Botany Nerds Ahoy
GreenJam wrote:Hi AW and Seeds. I'm just catching up on all this, and enjoying it as usual.
ahh, the Brachychitons/bottle trees - favourites, and I've got all four of them planted here, and all doing quite well. The 'populneus' the slowest of them all so far - it was grown from seed collected at Augathella. And I've always had a particular liking for the pink lacebark - seen some rippers in the dry rainforests. A bit over a week ago I spent some days down in the rainforest at O'Reilly's and saw some large specimens in the wetter forest down there too. Awesome - the whole place is awesome. This trip I was particularly in awe of some massive old Brush Box, incredible. Got right down into the Canungra Creek system, some stunning waterfalls... sorry, no photos, I'm sure you'll take my word for it
Greenjam. Hi, great to hear from you. Hi Seeds also.
Gj, I was in Augathella recently, loved it around there.
How have you been? Have you been working anywhere interesting?
Don’t you love Brushbox. Lophostemon confertus ( old and still used by older botany people, but they shouldn’t ,the syn. Tristania conferta.)
Makes great flooring as you would know, real nice blend of colours and hues in that cut and prepared timber, I’ve seen them in North Queensland, they can be massive, girth of some trunks have to be seen to believed.
Flowering here just this week in Victoria, all the nectivores are present.Good stuff.AW
Tonight’s offerings. Taken this afternoon .A favourite of mine for sure.
Probably not what you think it maybe ?
Small talowwoods?
lostdoggy wrote:Small talowwoods?
Lostdoggy. Hi . No, they are not small Eucalyptus microcorys Tallowoods.
Flower colour is the same, east to mistaken them.
All 11 photos I’ve posted have some great diagnostic features present, a little bit of close investigation and you could work it out if you know a little bit about Australian flora, in particular the Myrtaceae Family. Keep investigating. Others will add comment and the ball will be rolling. AW.
I don't know much.
Is that Armstrong Creek or a similar estate?
Redgum up top pic?
lostdoggy wrote:I don't know much.
Is that Armstrong Creek or a similar estate?
Lostdoggy, I think you and I live in a similar area within quick reach of Surf Coast waves. Photo was taken in Geelong this afternoon.
Be kind to yourself, I’m sure you know a bit, we are all learners.
Do you have a plant background, interest, landscaper , nursery, or simply love nature and the coast ?
Stick around, plenty of great contributors on this thread, doesn’t take long to pick up the basics, it’s a lot of fun if you like learning, I do, I love birds as much as plants.
I’d like to think most surfers have bit of connection to the world of which we derive a lot of fun from.
If your keen we could catch up and do some plant walks/investigations , coastal plants would be a good start, familiarise yourself every time you go for a surf, before you know it, youd know a whole swathe of plants, little steps at a time, before you know it you’ll have a wealth of plant knowledge, which leads to all other biological entities.AW
seeds wrote:Redgum up top pic?
Seeds, evening. All the photos are of the same plant/ tree. Clues are in all the diagnostics in those shots.AW
Pretty in flower that’s for sure
seeds wrote:Pretty in flower that’s for sure
Correct, the white flowers up against that green of the leaves and the colour of the bark, pretty nice, tree was alive, nectivores going nuts, birds, insects etc. AW
Thanks AW, I’m a Victorian transplant to NSW.
lostdoggy wrote:Thanks AW, I’m a Victorian transplant to NSW.
Lostdoggy. Good stuff, we are just animals, in our hemisphere, not uncommon for us to migrate north, the cold can wear you out. Hope you enjoy it all wherever you may be.
If it’s ok for me to say this, don’t be a stranger to Botany Nerds Ahoy, we are a weird lot but we love it. AW
Angophora hispida hey. Impressive tree. Are you saying Angophora don’t have gum nut lids and Eucalypts do?
seeds wrote:Angophora hispida hey. Impressive tree. Are you saying Angophora don’t have gum nut lids and Eucalypts do?
Seeds. Yes. AW
Ahh okay. I’m coming off the stool. I might move out of the corner soon!
Now I guessed by the flowers look like Lemon Myrtle flowers but then I see Lemon Myrtle are Backhousia. Shit I’m back in the corner
AlfredWallace wrote:seeds wrote:Angophora hispida hey. Impressive tree. Are you saying Angophora don’t have gum nut lids and Eucalypts do?
Seeds. Yes. AW
Seeds. Go to Google, good explanation there. Type in Angophora don’t have an operculum. AW
What about Backhousia
seeds wrote:What about Backhousia
Seeds. Backhousia is in a different alliance inside the Myrtaceae family. I’m going to explain shortly ( tonight) how Myrtaceae is broken up, primarily plants with dry woody fruits and the other group plants with fleshy fruits. Inside of those groups are all different types of alliances, for example the Leptospermum alliance etc. As you’d be aware, all the classifications are based on floristics ( all the flowering parts). It’s very interesting and when you understand it , you’d be surprised how easy it is to identify plants in the Myrtaceae family. AW
@wax24
I reckon you mighta just come off a shift, but @AW, @seeds, et al, would love some US west coast input into this thread, I'm sure. Do you take pics of plants or trees or birds on your wilderness meanderings? (any cool old eucalypts about that you know of?)
Seeds. Angophora hispida. Older than Eucalyptus phylogenetically.
In those photos. Angophora always has opposite leaves, no operculum ( gum nut cap, lid), those ribbed woody fruits also diagnostic, see the little protuberances around the top of the fruits.
Eucalyptus have opposite leaves at ‘birth’ but then develop alternate leaves and a single operculum ( gum nut cap or lid) and Corymbias ( the bloodwoods), can have a double operculum shedding the lid twice.
It doesn’t take long to learn to distinguish the difference between them. I’m baked, continue this chat tomorrow evening. Always good fun AW.
basesix wrote:@wax24
I reckon you mighta just come off a shift, but @AW, @seeds, et al, would love some US west coast input into this thread, I'm sure. Do you take pics of plants or trees or birds on your wilderness meanderings? (any cool old eucalypts about that you know of?)
Wax24. How’s things mate ? Hope you’re well.
We’d love some Californian West Coast botany, all the big trees, redwoods, oaks, other conifers, desert dwellers, xeriphytes from Socal etc.
From your northern border with Canada to Tijuana in the south. Bring it on. AW
Hey Base and AW.......... i actually very rarely take pics. I like to soak it in and have the photo in my memory bank. BUT! I will start gettin some pics of local flora (maybe fauna, when they cooperate) for yiu guys. Let's keep our expectations low of me tho, hey? lol
California actually planted alot of eucalyptus trees back in the 19th century. They are so common where i'm at that i grew up thinking they were a Northern Cali native plant. I used to scavenge euc groves for hard wood for the stove during lean winters.
G’day AW, good you’re back and I’m enjoying reading your positive posts. My physical annus horribilis will now continue into the new year, bugger it, still hitting the water just!
Keep the positive vibes coming!
wax24 wrote:Hey Base and AW.......... i actually very rarely take pics. I like to soak it in and have the photo in my memory bank. BUT! I will start gettin some pics of local flora (maybe fauna, when they cooperate) for yiu guys. Let's keep our expectations low of me tho, hey? lol
California actually planted alot of eucalyptus trees back in the 19th century. They are so common where i'm at that i grew up thinking they were a Northern Cali native plant. I used to scavenge euc groves for hard wood for the stove during lean winters.
Wax24. Merry Xmas mate, hope you’re keeping well. You and I share a familiar trait, I also like to take photos with the mind and brain on most occasions, they endure the journey of time and you can always recall them when required.
Eucalyptus sp. made their way to California post the gold rush days in southern Australia, simply, when your fellow country folk returned home.
Safe travels. AW
GuySmiley wrote:G’day AW, good you’re back and I’m enjoying reading your positive posts. My physical annus horribilis will now continue into the new year, bugger it, still hitting the water just!
Keep the positive vibes coming!
GuySmiley. Merry Xmas fella.
Re; your physical status, good times are a coming, warmer weather, good food, exercise and company will quickly manifest itself into the best version of yourself . All the best mate. AW
I’m using my phone , and big impatient finger ( one finger typer ) .
AW
I love all this plant and animal chit chat !!
I would love to see a BIG US tree ( I hug big trees for some reason) .
U sound like a diplomatic solution type of bloke .
A Builder ( sore hand :( of bridges and good things .
Easy to like :)
A day of peace to all , lots of goodwill and gratitude imho .
HNY and keep me learning:) about stuff !
Pop
Pop Down wrote:AW
I love all this plant and animal chit chat !!
I would love to see a BIG US tree ( I hug big trees for some reason) .U sound like a diplomatic solution type of bloke .
A Builder ( sore hand :( of bridges and good things .
Easy to like :)A day of peace to all , lots of goodwill and gratitude imho .
HNY and keep me learning:) about stuff !
Pop
PopDown, Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year to you and yours.
I was very fortunate to visit California in 2019 and visited Coastal Redwoods ( Sequoia sempervirens), worlds tallest tree, a Gymnosperm.
Also went up into clouds at altitude and visited the Giant Sequoias ( Sequoiadendron giganteum), the world’s largest tree, also a Gymnosperm.
Sheer majesty in front of you.
Albeit not to be confused with the tallest flowering tree in the world an Angiosperm, our very own ,Eucalyptus regnans Mountain Ash.
If ever the opportunity arises to see these three species of trees, do it. AW
AW
Thank u for giving me one reason to go to California .
Are U sure the biggest trees are not in Texas ?
It is incredible to be in the presence of any BIG living thing and trees are very friendly .
Have been reading about details of the Christmas Truce of 1914 .
Incredible :)
One guy, disobeying orders , stuck his head up ( wasn’t shot off ) , stood up and walked into No Mans land and a mortal enemy did the same .
They met in the middle and had a chat .
Like civilised men .
Somehow it happened in numerous places over a 600 mile front .
This mass mingling and chatting ( even exchanged addresses :) of mortal enemies freaked out the Generals lol .
One Englishman wrote that when the Germans went back to their line , they refused to jump back into the trench . Didn’t want to start fighting again .
He said it was a Stalemate as he wasn’t going to just shoot him as he was defenceless .
Has never happened before or since .
Edit During the Truce , both sides worked together to gather and bury their dead that lay in No Mans Land !
Some true dignity .
Not probably appropriate for this thread on reflection but happy to not reflect it on another that should be chopped imo .
Yeah, AW, Pops….... i was fortunate enough to have a small cabin backed up to an old growth grove of redwoods. You could look south from the top of Red Hill on a clear day and see Point Reyes do it’s Quixote Thing at The Pacific. Walked the dogs on their daily in there. A coupla retrievers, girls both. One, black lab rescue, who personified Survivor and a precocious Golden who emulated her big sister and desparately wanted her approval, off leash… they mostly minded, but were CRASHING loud. GEEBUS!!
When i could get them next to me and calm and still… i swear…. you actually hear the silence. And you can feel the sentinels of the ages.
It is a Cathedral like hush. And it is vastly reassuring.
Black bears, mountain lions, badgers, rattlesnakes, those are the bothersome critters. All can be communicated with, to a reasonable point.
But yeah.
I went and saw The Blair Witch Project in…. i guess it was 1999…. and then came home and slept out on an old army cot in that grove.
Daring the demons. (they were mostly inside.)
MAN! The noises that night.
I have had one black bear event, six badgers, countless rattlers, and four mountain lions over time here. All peaceful enough.
I am telling you, the redwoods promote peace. I am rambling. I absolutely adore my ordained spot for this journey. I am truly blessed, fortunate, lucky, pick your semantics… all inclusive here.
I see that Crew feels the same about their Spot. (Oz)
And i see that as being well founded.
Across the world, and it’s same, same.
Well, anyways, i gotta hunt sleep. It’s 1531 (on 12/25) now and i gotta wake up at 2106 (my weirdo alarm time) to be on shift.
Sorry for lotsa words.
G’nite.
Pop Down wrote:AW
Thank u for giving me one reason to go to California .Are U sure the biggest trees are not in Texas ?
It is incredible to be in the presence of any BIG living thing and trees are very friendly .Have been reading about details of the Christmas Truce of 1914 .
Incredible :)
One guy, disobeying orders , stuck his head up ( wasn’t shot off ) , stood up and walked into No Mans land and a mortal enemy did the same .
They met in the middle and had a chat .Like civilised men .
Somehow it happened in numerous places over a 600 mile front .
This mass mingling and chatting ( even exchanged addresses :) of mortal enemies freaked out the Generals lol .
One Englishman wrote that when the Germans went back to their line , they refused to jump back into the trench . Didn’t want to start fighting again .
He said it was a Stalemate as he wasn’t going to just shoot him as he was defenceless .
Has never happened before or since .
Edit During the Truce , both sides worked together to gather and bury their dead that lay in No Mans Land !
Some true dignity .
Not probably appropriate for this thread on reflection but happy to not reflect it on another that should be chopped imo .
PopDown. Hi. Thanks for your reply.
When you say the biggest trees , what are you referring to, what species of tree ?
Biggest, largest, tallest confuses a lot of folk.
I’ll recap. Californian Redwoods are the tallest trees in the world, they are Gymnosperms ( meaning naked seeds), no flowers are present at all, sexual reproduction is totally by wind dispersal.
The world’s largest trees( by volume) are the Giant Redwoods (see the photo below I took in 2019j, this species is also a Gymnosperm.
The tallest flowering tree (Angiosperms) in the world are as I’ve previously mentioned Eucalyptus regnans Mountain Ash.
If you can qualify, clarify or elaborate on your Texas statement, I’d be very grateful.
For your better understanding of the evolution of flora, it’s worth understanding the four main pillars of plant evolution in this order;
Firstly , simple cells akin to bacteria, like Cyanobacteria ( think of the stromatolites of NW WA) earliest organisms liberating oxygen into the atmosphere, which previously had been a reducing atmosphere with NO oxygen at all.
Next in line of evolution were the seedless vascular plants, ferns and their allies, bryophytes, mosses, liverworts etc at this stage still no flowering plants.
Third in line and linked to my earlier discussion are the Gymnosperms, the conifers, cycads, macrozamias etc, again still no flowering plants.
Lastly, and what most people see and understand today are the Angiosperms, the flowering plants.
It’s worth noting that all of these four groups still exist and persist today, for our wonderment.
Angiosperms are believed to have evolved halfway between Assam (in India and Fiji) as we know it, that’s diagonal line with its epicentre in, and it’s no surprise, the Indo-Malay Archipelago to the north of our nation.
I hope that helps, AW
Pops. Here you go.
The General Sherman Tree is the world's largest tree, measured by volume. It stands 275 feet (83 m) tall, and is over 36 feet (11 m) in diameter at the base. Sequoia trunks remain wide high up. Sixty feet above the base, the Sherman Tree is 17.5 feet (5.3 m) in diameter.
AW
Thank u AW .
As waxy ( crazy mountain man it seems ) said , a Stand of Redwood Sententials must be an Unreal experience .
We can experience standing with Giants .
Eucalyptus regnans ( looked it up ) or the Aussie Red Gum (Swamp Gum - but doesn’t grow in them ) for example .
The 2nd tallest tree . Grows five times faster than those slow Californians ,
BUT , we don’t have wild animals attacking while looking UP !!!
Our snakes are well trained !
FMe , I would not stand in any forest of trees with Crocs around ( or sharks ) .
No way !
Rattle snakes really like to bite people .
Nearly everyone in the US has almost been bitten , maybe !
Our drop bears were eaten ages ago .
Edit AW - lol I thought everything was bigger in Texas .
There is Tall , Old , Fat , Smartest , Toughest etc
I will try and digest the technical plant stuff and get bacteria !
Pop Down wrote:Thank u AW .
As waxy ( crazy mountain man it seems ) said , a Stand of Redwood Sententials must be an Unreal experience .We can experience standing with Giants .
Eucalyptus regnans ( looked it up ) or the Aussie Red Gum (Swamp Gum - but doesn’t grow in them ) for example .The 2nd tallest tree . Grows five times faster than those slow Californians ,
BUT , we don’t have wild animals attacking while looking UP !!!
Our snakes are well trained !
FMe , I would not stand in any forest of trees with Crocs around ( or sharks ) .
No way !
Rattle snakes really like to bite people .
Nearly everyone in the US has almost been bitten , maybe !
Our drop bears were eaten ages ago .
Edit AW - lol I thought everything was bigger in Texas .
There is Tall , Old , Fat , Smartest , Toughest etc
I will try and digest the technical plant stuff and get bacteria !
PopDown. Nothing much bothers me in the biological world, most animals and other organisms are way more scared of us than we are of them.
In 2005, camped at altitude in Colorado at Mt Elbert. With my then wife’s girlfriend, their children, our son and the gals hubby.
Women and children slept in the yankee camping mobile, the other guy and I were banished to the dome tent. Two things had me thinking, how cold it became very quickly and the presence of bears.
I asked if there were bears in the area, he said, most likely, asked him about the distance at which a bear could smell food, he said, oh, miles.
I didn’t sleep a wink, especially after he remarked that bears are so use to people that they basically recognise a vehicle as a source of food.
Give me snakes, sharks, spiders, etc. any day. AW
AW
U and waxy would get along and both have a Noble Savage steak imho .
I camped with my ex in Africa .
Hippopotamus grazing outside the tent and lions roaming and roaring in the distance .
It was a really good tent ( hot shower ) , with wooden barriers to remind the hippo where it was .
There was also a local Watchman, with a big Gun !
We both slept beautifully :)
There is a wild Electricity in Croc and shark land .
I went on a number of walks in Africa without gun protection . During the day and did look Up at most trees .
Never did see a Leopard :)
Edit
Animals are like people , most are cool , all species lol .
Every species can have rogues . Rattlesnake has the same cantankerous attitude as Cockatoo I have heard ,
Imagine a poisonous Cocky !!!
Pop Down wrote:AW
U and waxy would get along and both have a Noble Savage steak imho .I camped with my ex in Africa .
Hippopotamus grazing outside the tent and lions roaming and roaring in the distance .It was a really good tent ( hot shower ) , with wooden barriers to remind the hippo where it was .
There was also a local Watchman, with a big Gun !
We both slept beautifully :)
There is a wild Electricity in Croc and shark land .
I went on a number of walks in Africa without gun protection . During the day and did look Up at most trees .
Never did see a Leopard :)
Edit
Animals are like people , most are cool , all species lol .Every species can have rogues . Rattlesnake has the same cantankerous attitude as Cockatoo I have heard ,
Imagine a poisonous Cocky !!!
PopDown
I don’t know about that.
I’d hedge my bets on that one.
Cockatoos are long lived and are one of the most intelligent birds known
They’re not cantankerous, we think they are because of their bodily actions and the way they visually and aurally behave compared to the noises we make., we often anthropomorphise our thoughts of what is ‘noisy and cantankerous’.
In essence, the bird is communicating, but not as we know it Mr. Spock.
They have an incredible vocal range. Simply, their intelligence bubbling to the surface.
The most intelligent birds on the planet are the Corvids, Crows, Ravens, Rooks and Jays.
Followed very closely by the Parrots, Cockatoos, Lorikeets, Galahs etc.
Closely bringing up the rear is the Doves and Pigeons.
If you are interested, I’d recommend reading “ The Genius of Birds” by Jennifer Ackerman.
I’ve had the pleasure of a few Zoom meetings with her and members of our Field Naturalist Club over the last few years.
I’d recommend checking out all her books, they are great reading.
Cockatoos have feelings too, you know. Just a bit of fun.AW
AW
I know Cockys very well and love living close to them still . There is a large flock that base themselves close to my 12floor apartment and often sit on my balcony and do whatever they want .
They are all left handed , which must mean something , as u would know .
My real experience with the native was in Sydney . Lived in an apartment overlooking Mosman Bay and started feeding the local birds .
All are very smart imho .
A Kookaburra got a raw sausage from me and tried to kill it sending sausage shit everywhere .
Laughed at me when I shooed her off .
One cocky came one day ,
Gave the Polly a cracker .
Next day her mate came , so lovely and well behaved .
I soon had the whole flock demanding their cracker ( 40plus ) and was going through a pack a night ( I broke them in half ) .
So I stopped .
Lucky I rented the place as the balcony was wooden . Nothing was safe and they trashed the place haha .
I love them popping around but they snip a few succulents to let me know they visited .
Probably my favourite bird !
As I said , if poisonous ( and they knew it ) a nightmare imo .
Edit
A Cassuarry ? Charging scared the shit out of my brother and his mate .
For half an hour around their car .
Pop Down wrote:AW
I know Cockys very well and love living close to them still . There is a large flock that base themselves close to my 12floor apartment and often sit on my balcony and do whatever they want .They are all left handed , which must mean something , as u would know .
My real experience with the native was in Sydney . Lived in an apartment overlooking Mosman Bay and started feeding the local birds .
All are very smart imho .
A Kookaburra got a raw sausage from me and tried to kill it sending sausage shit everywhere .Laughed at me when I shooed her off .
One cocky came one day ,
Gave the Polly a cracker .
Next day her mate came , so lovely and well behaved .
I soon had the whole flock demanding their cracker ( 40plus ) and was going through a pack a night ( I broke them in half ) .So I stopped .
Lucky I rented the place as the balcony was wooden . Nothing was safe and they trashed the place haha .
I love them popping around but they snip a few succulents to let me know they visited .
Probably my favourite bird !
As I said , if poisonous ( and they knew it ) a nightmare imo .
PopDown.
I’m loving you even more now.
Great observations, great real life stories about cockatoos, as we know, the underlying motivations for the presence of most organisms is FOOD, in this case they’ll take your Western Red Cedar windows ( Thuja plicata a native coniferous softwood of the Pacific Northwest arboreal forests ) out before you know it or any other soft and chewable wood .
Yes, they do hold food in their left foot when eating, genetically predisposed.
Of interest at the recent Australian Ornithological Conference in Brisbane a few weeks ago a paper was presented by a fellow Professor Rob Heinsohn who for decades has been a long time studying Palm Cockatoos in Cape York.
It’s well known they use a piece of wood as a drumstick and tap away acoustically in some type of ritual for mating and attracting the opposite sex.
Further research highlighted the fact that each drumstick is individually and acoustically tailored to produce a unique sound to attract a particular female and to set it apart from others. Females watch from a distance , firstly admiring the skill and strength of the male at making the drumstick and then to be able to listen and discern the sound she likes.
The biological world is truly amazing, birds are very intelligent indeed. AW
Great post AW. @Pop, ah the bird feeders.. go easy, just creating a pack of expectant alpha species there, they will kill lesser birds and competitor clans in the area to protect their meal-ticket, and become entitled like the ubud monkey forest locals. Don't bring an offering, they'll attack you.
'Wisdom of Birds' would have to rank in the 'if you only read 10 books about animals' list. Good stuff : ) Anyone aware of a similarly in-depth book about octos/squid/cephalopods? I'd be into that..
Hey AW, you mentioned a batch of birds for intelligence and somehow the humble magpie and the currawong didn’t get a mention.
How is that right! If they aren’t up with the smartest birds going I’ll be a monkey’s uncle. I’d put them up against many of the humans I’ve met.
Kookaburras are pretty sly devils too. They are kings (fishers) and they know it. Blithe spirits.
haha, ^^ I meant 'Genius of Birds', but turns out there is a 'Wisdom' book too! (I'm just a dumb chimp ; )
batfink wrote:Hey AW, you mentioned a batch of birds for intelligence and somehow the humble magpie and the currawong didn’t get a mention.
How is that right! If they aren’t up with the smartest birds going I’ll be a monkey’s uncle. I’d put them up against many of the humans I’ve met.
Kookaburras are pretty sly devils too. They are kings (fishers) and they know it. Blithe spirits.
Batfink. Hi mate.
Not to dismiss the intelligence of the birds you’ve mentioned at all.
You’ve only gotta look at the intelligence of Australian Magpies in all their forms of life, mimicry, bonding with humans in many instances, guardians of territories etc.
We/ you and I could list many examples of intelligence, so do we say Cuckoos, Koels etc are intelligent because they smartingly drop their eggs into another host birds nest then fuck off , I’d say yes, Currawongs, eternal nest raiders, eating chicks some other bird has raised, that’s intelligent, Kookaburras catching reptiles, them smashing the shit out of the prey on the nearest hard object, mound birds like Mallee fowl, Brush Turkeys, Orange footed Megapodes with their collective abilities to regulate temperature scales in their mounds.
Lyrebirds and their mimicry is almost unsurpassed by any other bird known.
All examples of intelligence in my books.
We could probably go through all of Australia’s 855 species and find intelligent examples of life and survival.
I know and think all birds are smart, smarter than us.
I mentioned the three groups that sit further up the tree than the ones you highlighted.
Not an exercise and at all in misrepresenting the intelligence of birds.
Like you, most humans I meet are downright fucking monkeys, just look at the way we’ve fucked and are fucking up our environment and biosystems.
Good stuff and thanks for raising some great examples.AW
Batfink. Edit
And, we haven’t even touched on migration , Short- Tailed Shearwaters ( Muttonbirds) , 12,000 kms round trip migration and land back within 1-10m of where they originally departed, similarly with Albatross.
Bird’s abilities on long haul migration to put half their brain to sleep and keep functioning with the other half.
And we reckon we are smart, meh. AW
basesix wrote:Great post AW. @Pop, ah the bird feeders.. go easy, just creating a pack of expectant alpha species there, they will kill lesser birds and competitor clans in the area to protect their meal-ticket, and become entitled like the ubud monkey forest locals. Don't bring an offering, they'll attack you.
'Wisdom of Birds' would have to rank in the 'if you only read 10 books about animals' list. Good stuff : ) Anyone aware of a similarly in-depth book about octos/squid/cephalopods? I'd be into that..
Basesix, PopDown. Hi.
I’ve never fed a bird in a natural location. We know it’s not the right thing to do as mentioned by B6. Each to their own, I’m no zealot.
But it’s more than the alpha aggression that can develop, it’s also about the spread of unwanted plant and animal species into natural systems.
I’ve been heavily criticised on here before by confessional bird feeders, each to their own as I said. But if you really love and admire birds you wouldn’t feed them.
So, herein lies the question , are you feeding the bird to make it happy and survive or are you feeding the bird to make you happy, I think I know the answer.
I did feed birds when I had caged ones as a junior burger, but that was an early stage of learning and observing, something I’ll never regret, I’d sit for hours watching King Quail and a gamut of finch species . That’s where it all started, I was intoxicated by the sheer intrinsic beauty of the colours and patterns of feathers and the behaviour of each individual species.
Historically and anthropologically one could argue that humans have had a long enduring relationship with animals, I agree somewhat, but on whose terms and benefits. AW
Hey Pops.
Hope your Xmas was joyful.
No crazy mountain man here, lol.
Lotsa folks around here have the same cache of stories i can produce. It’s just a wild place. What makes it so fascinating to me is it’s reach into places like San Francisco, which is a much more outdoorsy wild spot (for it’s big city brand) than most realize. The yin and yang of millions of folks right next door to this wilderness.
I was just waxing rhapsodic.
I love my digs.
One thing… about rattlesnakes… they are actually shy creatures and not aggressive, mostly. Hence, the intimidating rattles. They want you to choose the peaceful retreat so they can do the same.
HNY to u Waxy :)
U sound very cool to me .
A am guessing u guys have a different definition of a Death Rattle than I do .
Our birds here are a bit different !!!
Just look at an Emu !
We like our birds clean and often provide Bird Baths .
They are very hard to not feed !!!
My mother has a Magpie visit most days .
It looks through her window calling ( the most beautiful song ) out ,hello Greta , I am here !
Extremely persistent !!!
She thinks it loves Dutch Gouda the most .
Our birds push us around a bit .
They especially have fun when I play golf .
Often checking out my ball ( taking it sometimes ) and if I have anything in the cart or golf bag for them .
A two stoke penalty still for a Stolen Ball ( especially if a Croc gets it apparently ) .
Better than being pushed around by a little Kiwi imho .
Edit
I am thinking a lot of the San Francisco people would last about 29 minutes in the Wild in the US .
Not many willing to spend a night sleeping with your little creatures . Not to mention no warm showers !!!
I apply a two shower test .
If u are willing to have 2 cold showers in a row , u are a Noble Savage or a real Greenie imho !!
I only recently discovered that cockys can talk , Australian !!!
Saw a guy in the US with a pet cocky . Loved him .
The cocky could surf , really .
The guy had a safety harness on the bird and the bird would hang out the car window , holding on , wind flying through is feathers bloody surfing ! Very cool .
The guy had taught it to talk and would take it out to pick up OTHER birds .
The Best Wing Man ( Bird ) if have ever seen .
I am looking for a pet !
I don’t wonder too much about which animal gets what out of who , too much .
Maybe , I should .
If thinking good thoughts , nothing too bad seems to happen in my little life , with our lovely earth friends .
Lots of animals live on me , without my permission .
I like to feed anything healthy food . But have 2 daughters and don’t want anything else to depend on me ( so not a feeder :) .
I saw a firefighter give a few native animals a hand when they needed him .
Gave a Koala a drink of water from his drink bottle . Noah type stuff , perhaps :)
Pop Down wrote:I only recently discovered that cockys can talk , Australian !!!
Saw a guy in the US with a pet cocky . Loved him .
The cocky could surf , really .The guy had a safety harness on the bird and the bird would hang out the car window , holding on , wind flying through is feathers bloody surfing ! Very cool .
The guy had taught it to talk and would take it out to pick up OTHER birds .
The Best Wing Man ( Bird ) if have ever seen .
I am looking for a pet !
I don’t wonder too much about which animal gets what out of who , too much .
Maybe , I should .If thinking good thoughts , nothing too bad seems to happen in my little life , with our lovely earth friends .
Lots of animals live on me , without my permission .
I like to feed anything healthy food . But have 2 daughters and don’t want anything else to depend on me ( so not a feeder :) .
I saw a firefighter give a few native animals a hand when they needed him .
Gave a Koala a drink of water from his drink bottle . Noah type stuff , perhaps :)
PopDown. Merry Xmas and HNY.
You come across as a caring person, yes we can and have all cared for certain animals in our lives, it’s in our inherent nature to do so.
On Kangaroo Island a few years ago in extreme heat a Koala had walked onto a bitumen road and burnt all four pads, I assisted it to the roadside and cooled its feet with water, all the time it was attacking me and defending itself, natural behaviour.
Animals don’t need us, I wish people could understand that. They didn’t evolve on earth to serve us.
Feeding animals is NOT good as I’ve previously mentioned, if they become use to regular feeds they leave themselves vulnerable for times when things are tough environmentally, like extreme droughts, heat, etc. when food natural to them may be scarce.
It’s, about survival of the fittest ( genetically), and the enhancement of the gene pool along the way.
Now, Who wants a cracker, aagh ?. Always good to chat with you.AW
AW
I think everything and everyone are connected !
Everything has the same stuff and energy flowing through and around it .
Everything does depend on everything else , even if just a tiny bit .
Have seen Elephants running to greet old human friends ( apparently they view us as pets ! ) that helped them years ago .
That Koala must have felt bad after u helped it , but u did probably scare the shit out of it .
Australian natives have loved evolving with us in Melbourne . Possum City . Fruit Bat Heaven etc
For all living things there is a fundamental gift , Freedom !
Not Equality !
I am going to walk around and let some native birds look for my golf balls in the T tree .
A lovely chat about important stuff imho :)
Edit
No man is an Island :)
Pop Down wrote:AW
I think everything and everyone are connected !Everything has the same stuff and energy flowing through and around it .
Everything does depend on everything else , even if just a tiny bit .
Have seen Elephants running to greet old human friends ( apparently they view us as pets ! ) that helped them years ago .
That Koala must have felt bad after u helped it , but u did probably scare the shit out of it .
Australian natives have loved evolving with us in Melbourne . Possum City . Fruit Bat Heaven etc
For all living things there is a fundamental gift , Freedom !
Not Equality !
I am going to walk around and let some native birds look for my golf balls in the T tree .
A lovely chat about important stuff imho :)
Edit
No man is an Island :)
PopDown. Hi mate. Nicely expressed.
I hope some Little or Australian Ravens assist with finding your golf balls.
Observations. When myself and others periodically assist in wader surveys on Swan Bay west shore and nearby Edward’s Point, we often find a lot of golf balls.
How do they come to be there ?
One hypothesis is that due to the proximity of Swan Island Golf Course adjacent Queenscliffe, Ravens ( we have seen them carrying golf balls in their gobs) fly over Swan Bay and drop them to hopefully smash them thinking they are eggs.
I’m not quite on board with that theory yet but others are adamant that’s what they are doing. Ravens are smart, I reckon they’d know if the vessel in their mouths had a fluid centre by the movement and transfer of energy contained within.
Ravens being very curious and the most intelligent bird on the planet, who knows what’s going through the synapse junctions in their brains.
Four !!!!. AW
Seems a keen interest for some, so why not.