who are waiting.
I was out at this heavy reef once and this kook kept dropping in way to deep and never making them. Also wouldn't shut up talking such a big game the whole time. I dropped in on him. Looking back I should of just told him to pull his head into line.
I think respect those who show respect, not locals because they live somewhere
And 2)???
Being a local doesn't guarantee anything zane except a slightly greater opportunity because you know the break and you know a lot of the people. The main function of localism is to stop every capable surfer in the district turning up at the best break on the day. I don't know where you surf but I can tell you that where I do, the outcome of that approach would not be pretty. The pay off for not constantly chasing the best waves is that when the spots you do surf get good, you have the advantages I described above. Advantages you will not get anywhere if you surf everywhere. But each to their own.
Blindboy. Being a local gives you advantage of knowing where is breaking well outside of crowded breaks etc but if I am surfing at your 'local' break I will treat you just like anyone else. You might know the local waves better and have mates in the lineup but if I'm in the spot I will go and I will call you off if you drop in.
So agree but you know my point wasnt that
Well said Zane. No one deserves any more respect than you . Even if the locals treat an area as part of their community and preserve that area as a pleasant place to be , why the fuck should you grant them anymore than a cursory nod of your self entitled head ?
After all, you've gone to all the trouble of rocking up to the place that they live and breathe.
I actually think localism is alright, it brings some order, but there are many kinds of locals and localisms. There are also many kinds of cool kid groups, I wasn't refering to boardclubs, all with differing ideas of what is cool and what is acceptable behaviour. And what is acceptable at one place is not acceptable at another, and what is acceptable on Saturday, may not be acceptable on Wednesday, and somehow, some guy, keeps breaking all the main rules that everyone agrees on, just because he's a 'local' (and a big cunt), then big cunt local gets upset when he's somewhere else and someone has the gaul to paddle inside him, so its all very confusing. To think its easy for blowin joe average to engage in conversation with big cunt local about his indiscretions, and then tottle off to the copshop when that doesn't go well is a bit simplistic.
I have seen those surfing etiquette signs as well but the glaring ommision on them is the rights of locals, if there are any. I'm cool with locals having rights or not, I can play it either way, its just you guys making it up need to make it clear.
It's Pretty funny watching the grumpy 50-60 yo aussies in Bali losing their shit at eurokooks who have no idea what they have done wrong.
Yeah Blowin your right, we should also tell all the immigrants, the wogs and the Muslims to go home aswell. Because if you don't like Australia GO HOME.
You are born or live somewhere so you feel "self entitled" to be treated differently.
I have been surfing the same place for 10 yrs plus, I don't feel entitled more than the next guy. But I show proper respect to all not to just 'the entitled few.'
If the rules we all know were enforced (not with violence but as a collective) as opposed to enforcing localisms ego then it would be a better place
you forgot kiwis in your list of people to get rid of, OZ is full of those fuckers too.
Riddle me this zane, You just got home from a 5 week hitch in the cooper basin middle of summer 55 degrees, helping drag fossils out of the ground so a visiting surfer can fill his car up to get to your home break that you have spent the best years of your life earning your spot for him to think hes earned the right to a set wave just cos he dosnt paddle up the inside? I reckon fuck you traveller. Pick some crumbs off the grommets in kiddies corner. scenario to ponder- there has been no good swell for weeks or months and locals are hungry, very hungry, even burning there mates for waves when they finally come and you think your gettin some cos your a nice guy. your pulling dream cones cobber.
How has your miserable life got any bearing on whether I can paddle for a set wave or not?
Just because you're not getting any from the missus means everyone else has to put up with your neanderthal behaviour?
@johpg^
Thanks for telling me my life is miserable it makes me feel a whole lot better.
Not sure which planet you surf on, but on my planet, in my inbred corner of the surf culture world,
We have a pecking order, which loosely relates to who is in the water on any given day in any given conditions. This order varies greatly, when the surf is average to shit most locals dont bother and travellers and groms and those sorts can have it too themselves and dominate.
However, when it is pumping it is a different story. Neanderthals are crawling out of their caves and dominating the proceedings. RESPECT IS EARNED not handed out willy nilly to all and sundry, case in point, last summer Taylor Knox found him self at one of our most well known right points, his behaviour was impeccable, he hung around the inside and slowly crept his way up the point making a bit of small talk with people keeping low key as possible. It was only 4 ft or so and very playful and not crowded. I was birthrightfully in my place out the back just picking off a few waves here and there letting plenty go through, Taylor edged his way out back and was having a chat with me when a set came through, I had priority and and said to him go man your on holiday. He looked at me and said "really ?" and me being the miserable cunt i am said "fuck yeah, shred that shit, and he duely tore that wave a new clacker all the way to the beach. Had that day been busy at said location it would have been a whole different story. A whole different crowd , behaving in a different way.
Moral of story, if you want to surf our local joints and expect just cos you breath the same air we going to hand out waves to tom dick and harry you are mistaken. But if you behave well , bide your time, earn some respect, you will get some no matter whether you a pro or just a b grade tootler.
Just because I aint getting any from my missus dont mean I aint gettin any from yours.
Get a job closer to home, stop working 5 weeks in a row trying to become rich.
You will find yourself surfing more often.
And hopefully, you'll stop being such a grumpy cunt!
Cheers
;)
Thanks for the advice GF, Unfortunately I chose to breed and buy a house, ( I know, I know what a FUCKIN GOOSE)
However, I am not trying to become rich, far from it, I just want to provide a life for my kids that has all the joy I experienced as a kid. My job sees me all over the joint for varying amounts of time, but it also saw me with 3 months off last summer to spend with my groms at the beach. I spent my 20's living the dream cuz, i'm just playing catch up now. I am not grumpy in real life , just might appear so on internet forums which is about as far from real life as we can get, Passes the time nicely at work though !
as i say to my aboriginal mates, we are all indiginous, cause we all live on planet earth and all are part of life. until someone can show me they created the ocean, they created the waves, then i dont give a fuck who you are or who you think you are, i belong in the line up just like anyone else and am entitled to have my waves without violence, verbal or physical, without being deliberately snaked or dropped in on, and if you dont do it, life will be giving you a payback for deliberately being unkind. use any excuse or justification you want, but from now on, if you deliberately act unkindly towards another, you will pay for it in some way, at some time, in some place. Planet Earth has had just about enough of humans being fuckwits, we own nothing, we are all just passing thru, we are destroying what we should be enjoying.
Guys check out surf rage on youtube.....and these are only the fights caught on camera.....I googled and came up with 96K examples
brutus I scrolled through a few pages and there were very few distinct incidents and they were well spread over space and time. Also there were various discussions and at least one band of that name. Thanks anyway for the idea I will try to analyse it when I have some time.
I wrote a story called " Toe to Toe " in the forums if you care to hear about an experience I've had with violence at the beach.
However, the side of localism - insisting on lions share - carries over into uncrowded sessions. This is when it particularly gets people's ire - when this gets over the top and when questioned local crew get aggro. "We" are not all happy to share waves when waves are uncrowded. Some people are just tools, I guess.
Yes, it is always going to be a "game". The point was it is a power arrangement - as all social situations are - but how do we omit violence from the repertoire of tactics used? As it is, some locals who "belong" continue to resort to violence and associated intimidation. It would help matters if other locals were to show how this shouldn't be an option. Also, other surfers sharing their knowledge more freely could help e.g. to beginners.
Unfortunately, some local crews are a closed shop. A shame, really. Glad yours isn't.
good research, brutus. 'orrible to watch.
I used to take a "friend/acquaintance" out to the reef to surf in good conditions. At home he used to kind of hassle a bit to get his share and some. Anyway, on his first trip out with me, to my astonishment, he would do the same! Here we are out on the reef, pristine conditions, crystal clear water, blue sky, clean fun waves and only the two of us out! None of this taking turns etc. At first it made me laugh thinking he just liked being on the inside and maybe taking off a bit deeper. Nope, he just couldn't help himself and when I talked to him about it he would just laugh it off. Needless to say after the second trip, he never got another invite, but out at the local he would ask when we would go out again!
Some people just don't get it.
Nothing worse than that guy Fitzy.
Best part about surfing is when it's uncrowded and no hassling, just a few friends enjoying the waves.
It's all good though FR. He has now moved to Bali and I have first hand reports that he has taken to dropping in on people out at Kuta Reef and Airports!!!
As I said, some people just don't get it.
I will have a look at some of them when I have time.....if they represent a large number of serious events then I will acknowledge that my experience has not been typical.
Very much a beat up original article & subsequent thread. Surfrage is just another microism of broader society, and by far the biggest contribs to all violence are alcohol and meth, which don't apply to the ocean based pastime.
Personally, I find a good blow up in the water most entertaining, verbal or physical, plus if 2 blokes wanna duke it out on the beach, great, 2 less blokes on the take-off for a moment. Too funny.
Of course Sid is Zen mellow on the zen ocean, enjoying the melodrama, just as I enjoy spectating a good bar room brawl with the big hay makers swinging wildwest style, chairs broken, blokes going thru windows... just another Friday nite at the Union Hotel.
Up in the Ozarks, they have an annual Rodeo, in gens past, the cowboys would arrive on Friday arvo, set up at the showgrounds, then head up the hill to meet the locals half way to the pub, where they where made to fight their way thru the locals to get to said pub, where the would then gather with said locals and drink beer. The cowboys loved it, the locals loved it. What was the problem ? None.
You could cherry pick any communion and find drama. Perfect example is the religious events where people get stampeded, or boxing day sales, or the latest iPhone release.
Violence? Ha. Wait till the W.W.W. internet crashes and the banks freeze and the ATMs run out of cash. Then you'll see some violence.
Besides, Sid is from Manchester blood, so it's all relative, methinks.
manchester blood!
okayyyy NOW I understand Sid a bit better.
;-)
Why is Sid referring to himself in the third person? Has he forgotten his medication?
violence ? trying surfing at the only surfspot in a city of 2 million on a 40oC day.
something always gives
Spent a bit of time in Manchester have we Clif ? but Yes, it is BIFF central.
However. Surely, one as intellectually advanced as your good self, is beyond generalising. Besides, The Smiths are also from Manck, are they not. Stop me oh o oh stop me... the Queen is dead and its so lonely on the hill.
F-R, Sid Fishus is Ficticious, you dig. Like are you Shaun Tomson at Off the Wall ?
Yes.
For Manchester read any city in the UK, helps us keep warm during the long winter months.
Manchester sid? I'm sorry I never knew. Still it's almost, though not quite, forgiveaable if you are from the blue side of town . Irredeemable if you're red.
Right you are Sid.
Anyone read the article on Lyttle street ,the authors meeting/greeting with Johnny boy Gomes in the surf in Hawaii.
I got a much better one that that udo. When gorilla boy from Kauai was staying with me in Ballina, we used to have some good banter offs, and as he was pretty helpless, and couldn't really fire them up in the gym, the gorilla banter inevitably revolved around mixing it up the 'boys' and bjj exploites, Kaiborg etc, etc. Throw a young pretzel like Pete in the mix, with a few black belt, hip hop doo utterings as well. However, gorilla's girl at the time was a hot blooded spanish lady who loved stirring the shit out of him, and would interject regularly... 'but justeeen, I seeen that Kai, heees jus leeetle an skkkeeeny, heees toooo fuckkeeen skeeeeny... justtteeen you got no fuckeeenn gunnns...
Then one day gorilla, pete and myself were heading for south wall, (which locals claimed 'was breaking like blacks'... drug epidemic) and the inevitable bjj stories were flowing. One particular comment was that 'having wrestled with the worlds best', who regularly visit Kauai, meant gorilla was 'pretty comfortable mixing it up and dealing with anyone'. As we were about to go out, he wanted a shot on my Delta Antman Spaceship thing, which was really different to his board, so I let him take it out. Heaps of guys were out, first wave he lost it a bit on the drop, and nearly ran over a big, inked up Maori looking guy, who could barely paddle, and who panicked and got hammered by the lip. The guy eventually grovelled back on his board, and started screaming at gorilla who had kicked out down the beach a bit. Gorilla has a classic yank accent, and started out a bit cocky, bit squwarky, but then when he got a good look at the guy, quickly went into squwark down apology mode... to no avail. Tatts lost it and started screaming about osama bin laden, killing fuckin yanks etc, etc, etc and tried to chase gorilla, but couldn't paddle to save his life. Gorilla bolted down the beach, claiming he'd seen a good peak down there, and I thought I'd try to help him and calm it down, but next thing tatts is gonna kill me. So we sat side by side, bit of a stare off, and I'm thinking, here we go, this guy might actually go, not exactly what I wanted, when a local guy sunny, (great surfer, nice enough guy) apparently knew the guy and muttered something. The guy went bunter and next thing was chasing him to the beach. Pete had much earlier gone into machado/rasta mode, and was freaking and already had hit the beach, only to see sunny bolt by, with the screaming tatts hot in pursuit. Sunny jettisoned his board and horrified pete tried to act casual as tatts smashed it to smithereens on the break wall, and then chased sunny, who climbed it, dove in and started the swim to North Wall. Horrified and paralysed pete was left nodding and understanding the tirade beautifully, gorilla who was by now a speck on the horizon copped one more spray, and tatts was gone.
I had so much fun on the drive home, and for once, the ferry was pure joy. BJ who? And then of course I was forced to tell the hot blooded spaniard.
Good one, lift.... hehehe....
Had a similar run in with a big fat tattooed guy of similar ethnic background in the pocket at Kawana once... Same guy? hehehe
Anyway, I swing around to take a late drop, and there's balloon man sitting bug eyed right in my line... Had to abort..... I did the "tsk tsk", which he took major offence to.... Ehh ya feckn wingnut cint!!! Lit's sort it out on tha bich ya blonde cint!!"
Soooooo........ Not being afraid of overweight guys who need to paint their skin to look menacing, I turned to another guy out the back who was wearing a watch... I yelled "hey mate, what's the time?"...... The stranger yelled back, " 1/4 past 9!!"
I turned to balloon boy and looked at him and said "fuck!!! 1/4 past 9!!!! Cmon them buddy, We better fight now.... I meant to be back in Coolum at 10.00.... I started paddling in, and turned around and yelled "fuckn hurry up man, I gotta leave when we've finished!!!"
He never paddled in........
old sheepy cant help himself, good one champ, it's always the quiet ones to be careful of, no talking, but sure as shit walking.
hows up lift's tale- classic that- camera would have been awesome- cue benny hill music
Yep.... And the ones pushed into a corner..... The meek mellow dudes that say no mate, no mate, don't wanna fight..... Then bam..... You see why they didn't wanna fight lol....
Hey, remember that dirty prick who king hit me whilst I was sitting down eating lunch? Cunt... Fought on valiantly but the damage was done.... He got his in the long run, Davo..... Revenge is a dish best eaten cold....... ;)
. Revenge is a dish best eaten cold....... ;)
Right on the Mark..! Hehe ;)
Yeh, you see some hilarious stuff, people sqwarking themselves into a nightmare. I met a couple of Victorian guys at the hotty one day. It was a bit big, but the tide was coming in, so would end up good. They were nice guys, said they hadn't surfed a lot, so I told them wait a couple of hours, when the tide's in and its settled down, and gave them some info about getting out. Anyway, they did eventually come out, got hammered a bit, but they loved it, and caught a couple. When we were talking they were on their way to see blacks, and I warned them to be carefull, blah, blah, blah. They were really nice guys, and I told them to follow me back and I would show them, and where to stay, etc. I advised them to surf next arvo, as it was dropping and would be high tide and clean. Oh yeh, one was a brick shithouse, nugget.
They did surf then, and I had a chat, tried to show them where they might snare a small one, and how to dodge sets. One local 'enforcer' was in a shitty mood, and had squwarked a few comments at them, even though they were harmless. When one went for a little one, the 'enforcer' bolted over, made sure he got it, and screamed at the guy the whole wave, who was stoked to just catch one, then couldn't get off the thing. At the end bowl enforcer kicked out right on top of the vicco, and threatened to 'jam his board up his arse'. It was the brick shithouse. The nugget flailed out the back, straight through the pack, sat right in 'enforcers' face, and as 'enforcer' tried desperately to pull off a composed sneer, and micro squwark in the brick shithouses shadow, brick shithouse said something like he would finish this up in there. And off he went.
A while later it was approaching dark, the tide had turned and we all started heading in. Except the usually, extremely fussy 'enforcer', who funnily enough kept surfing. On the cliff, a couple of 'enforcer' sidekicks, one builder, did a semi squwark, and the brickshithouse let him know crystal clearly, to shut the fuck up, which he did beautifully, and meticulously. One schoolteacher who enforcer always played games with, momentarily lost his mind, blinded by the chance to score some points with 'enforcer' and in his classic, class, pay carefull attention, I am about to educate you voice, started a squwark, which was swiftly dealt with by brick shithouse, and which quickly spiralled off into silence, and then a natty young, golf ball head, transformation speech, about peace and love in the surf.
The sun set, we all left, and brick shithouse fronted up the sidekicks, ordering them to 'tell ya fuckin' gutless mate, I'll see him here first thing in the morning.' The 'enforcer', was a lonely, slumped figure, floating out at sea, one with nature, silhouetted in the sunset.
Next morning sure enough, brickshithouse was on the cliff, but 'enforcer' was no where to be seen. Slight blemish on the 'legend'. We had a good laugh, the viccos were pissing themselves, and off they went.
It makes you wonder what processes, or lack of, if any, occur in the surfee mind, to create those scenarios. A better one was when a semi local, we'll call him 'bobo', not exactly known or famous for his knuckling ability, momentarily had a brain fade. I told before about the time Koby Abberton and his brother came up to surf blacks. When we were on the cliff blabbering after the first surf, when no one was around, heaps rolled up for the arvo session. He, Abberton, was just talking normal surfing shit, and as we all do, chucking a few little limestone rocks down in the sand just over the cliff edge. For some ludicrous reason, perhaps drugs, perhaps temporary insanity, perhaps the lure of fame, perhaps bouyed up by the fact he could thrash frosty and nods... and stewy, in arm, or more accurately, pretzel wrestling, bobo decided to become a local 'enforcer'.
In his best, I'm heavy, I'm comin', and I'm 'enforcin' sneer/squwark, bobo ordered Koby Abberton to stop chuckin the rocks, and started to go into his respect the locals, fragile environment etc speech. Abberton picked up a handfull of rocks, threw them at bobo, walked into his face, and said something along the lines of, 'shut your fucking mouth and get back in your fuckin car before I throw you off the fuckin cliff, wanker.' So bobo promptly, and masterfully shut his fuckin mouth, got back in his car, and wound the window up.
I hope "Bobo" wasn't wearing a trench coat sporting a bra with a stash pouch in it.
Chases of War style;)