Will The Pros Take Off Out The Back At Sunset?
"I can hardly believe it," said Sunset Beach local and former World Cup winner Makua Rothman during the 2022 Hurley Pro webcast, "they're surfing like the last quarter of the wave."
Since Sunset Beach returned to the CT schedule two years ago, exasperated punters keep making the same observation as Makua and questioning the logic used. To wit, why aren’t the surfers taking off out the back?
A solid day at the Hurley Pro 2022 and Griffin Colapinto, riding a 6'1", prepares to take five waves on the head as Sunset's outside section goes untouched
As the webcast footage shows two surfers bobbing in the lineup, the vision beyond is of peaks unloading further out. Whereupon everyone from two-time Sunset winner Kong Elkerton to Joe Never-Surfed-It hits the keyboards and wonders why they’re not out there.
The question is simple and resolute, and yet it’s never been answered. So brace yourselves as I attempt to give it a go.
First of all I had to find out how the WSL judges view Sunset Beach. You see, the tour schedule is like a restaurant’s menu, each stop a different dish with unique flavours for high performance surfing. Pipe has the shallow reef and hefty barrel, Trestles the feathery lip and coping, Bells has the…what does Bells have? The history..?
Anyway, you get the drift. What Sunset has is a challenging and outsized lineup, large and fast-moving walls, and a wild - and wildly unpredictable - inside section. It would seem to make sense that surfers who make use of each facet will do the best.
Rather than speculate, however, we got the WSL’s judging criteria for Sunset Beach. It’s comprehensive, yet here are the parts that matter:
Event Criteria:
All elements of the WSL judging criteria will be in play. Scoring will be based on the following components:
- Commitment and degree of difficulty to take off and perform combinations of major maneuvers on the critical sections of the bigger and heavier waves.
- Technical and deep barrel rides.
- The ability to utilize the wave’s speed and power with good flow when transitioning sections and linking major maneuvers and combos.
- Ability to show a progressive and innovative approach by drawing different lines and angles on critical sections and performing maneuvers that push the limits of what is expected at a wave like Sunset.
- Ability to attack the lip line of the critical sections
- Variety of major maneuvers.
- Massive single major maneuvers when performed on critical sections can be well rewarded.
Additional judging notes:
Surfers must show full control and forward momentum when coming out of their maneuvers or barrel rides to be considered completed and will be scored accordingly.
Different key judging elements can take a bigger importance on the scoring according to the conditions on offer for the day and with conditions changing during the day.
Rightio, so there’s nothing in there that overtly mentions the outside takeoff, but there is a lot to digest. Let’s chew through it slowly.
Anyone who’s surfed Sunset at size, particularly north swell Sunset, knows the takeoff shifts around a lot. The West Peak is steep and defined, while the ones that hit from the north roam around. Whole surf breaks: takeoff, barrel section, long wall, reform, and shorebreak, could fit within Sunset’s northern takeoff area.
This point has to be emphasised as the barrage of swell bearing down on Sunset is almost all northerly. Towards the end of the waiting period there’s some northwest, but Saturday, Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday are all majority north swell days, and that means a shifting takeoff spot.
The first dot point indicates the judges are paying attention to where a surfer takes off, so let’s assume the surfers in the first heat begin the day by following Kong’s advice and stroking to the outside takeoff. What happens next will set the tone for what the rest of the surfers do.
If a surfer gets a set from outside - showing ‘commitment to takeoff’ - and the wave allows for the other dot points to be checked off, then it’s a safe assumption the judges will reward it. Pro surfers, being the herd animals that they are, will follow suit.
The kicker, however, is if the conditions don’t allow for surfers to find three or four good outside waves during a forty-minute heat. Anyone who’s surfed Sunset at size knows you don’t paddle out with plans immediately after the session. Could be one hour, could be four. You could get four good waves in that time, or you could get none.
Big Sunset isn’t easily packaged into a heat. Part of its appeal is ‘the challenge’, a hazy sort of concept that pays no heed to time.
But time is what pro surfers must watch (Derek Ho: “We never lose, sometimes we just run out of time.”), so if the surfers in the early heats aren’t getting waves in the alotted time, it won’t be lost on the others watching. Better to sit inside, cop a markdown from the booth, but at least rack up two keepers.
Compromise. You get it? Take a hit but lock in the lesser scores.
"Yes but did he take off out the back?" Ethan Ewing showing the benefits of playing the inside game on a shorter blade - Sunset, 2023 (WSL/Heff)
The unknown unknown - or whatever that quote was - is just how much the judges will favour the outside play, and just how much they’ll penalise those who stay inside. It’s worth reading the last passage again:
“Different key judging elements can take a bigger importance on the scoring according to the conditions on offer for the day and with conditions changing during the day.”
Effectively, what this means is that we won’t know how much the judges will favour outside takeoffs till the day arrives.
The very last consideration is the surfers themself. Every surfer will have a different idea of what they’ll risk based on their experience out there. John John, you'd think, would back himself to connect one from the summit, but the crew with less time out at big Sunset might opt for less risk to get through a heat.
Similarly each surfer will have an idea of how much they're willing to compromise in board size. The outside takeoff requires a longer board, yet shorter boards are easier to throw around on the inside walls.
Is a surfer confident of navigating the outside on a shorter board? Maybe they think they can throw a gun around like a groveller? Where do they sit on that sliding scale.
Arriving at the end of the article finds that we really haven't answered much at all. But if you think the question is difficult, spare a thought for the indecisive pro as the forecast cycles through shades of red and the judges' outside status remains unknown.
//STU NETTLE
Comments
“Bells has the…what does Bells have? The history..?”
Brutal. Lol.
I had a good chuckle at that (even as a staunch Bells fan). Savage.
Yep that line was GOLD
I laughed however if you have surfed it at size on a lower tide it is a hell of a lot more challenging than scummy trestles. A bit disingenuous I felt as Bells can be a hoot on the right tide and swell.
Yep. I reckon its a great wave to surf and also deserves a tour stop.
And has also seen some absolute classic events… eg 1981 for the big day, fast forward to 2006 for the most perfect size and slaters’s winning turn, and I think 2010 for pure ruler edged perfection. It’s seen some good years.
Yea....whats with THAT diss of Bells? Sheesh.... Not sure where that came from??
I hope Pickles gets one from the far North Peak on a 7'6".
...and goes left. Great stuff Stu.
That was bloody classic Sprout, Laughed my head off...
so did i
I look forward to watching her attack, on whatever she chooses. Same with Caity Simmers.
Be interesting to see. In lots of clips I've seen seen of the surfers warming up there over the past few weeks, equipment has looked longer. Whether that's just a bi product of helping them to get waves in a free surf lineup, or maybe some hinting from the judges remains to be seen.
Biggest in Pickles DHD Quiver is a 6'6"
Get in the Shaping Bay Darren...
5'5 @ 62 Kgs = a 7'0 ?
I dunno about that one, big boards and big waves doesn't seem like the direction the woz ship is heading
Called it.
Consider the lack of boards in bags / quivers
Over 6' 6 ". I am left to decide they will be milling around the shoulder again......Prove me wrong .
Great stuff Stu.
Sounds like the Woz actually want surfers to tackle the bigger peaks.
Simple solution. Plonk your WSL buoy out there, and implement an offside rule for anyone who sits inside of it. Instant loss of priority.
Problem solvered.
What Bell’s has is Winkipop…..they just choose Bells for the history and the hideous VIP and Contestant and Hanger-on areas they build over looking Bells
On another note who's your pick?
Who's your dark horse?
Add a component in the judging criteria too for big turns on bigger boards in critical sections on bigger waves will score higher perhaps. Nothing like seeing a 7'6 getting hooked like a 6'0 on an 8-10ft wall. I respect the shit out of any surfer who can steer a larger board around properly in the right conditions.
Ethan Ewing
Ramzi .
EE, Caiio, JJF, jack Robbo
Crosby Cola. ;-)
fact of the matter is smaller boards allow for more progressive surfing, and surfing further in allows for more waves to be caught in typically unpredictable conditions. Such is comp surfing within 30-40 minutes at a hugely open ocean wave.
Are they allowed board caddies? If yes head out the back on a 70 get a set and impersonate kong then swap to 64 and sit on the inside and impersonate Filipe
Given the time constraints, if it’s big and they are out the back, let them do jet ski step offs. Purists would complain but the entertainment quotient would get a big bump.
Bells has winki,
You'll never go back to bells unless it 8 feet
Or stupid crowded
If it's that big you can go to the palace....
6 plus at a lower tide and clean can be really good.
Caio.
Good read Stu!
I'm looking forward to watching John John, Jordy, and Medina. And also Italo because he's a little bit mad.
I’ve often thought the same thing about bells.ie what Stu said, and about the pros sitting closer in.
Sit at Rincon and get a few turns in before it hits the bowl. . Watched plenty of heats on YouTube and seen 50 meters of extra wave crying to be carved up.
Jack for the event win. Ethan Ewing to take the title. Ewing blokes going to need to work on his P.R game, so laid back he's lying down. Perhaps a bit harsh could be more of a horizontal lean he's got going on. A little too synonymous with the WSL being on permanent life support. Eth bra, just got to take it up a gear without seeming like a fraud. Piece of piss. What a nightmare all that must be.
Anyway I reckon an option to get really creative here with the event. What if they make the heats longer and the first part competitors are committed to the outside, say first 20 minutes. After 20 minutes competitors can opt for a shorter board and migrate in. Caveat being that the caddy has to get the new board to the surfer on the inside regardless of conditions and with a time limit. If competitors caddy gets washed away tough titties. Your on your big board and unable to change again till the 32 minute mark when disgraced caddy gets another shot.
Board caddies to get paid accordingly and sign waivers understand the nature of wave risk of drowning etc.
Id like to throw my hat in the ring as a caddy. $160 per heat.
That would be very cool to watch. We'd find best paddler and ocean reader in the caddies.
Good bit of thinking and writing, Stu.
North Peak on a 7'6 may be wishful thinking, but even if they all sit inside, I reckon they look awful on a 6'0 or 6'2. But that's just my tastes.
JJ, Gabe, Ramzi, Robbo, Caio.
Caio, JJF, Jacky Boy Robinson, Callum.
Brisa, Gabriela, Sally, Bettylou.
No Barron?
No EE?
I haven’t read the previous comments so my bad but with this current priority system if you absolutely schralp the outside and Gabriel drops in on you then what’s the point ….
It’s like the Parko Slater at Kirra years ago …
Wish they’d come up with a better version….
It’s still a snake fest when the opportunity arises..,
Worse if over lapping heats (which i love) because the non priority crew almost have to sit inside.
JayJayF or Barron
Molly or Bettylou
Molly looks awesome at Sunset too- those big carves.
How about each pro, 1st round, has to compete from the Sunset peak, each using the same board, per 1hr heat.
A level playing field. No comp eliminations away.... highest overall score gets to keep the board ... (and an eski).
eg. There are 3x 8' "Padillac" guns available in Hawaii waiting ATM....
https://www.pyzelsurfboards.com/?page=shopsurfboard&model=187
https://www.windy.com/?21.693,-158.037,14,m:ehjaLK
what a wonderfully weird wave, rarely anywhere near perfect. suits Caio's committed lunacy 100%.
purely hypothetical conjecture
What's Bells got you ask?
I'll tell you what it's got.
Personality!
Bells has big swell & storms from Antarctica
https://www.windy.com/?2024021821,-53.878,114.961,4,m:ci6aiYz
Kong Elko
10 foot plus Sunset Beach and everyone is on 6,6s sitting on the inside while 10 foot bombs are going off out the back,
Oh, fuck…fuck… where do I start… I just… they’re sitting on six-sixes on the inside and not paddling out the back and getting the bombs. I think Wilko might’ve read my post because he had a go on a seven-six and he showed exactly what could be done. He looked absolutely solid. I was pulling my hair out. I was frustrated, watching these twelve-to-fifteen-foot bombs out the back and guys are taking off in the whitewater and trying to get to their feet.”
The judges need to score a wave higher if it’s caught out the back. I watched a young Hawaiian paddle way, way outside, caught a wave off the button, a goofyfooter, did three turns on the inside and got a seven. I don’t know if any of the judges have ever been out at Sunset. It’s so much more difficult negotiating that west and north swell peak out the back when it connects together. It should be merited higher. And that would change the way it’s being surfed.”
Kong puts a lot of store on Sunset. It ain’t always the most photogenic wave, although it can be, but it challenges a surfer like no other wave, he says.
“I’m still blown away that it’s only a qualifying event. Kelly’s never won there and how many times has he tried? It’s the most demanding wave on the planet, bar none.”
The way the reef contour is and the manner in which the west swell connects with the north swell and it makes this surging peak. There’s so much water, a football field of water meeting together. And to get into the correct spot, to get into what the lifeguard Darrick Doerner calls The Saddle, you’ve got to have your lineups completely covered. It’s not like Pipe where you take off behind the boil to get barrelled. Equipment is everything there. And to negotiate all that, there’s no other wave on the planet like it.”
And how should the wave be ridden according to Kong?
“At that size, I’d ride an eight-o. I’d get in the saddle, negotiate the big drop, big bottom turn, fade and load up on the inside… where they’re taking off on the six-sixes.”
Great comment!
What’s his pedigree?
?si=I-Xl85TXZLLiu-mflong live the Kong!
Bells has got Gary G, watching over those changing in the carpark like a sentinel.
Too True udo.
Pretty sure I recall someone, possibly Kelly?, paddling out the back in 2022, not getting a wave and then paddling back inside.
Can’t believe no one above has thought of Jordy to take out a big stick and swing it around.
Sorry, belly gave a shout out to him.
I remember Jordy took out a big Dahlberg of Jack Perry's at Bells when his quiver got sent to WA early?
Struggled on it I think. Little bit too big and chunky for CT turns that day.
Jjf or Griff Cola for men’s
Pickle for da women’s
Jack or Caio
3 Dark horsemen of the apocalypse are Conor O, Liam O, and Swellnet’s Own Callum O Robson. Go son!
Steph, Carissa or Rochelle Ballard for the women
I gotta mention Griff because not enough have. Consistently a North Shore standout
Come on LOB
Put forward your power, style and slick barrel sense and bring it home.
Bells /Sunset
I didn't know Cheyne was making boards- that looks nice.
Been Shaping them Himself a while now.. i think Darren Rogers was doing them at some Stage ?
Carissa is done otherwise my pick for the ladies also. Gone Marks, Tyler, or Molly instead with the blonde Brazilian as the dark horse.
Ethan for the mens and Callum Robbo as the dark horse.
Molly for the girls or Tati WW as the dark filly.
If its big is Kai Lenny a chance?
Houshmand will be lit up for this comp.
Make or break for the rookie.
Seth Moniz steps out of shadows,takes the cake here!!
Kelly…. Cause he has such an affinity with this wave
…… oh, sorry, didn’t realise we were talking sunset
I’ll go that new kid from Japan
Quick Q: when you take off on a wave out the back at Sunset, can you tell if it's gonna connect / line up nicely through the inside?
Depends who's doing the looking.
That photo is amazing.
The things a drone or land angle can't see.
Far out it’s heaving like backdoor but with more ocean behind it. Great shot!
Get driven down by that and you'd be meeting those fish with the lights on their heads
Udo - you're the online search king - you'd be able to find the photo of Matt Mondragon by Aaron Chang at Sunset - up there with one of the best surf photos of all time
That's the one - thanks Udo!!
Had that on my wall for years as a grom as inspiration to one day get a barrel at Sunset like that.
Never happened...only ever got my arse handed to me out there...hahaha
It’s up there with Don King’s photo of The Little General at Pipe. In the Canon of Epic
Such a great shot - thanks LD
.... but that'd be the reason for heading out the back or not I'd imagine. Like if you're in a heat you're not gonna gamble on committing to a 'maybe it'll pan out or maybe not' wave. I thought that was why they'd surf the inside – a better idea of the wave's scoring potential etc. I hope they go for glory this time!
I’m going italo v jordy….molly v lakey final
Barton Lynch lives and mainly surfs at Sunset Beach. He said on his latest Stoked Bloke podcast that no one spends more time at or knows Sunset Beach better than Jack Robinson, though he thought the best performer this winter at Sunset has been Seth Moniz.
He's been doing it for a while:
He looked better out there as a kid than a lot of pros do today.
LOL,
So much natural ability in big waves not phasing him at all. Who is the blond haired kid on the podium? I recognise the Italian with the big grin.
Thats interesting Wally.
Jack has definitely got that reef wired.
Seth has never really looked comfortable in heats out there - maybe it's his time to shine.
Jack back on the Arakawa’s for sunset is a good move too.
Heads up for those who don't know:
Monday looks like a good competition day, possibly the first real clean day of the waiting period, however there can't be any competition due to it being a public holiday in the US - Presidents Day.
Reckon the president would even realise its Presidents day in his state?
Why should that matter ? ( obviously true ) but we hold competitions over Easter ? Are presidents more important than religious holidays ?
Monday our time, or Tues our time?
Local time. Third monday in February.
Jack or EE for the mens, Molly for the women's.
Lots of unknown unknowns
I find Seth looks a bit too small at Sunset. If he's up against a bigger body really throwing water it's really noticeable.
Absolutely- his turns can't match the bigger bodies.
And he tends to skip out on bottom turns.
Bells is a bit like Sunset. If you arrive at the open face with momentum it's a blank canvas to plant a full body rail turn and we all know how good that feels.
Bashing the lip? Time it sweetly because their lips bash back.
If it's a battle of the rooster tails I'm going with Ethan to unleash his inner Kong but an opportunistic tube hound like Caio is best placed to score a 10.
Also hoping Pickles gets one back on Caity in the final. Those two !!
Thanks BBB for the excellent warm up vid but you can see, as epic as the takeoff looks, there's no real points 'out the back'
beautiful long rail on that one, broad base on the fin - means business! Curren is right.
Put Owl Chapman in the judging tower.
Reward a big bottom turn of the peak.
Scratchy footage of MP out there.BK.
Kongs hand jive.
Hook in ff sake.
If it’s big Jacks the man.
Heres the problem "- Massive single major maneuvers when performed on critical sections can be well rewarded."
What I really enjoy about the Sunset comp is that the surfers become athletes rather than surfers. The ability to paddle long distances(stamina) and wear a couple on the head if they choose to ride inside and then pick out gems in the rough under physical pressure and then ride and complete in challenging conditions adds another element to the WSL that I don’t see at any other venue. Obviously experience is a big factor at Sunset and big faces demand BIIIG!! long carves so for me JJF deserves to be the favourite.
Agree T-Rex - and it's a strength/endurance/reading the ocean athleticism.
I'm not smart enough to do this.
And I'm also not smart enough to know that I shouldn't do this.
So.
Triple overlapping heats. One hour and thirty minutes per. Third priority, second priority, first priority, in thirty-minute blocks of time. But only when it's properly sizable at Sunset Beach. Nowhere else. Nowhen else. They already make decisions about if it's too big or too little to even run a damned contest in the first place, so how much harder might it be for them to decide, or not decide, to shift gears when Sunset gets properly rolling? This is doable. Make no mistake about it.
And don't go giving me any crap about six people surfing simultaneously is too many. It's BIG Sunset. The kind of Sunset that draws viewers. Those who have traversed its vast scale on the Outside know full well that six people out there is laughably unpopulated. A great and desolate desert of salt water.
That gives each competitor an hour and a half in the water, and with an hour and a half, the odds of snagging a couple of bombs on the Outside become reasonable enough, on a large day at Sunset.
My guess would be that in the beginning, people would think they've got time, and would move all the way out there, and as time ran down, and priority ran up, the tendency, presuming they had not already snagged a big one on the Outside for Real Points, would be to move more and more into the kiddie pool area they all seem to favor now as time grows shorter and shorter, trying to up their chances of at least catching a damn wave in the first place, with the further hope that it might be a good one (Some of the funnels on the Inside Section on large days are... yeah, they're plenty good enough, ok? And it ain't the kiddie pool at all in there when the place is properly rolling. It'll GET you in there, if you don't watch out.) that will reward them with a good score.
All well and good.
But what happens if somebody comes steaming in from the Outer Realm, working to make it to the inside section through the soft spot that's there in the middle (most times, anyway, well... a lot of times anyway... well anyway), and another competitor drops in BEHIND them, the way John Florence did it to Kelly Slater in 2022. And oh by the way, Kelly did the SAME THING to somebody way back in the Pleistocene in California somewhere... so... what goes around...
Anyway, if another competitor drops in behind somebody coming in from all the way outside, then it's NO INTERFERENCE, unless the person coming in from outside clearly and deliberately continues on with the ride, properly and demonstrably interfering with the person holding a higher priority who dropped in behind them. And if no clear and deliberate interference can be justifiably called, then let it go, it's all good, and both rides score as per normal. And if people need guidance, well then, we've got a plain-vanilla priority judge, to make plain-vanilla judgment calls for priority, so why not a priority interference judge, to make calls for priority interference? It's all very subjective anyway, and there will never be a single answer that will make everybody happy, no matter what happens, so... we're already doing this anyway and why not keep right on doing it, with a special priority interference judge for Large Sunset Beach?
Yes, Slater, or Medina, or somebody is going to do their damnedest to try and figure out how to game the system, but... let the priority interference judge speak, and all shall heed those spoken words, so be it, amen.
Triple overlapping heats
This is doable. Make no mistake about it.
yes!
Brilliant ...
Beautiful, but I suspect the powers that be would find it too esoteric a’la test cricket.
Funnily enough, I read the criteria and thought the judges were looking for the exact opposite.
"Commitment and degree of difficulty to take off ... on the critical sections" - the 'critical sections' part being the key. To me that calls for them to be sitting under the ledge and knifing it on the inside bowl, rather than getting a chip shot out the back like the old guys on 8'0"s can easily do.
Hmm, good point. But is there such a thing as a chipshot when it's 12-15foot plus at Sunset?
Munga Barry, chip shot out the back at Sunset Beach
I remember that pic!
Had this poster front and centre on my wall as a grom.
One of the all time great pics and drops.
Great stuff Maclaren. You have another yes, from me.
Btw, lots of talk about Slater being no good at Sunset.
Not so sure about that. He's definitely good out there (or was).
Still don't see too many surfers surfing big critical sections like this.
He's never competed well out there but he sure can surf the place.
Not Sunset but anyway
?si=dyyffxkPCeSpmYf6~ 6'6" for Sunset ~
?si=2mXCWXv33BeHcEvP.
I don't understand the Bells bashing but happy for you all not to surf it or its neighbours.
Contest wise, it’s good when it’s good and shit when it’s shit.
Now that they don’t go to Johanna anymore, or even 13th, it’s hard to get through a waiting period of men and women without sending them out in complete dross at times.
I love Bells @hoodie!!
And don't worry, come April we'll all be gushing about how special the place is.
I like Bells too. Never been there but on vid it really seems to be a wave that showcases a pro surfers full repertoire, especially at size.
Love it plus the nostalgia.
What Lostdoggy said.
Last years was so, so woeful.
Definitely not CT material.
Is anyone going to come out and say it?
That Sunset footage of Kong has not aged well.
You are right Bells has nothing, and those saying winki is good are wrong. Waves in Vicco suck F off. Peace Mahalo
Geez what a grump.
No doubt this pic's been shared on this thread before....i probably shared it.
But this is the quintissential Sunset wave for me.
Munga Barry, going for broke.
This is my laptop screensaver and never gets old.
Still one of my all time favourite pics....especially knowing that he made it.
https://www.theinertia.com/wp-content/gallery/art-brewer-puerto-rico/401...