Corona Open J-Bay: Day Three
One of the main occupational hazards of this gig is coming up with a hot take under conditions of mental fatigue, sleep deprivation from antipodal time zones, emotional reactivity etc etc.
Chances are you'll get it wrong. At any given time though, I'd rather make the call than shrink away or reproduce the accepted wisdom/company line, and then trust the readership below the line to call BS as a method of self-correction. The philosophy my Grand-pappy taught me, 'don't dish it out unless you can take it', leads to a few bruises but good sleeps at night.
Final's Day lineup (AVG/WSL)
Yes, I was one of the main heralds shouting from the rooftops that Aussie surfing was at the bottom of the outhouse, getting covered in excrement from the ascendant Brazilian Storm. The evidence was compelling. In the Aussie Quaddy last year there were no Aussies in the Semis at Margies or Narrabeen, one at Newy, and two at Rottnest, neither of which are currently on the CT.
The last event I witnessed live, before the COVID shutdown was the Quikky Pro, held at D-Bah. On Finals Day, there were no Australian Semi-Finalists, the beach was chokkas with flag-waving Brazilians and the takeover had seemed complete as Italo was chaired up the beach after spinning his way to victory.
No, I didn't dig it either, but you couldn't deny it was happening.
Boy, how the worm has turned. After a spectacular Finals Day at challenging 6-8 foot J-Bay we now clearly have the best rail surfer on Earth in Ethan Ewing. He may have changed the judging criteria, especially after a wave in the Final against Jack Robinson where he finally demanded greater recognition from the judging panel - and got it.
Ethan (Ryder/WSL)
With John John on the sidelines and Medina out injured, not to mention his former animalian competitive instincts now thoroughly domesticated, the most well-rounded skill set on the tour roster belongs to Jack Robinson. His paradoxical blend of zen composure, extreme aggression, and unpredictable explosiveness puts him in perfect position coming into Teahupoo. Right in the pocket, slipstreaming Filipe Toledo.
How great to see the best challenged by an unruly pointbreak overloaded by a maxing swell that demanded every facet of the skill-set be employed to its maximum capabilities. The rock-off was intense, equipment failures demanded tests of endurance and skills.
Firstly by Kanoa Igarashi in his Quarter against Italo. I'd thought Italo was unbeatable with the heaviest of end section upside down belts. Those hits carried heavy consequences and one that went horribly wrong pancaked him before detonation. Italo was injured and that led to the pivotal moment in the heat.
Italo (Ryder/WSL)
Igarashi snapped his leggy, then ran up the point. Sets repeatedly bombed the lineup and it seemed the contest was over. He managed to rock-off, then push through mountains of heavy whitewater to reach the take-off before Italo and get priority. That gave him a shot at turning the heat. With two minutes and change he got a mid-ranger and unleashed the repertoire for an 8.33.
Meanwhile, the injured Ferreira, unable to ride the second wave, staggered up the beach, barely able to walk.
J-Bay exacted punishment on the Brazilian Storm: Toledo cooked his shoulder; Italo suffered a back injury on his slam; Dora almost dislocated his shoulder getting pancaked in his Semi with Ethan. That injury saw him unable to duckdive and commit one of the cardinal sins of pointbreak surfing: letting a loose board into the lip, which almost collided with Ewing as he rode past.
Yago's loose board (AVG/WSL)
That Semi-Final was incredible with Ewing turning up the rail game a notch, while Dora hit the vertical hooks time and time again. We also had Kelly in the booth. It was something close to heaven for a surf fan.
Ewing's rail game was, according to Kelly, “technically perfect” and the opening ride was scored accordingly. Dora threw a high, corked air reverse on the end and asked the question of judges with an extended, imploring claim that involved an elaborate piece of play-acting as he pretended to write the score on the back of the sled.
Look...claims. People despise them. I loved Kelly's subtle shade as he mocked Jack Robinson's patented mid-wave claim where he points to the beach (to an imaginary critic in my mind).
“Who are you pointing to?” Kelly joked.
I love them. But not the big ugly ones. I like Italo's tinkling the ivories claim after a huge belt, Medina's three-pointer, Slater's wetsuit tug, Ethan's subtle nose wipe.
And yes, I loved Dora's writing-the-script-out claim.
However, it didn't work. He didn't get the score.
The Women’s Final was conclusively won by Tatiana Weston-Webb. The only woman to employ the upside down backside belt on the end section....in fact, the only woman to go anywhere near the big end section hit.
Steph had a shocker, much as Jordy Smith earlier. Couldn't find a good one. Was not helped by a highball call for Tyler Wright’s opening wave which cooked the spread.
Carissa ended up on the wrong end of a lame interference call.
The Woz need to revisit this rule and introduce some head judge discretion. Tati was not impeded. That call effectively ended the contest and led to 35 minutes of dead air and non-spectacle on Finals Day in pumping surf.
Tati and Carissa (Ryder/WSL)
Pumping point surf is a rare and precious commodity and should be cherished to the highest degree by the Woz. You can't afford to artificially eliminate the contest in those conditions except for the most egregious rule infractions and Carissa's “interference” was nowhere near that.
Tati took that decision though, and attacked set waves in the Final against Tyler. It was not a competitive Final with Tati's big turns a league above anything Wright mustered.
Most Finals are pretty anti-climactic. The Men's Final was not. Robinson, who asked who he preferred to surf against after his Semi victory over Kanoa, demurred “either/or”, saying, “it's a new generation and I'm excited”.
He bought a shocking level of aggression and energy to his opening ride. It's fucking on, I thought.
Jack (Ryder/WSL)
The contrast in style and approaches - Robbo aggressive and unpredictable, Ewing with perfect edge-control rail turns - seemed to wash away a litany of over-coached and predictable surfing which has dogged the Australian pro surfing aspirants for years.
It could have gone either way, except for Ewing's aforementioned animal appeal to the judges. They threw the best number of the Final at it, a 9.13. He demanded respect and got it. It was so well deserved.
I ain't got a jingoistic bone in my body but it wasn't possible to watch that Final without something like nationalistic pride thudding in my throat.
Will you bet against Robbo at Teahupoo after this?
Give Ewing a shot against Toledo at Trestles?
You'd have to. Reality demands it.
// STEVE SHEARER
Comments
Nice write up!
Caught the replay of the final just now, missed it last night..
Seeing two Aussies going nuts in pumping waves was epic.
With JJF off the tour currently I thought my interest in it was going south, not the case with EE and JR surfing the way they are.
Awesome comp.
great wrap fr
i was with you - re the state of oz surfing last year, and also last night with the pride in what was on display
one of the best events ever- it has been good to be alive this week
In Tyler and Steph's heat " high ball call" is a farking understatement for Tyler's opening wave.....then they gave Steph a 6. something late in the heat for what was patently a better ride....even if she didnt make the end section. I love listening to the commentators trying to justify the farked up scores.......the judging this year has been all over the show...not just comp to comp....but mid heat to mid heat....Oh and great write up bang on once again...
The only topic of conversation in the lineup this morning, what a comp, everyone loves EE.
No one can deny EE's win with his seamless precision rail work.
But I personally prefer to watch Jack with his letting it all hang out style.
Big ups to them both.
And thanks for the excellent write ups FR.
I agree.
EE in pumping Jbay is Da Vinci painting the Mona Lisa.
I personally prefer to watch that kind of surfing at Jbay.
It's not possible to the same extent at every other event.
+1 for JR preference. It was viruouso, Dane-like riffing. Ethan's 9.1 was well over-cooked. He reminds me of Mick Fanning...perfectly controlled, too restrained? I guess it is a style preference.
Top Notch as always FR
***************************
Last call Brisbane to Papeete Boarding now Paging Stephen Shearer...
Haha good laugh Udo, agree great summary however FR is a complete sicko putting in the hours but so glad he does.
Never surfed J Bay went to Chicama instead, shoulda coulda woulda, gee did anyone else notice how good waves were?
Whatchu laughin about Willis- some old Gold
https://www.swellnet.com/news/swellnet-dispatch/2010/09/01/outsider-too-...
Thanks udo some how missed that one cheers.
If the "Brazilian Storm" is on the wane and the new system is intensifying, it needs a catch phrase - the "Aussie Tsunami", "Australian Wave", something like that.
You're a journalist, mate - think of something and coin the phrase.
A final for the ages. I think the first 15 minutes hardly had a break, back and forth, mano e mano.
Was barracking for EE, but only just. Love Robbo’s animal attacks.
Enjoying your hot takes, as always.
G'day. I love Ethan Ewing, great work, however, I think his 9.13 was way over scored. One great turn, half a great turn, one crappy turn (from memory) vs Jacks first score 8.83. Jacks wave had five beautiful opening manoeuvres that were all part of an incredible first half of the wave, speed, power, flow. I thought Ethans 9.13 was flaccid in comparison. I'm a chef, not a head judge, but I would like to see some others compare the waves and reply on here.
I agree. I thought he was massively over scored for that one and although it was a bigger wave I didn’t think it was close to a 9.13. It was nothing special. If it were up to me I would have given Jack the win but what do I know.
The 8.83 was overs to start with, compared with all the other waves in the heat. The judges clearly liked the bigger waves, and I can see why Ethan's 9.13 was higher than Jack's. It's really that those 2 waves were both overscored compared to the scale for the rest of the heat. Didn't change the result though.
I agree. The final result was fine. I think the major over score was Jack's 7.47. It was closer to a 6.0 to 6.5. Ethan's over scored 9.13 corrected this. Naturally, it was not a 9.13. It contained not one critical move but was very well surfed.
Can't agree that it wasn't critical.
Yes, I too thought Ethan was over scored for his 9.13 and Jack was heavily under scored for his second ride. I had Jack winning the heat, but the judges needed to give Ethan that winning feeling I imagine. Didn’t bother me either way, as it was just great to have two Australians in the final… I can feel Felipe pulling out of Tahiti with a recurring “scared of hollow left” injury miraculously appearing…
Extra point for the flow and style.
That's in the judging equation too.
And EE hands down has that over JR in pumping Jbay.
Spot on.
Australia can hang it’s collective hats on Ewing and Robinson for a decade… Hope a pumping Teahupoo sorts everyone out mentally and physically for Trestles.
Not sure if Ewing is allrounded enough to be a title contender.
I haven't seen too much of his air game or heavy reef surfing yet.
And he's not going to be able to surf to his rail game strength at most events unless they get proper good swells.
Otherwise the air trickery of many of the others will outdo him.
Then again if he can make the top 5 and Trestles can get as big as it can hold,he's a decent chance.
Just thinking air trickery... Italo injured, Medina, Toledo and Dora. This air game short game... JJ. Things that make me go 'mmmm.
Claims are for brazzos and soft cocks.
I reckon Italo was injured after a making a claim , instead of reclaiming his board ( he was then smashed ) If not, he didn’t seem injured when making his claim ?
Great write up Steve, fantastic comp, held at a reasonable time for us 9 to 5ers out there. Not much between EE and Robbo with different approaches, both mesmerising to watch in waves as good as those on offer. Congrats to the WOZ for getting the timing spot on. Now all we need is some coherent and consistent judging. Btw, the live stream commentary here was a laugh, well done everyone.
ethan is deserving, but the wsl commentary and judging always seems to spoil the party. his 9 in the final was no better than jacks final ride. jack underscored when only needing an 8. hearing the commentators making noises like jack got the score, then hiding their shock when he didnt was so cringe. are they so micromanaged by the wsl that they arent allowed to have an opinion contrary to the judges? also very frustrating to see so many good waves go unridden. i dont like the best 2 waves format. with such long heats, jet ski assist, they should be easily able to catch 4 good ones. then we would see less good waves go by unridden just because the person holding priority is too scared to go in case a bomb comes soon after.
I’ll probably get crucified for this but although technically Ethan’s surfing is perfect I find it predictable, conservative and lacking that flair and spontaneity. It’s pretty much identical to Saint Fannings surfing which I personally always found repetitive and underwhelming. You always know what’s gonna happen as soon as they get to their feet unlike Jack. This final reminded me a lot of that final between Mick and Kelly at bells a few years back where the heat could of gone either way but the judges preferred the laser precision rail work very similar to Ethans surfing.
I always preferred watching Taj, Andy etc over mick which is why I obviously prefer jack. I would have given jack the nod in this heat and thought Ethan’s 9.13 was grossly over scored
Different stroke for different folk obviously.
Also I reckon it’s a massive premature ejactualation on claiming the resurgence of the ‘Aussie storm’. Will see what happens by the end of the year. As long as the finals is at shitc#nt trestles I can’t see and Aussie winning.
Jack is certainly a surprise. While his barrel riding was always famous, for a 24.5 yo guy who struggled on the WQS for many years, Jack has certainly manifested into a beast. He completes like a veteran. He is so fun to watch. Coached by Yago's dad, hanging out with Gabriel in Brazil, the high-risk Brazilian approach has made Jack something else.
Spot on Jedi! Summed up my thoughts exactly. Jacks rides were far more entertaining due to variety. That needs to be factored in the judging more. Or else like saint fannings same old surfing just gets repeated.
I agree 100% on all your points and just commented as much above before reading.
Fanning 2.0. Maybe more turn variety? Maybe he'll let loose a bit more now he's got a win and surely some (deserved) confidence.
I’ll probably get crucified for this but although technically Ethan’s surfing is perfect I find it predictable, conservative and lacking that flair and spontaneity. It’s pretty much identical to Saint Fannings surfing which I personally always found repetitive and underwhelming. You always know what’s gonna happen as soon as they get to their feet unlike Jack. This final reminded me a lot of that final between Mick and Kelly at bells a few years back where the heat could of gone either way but the judges preferred the laser precision rail work very similar to Ethans surfing.
I always preferred watching Taj, Andy etc over mick which is why I obviously prefer jack. I would have given jack the nod in this heat and thought Ethan’s 9.13 was grossly over scored
Different stroke for different folk obviously.
Also I reckon it’s a massive premature ejactualation on claiming the resurgence of the ‘Aussie storm’. Will see what happens by the end of the year. As long as the finals is at shitc#nt trestles I can’t see and Aussie winning.
Agree fella. EE does safe family watching surfing. JR goes for anything thats on offer from what’s under his nose, a pure surfer. FR76, love your style, keep it up.
If it was safe, everyone would be holding a rail like Ethan. Maintaining that speed.
It's the opposite.
There are hundreds of guys who can throw crazy airs, there are very very few who can turn like that.
Exactly. Holding speed through the length of the turn, perfect body positioning. Ethan is now using his full body weight and adding a bit of mongrel.
If you go back and watch the final it almost looks like Jack was trying to push too hard on some of his waves in the final, and it left him looking disjointed and twitchy. In comparison Ewing looked solid with more power.
And maybe that was the difference - as Slater said about Ethan's first wave in his semi with Yago, there's just no glitches in Ewing's surfing.
Glad you fellas picked up on this.
Going full-speed, full-rail and full-power isn't conservative.
I'll go so far as to say that apart from one or maybe two examples, we haven't seen turns like that before, such perfectly finished arcs with such precision and speed.
Yes I am not sure why people are nitpicking how many surfers can do what Ethan does - none, and he makes it looks so easy but that is exactly the essence of his surfing. Jack can't hold a rail as long and transfer so effortlessly he has a totally different style which is less suited to a perfect point break. It was beautiful to watch like listening to SRV playing Little Wing - virtuoso. And either way we won with an all Aussie final.
Totally agree and great write-up Steve!
100%
"Over at Swellnet, Steve Shearer lauded Smith as the best surfer never to win a world title. For someone who’s never made any impact in hollow lefts especially, I think that’s a stretch.
Much as I appreciate Jordy’s talent, in the modern era I might put Taj Burrow, Julian Wilson and even Dane Reynolds ahead of him"
~ JP Currie
Shots fired. Engarde!
en garde
äɴ gärd′
interjection
Used to warn a fencer to assume the position preparatory to a match.
Used to warn one's opponent to take a defensive position prior to the beginning of a fight.
The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition.
Julian is the strongest rebuttal.
12 CT wins to 5. Surely Taj gets the nod?
Claims are a slow creep into decay for me..especially when the surfing of Jack and Ethen was so invigorating. I thought Italo's surfing throughout the event was extraordinary - but feel the claiming theatrics at the end of each wave, paradoxically, isn't "hand on heart" - and it leads to others carrying on like pork chops too - give it rest Jack - let your incredible surfing do the talking.
Imagine if AFL players started behaving like soccer players when they get a goal - I for one would be disappointed if surfing developed soccer aesthetics coz' respecting the wave is what counts and jeez J'Bay the penultimate day - took me back - what a wave.
I don't think its an "Aussie" storm. I'd put Colapinto and Dora in the same cohort as Robbo and Ewing. The common factor is flow - both in their surfing and in their mindset.
Surprising to see the majority of comments are Pro Jack, I thought the complete opposite. I liked the Condors comment that his turns are more random and snowboarding than Ethan's pure rail.
Also, is Jacks "Zen Master" the modern "Kelly mind games" for the commentary team?? If you had a drink every time they mentioned it you'd be in the emergency room
i have watched a lot of heats over the years but that final was like the state of origin a few nights earlier......unfukenbelievable.....just hope chopes delivers and then trestles.......wsl now know the formula for an epic contest lets hope they learn from it.
Agree that EE 9 was overscored in the final but thought his wave before the 9 and his last ride were underscored.
Judging didn’t make a whole lot of sense but believe that Ethan deserved the win. I also think he has more in the tank and can mix it up and push harder with his carves.
JR’s belief in himself is insane. Filepe might have some doubts, especially after chopes.
The Author’s call of Jody Smith as the best never to win a World Title… at Pipe this year on the day it mattered he got beaten by Sammy Pupo a rookie on tour and at Pipe. His 2nd scoring wave was a 1. and he never looked like he wanted to better it.
.
What an epic contest and apart from the predictable Slater-hating FR your write-ups are an absolute highlight, thank you. An Aussie resurgence for sure, will be interesting to see if Fil and the Bearded Baby turn up for Chopes?
FR is far from Slater hating he thinks he WAS the greatest thing since sliced bread (or unsliced sour dough I should say with a nice thick crust) it is just he has hung on too long and didn't have a chance of winning JBay.
Can’t wait for more Aussie dominance at chopes.
Pleaseeeeeeee let it be 10ft +
love your work Steve. I've been a fan girl ever since attending a weather seminar you gave at Byron surf fest a few (many?) years ago. Good on you for not being a perfectionist and getting the vibe of the event out there into extremely readable prose. Bring on Tahiti!
A very well crafted write up Steve!
The comments following were almost as entertaining.
For the record I also think Ethan’s 9 was a score to high. A well deserved win all the same!!
Congrats Ethan Yeeewwwing!
Ethan Ewing's coming of age claim was so exciting, so utterly unexpected after years restraint, timed and placed so perfectly he put a magic spell on the judges who (unlike Steve S even after no sleep) give themselves over to the theatre. I thought they might go 10.
Sends a message to the pros. Save your claims for the big moments.
Its a massive arrival for a shy Straddie kid and hopefully ignites a rivalry with Robinsho, Giffin and Yago to all our benefit with a new level of off your tits surfing.
Looking forward to it!
Moana Wong wildcard for Teahupoo !
Great surfing by Steph and Tatiana in the best waves the day before the final.
Mens was a great showcase of each surfers individual style.loved those double ups on the high tides.
Has anyone seen the big wave duck dive technique that Kanoa was doing? Looked like he was standing on his board.
Yeah! That was odd. Didn't quite understand the benefits.
Yeah that was bizarre! At first I thought he was using his board to jump off. Was really surprised to see him pop up with his board.
It's not a new technique and it can be effective if you get it right.
Interesting! Looked like it required a fair bit of skill / balance. Kind of like a JR peak over the top at the beginning.
Can you describe the technique please?
I'll try . but it's basically just sinking your board as far you can while standing on it , and then submerging into a duck dive. And no it's not that easy to get right. The surfers who use it all have their own style and take on it.
I started doing it when bailing on big waves to save lightweight low volume boards from snapping. There's probably also an element of meerkatting with Kanoas example.
I think Kolohe does it a bit too.
A vid of Mikey Februarys take on it.
https://www.facebook.com/WSL/videos/mikey-february-at-teahupoo/101558970...
Wish I could rip 6-8 ft surf on my backhand as well as Tati...... great surfing
Tati in the final was next level.
Can Someone tell the WSL we are tired of missing waves while on live streaming? Its supossed to be a f... live event. Otherwise ill just watch the replay of the day and not having to deal with awful time zone diference.
Since its a make or break situation, imagine F1 Missing the start of the race, Soccer missing a goal or NBA missing a dunk. If it becomes pay per view i would pay, i will glady do it, but not in the current state where imporant moments are missed live and i have to watch replays.
I missed watching so many waves ridden because the peelers in the back ground were so enticing...
Also... Engarde.. An, other mentioned there were no lulls in 3 days. That's not what I recall.
How ya going swellnuts. Here's a song for the fans of the sandwich makers. (aka the majority).
who will help me bake this bread, who will be the first to speak, leave complacency for dead??
Is swellnet harbouring a hive of women hating middle aged men?? The big question?
(no offence to the good folk on here, of which there are many i respect. But i suspect the ones i'm talking about, and there's a fucken shitload, know exactly who they are. Absolute human filth.)
I couldn't make a sandwich if my daughter had that blaring in her bedroom.
..but after 2 or 3 rotations I'd be speaking my voice as I am sure many others would also.
Get off the sauce.
"Ignorance by choice, or, just plain fucking dumb??"
So let's do the maths. Swellnets online live forum is mostly 30 at most middle aged males. Havent even any females. So if someone like myself calls out the derogatory comments on here for being the ugly side of Australian society as they are, who's gonna bat for me?
So 30 swellnet diehards duvided into a surfing population of thousands...hundreds of thousands. Those who dont applaud comments like "theyd probably win a sandwich making contest"...and "they should be banned "...and of course when the surf gets unruly and 10ft plud.."put the women out there"
So you see, you can try to personally attack me...bring me diwn, belittle me and think you're little gang has persevered, but let's keep it in perspective. Theres only 30 or 40 of you. So bring it.
A sad reflection of attitudes to women in Australian society. But this conversation right here is gaining momentum. Its just your little mensshed is so insular and patting each others...erm...you know what, that you haven't noticed it yet. Just such a shame swellnet dont have the balls to call this shit out.
Paul McD. Hi fella. Ive got the pads on (not sanitary) , bat in hand, helmet, on my scone and ready to face the music.
I find it disturbing as to how many males on SN seem to think its a joke to continually use female vernaculars and comparisons to validate their own little sheltered misgivings, insecurities and other gremlins that hey hide themselves and others from in their evil little bat caves. You know, the place where you scribe all this shit and filth. You walk out of that space in your home and smile at the next family member you bump into, knowing too well that just 5 minutes ago you were a little conniving coward slagging of females/women. What would they think if they were beside you when you cowardly punch that keyboard. The traits of some of these males is bordering on schizophrenic behaviour, one sickening personality behind closed doors and the other just a freewheeling dickhead. Mature and grow up. Sick of the comparison i.e “Put the chicks out in 10-12ft Chopes, they’ll never get a wave”, stark reminder, neither would you or most of us. A lot of insecure and fucked up men is how I see it. That’d be Tea, id say. Cant wait for the evening session up to stumps. Game on Chaps.
Hey Alfred, comments like this
“ Sick of the comparison i.e “Put the chicks out in 10-12ft Chopes, they’ll never get a wave”, stark reminder, neither would you or most of us. A lot of insecure and fucked up men is how I see it. “
are wide of the mark I reckon.
Comparing professional sports people, like the top 1% in the world at what they do, to Joe public is pointless.
Pro’s get paid hundreds of thousands if not millions a year to do what they do.
They should be able to surf every wave on tour. Toledo included.
This is so cool!
Who would've thought a humble surfing website like Swellnet would be dripping in, no, oozing such performative sanctimony.
Bravo!
Paul, BD, with respect mate. I reckon you should lighten up a little. A few blokes having a bit of a laugh on a Friday night. I'm guessing that a good percentage of them are loving husbands, fathers, brothers and guaranteed all are sons. I'm also guessing they are not women haters- quite the opposite actually. Just because women's surfing for the most part is not exactly pleasing to the eye (to men) or that some of the personalities can be a bit polarising, doesn't mean that us fellas feel threatened, or insignificant, or driven to want to go out and bash and rape, we for the most part just see women as people. You have to stop putting women on a pedestal, they are just humans and have the same qualities, faults and human frailties that we do as men. The fact that they look nice, smell nice and feel incredible when they're all soapy in the shower is moot. They can send us to heaven with a simple glance and straight back down to hell with a cutting word, but for the most part they're nice to have around. On the same token, blokes like to have a bit of fun and a bit of a laugh at their expense sometimes. How many of us out there don't think we'd take a bullet for our girls? You don't think they do that to us or would do that for us? Pick up a newspaper, won't take you long to find out.
I'm truly sorry about your friend. There are and always will be grubs in this world but don't for a minute think that men have a monopoly on that. Some of the nastiest people I've met in my lifetime have just so happened to have boobs, happily those sort of people are in the minority.
Anyway, not trying to change your way of thinking, I personally think you overreach a little sometimes is all.
Btw, I love it when Rosie says anything.
Well said Zen.
I was going to say something a little less polite.
Drew a long bow with that one PMcD .
I’ve been ousted. It’s true, Jedi Oldmate hates all women and think they are inferior and only hear to serve us blokes.
But Paul, your absolutely heroic online activist work has effectively shamed me forcing me to rethink my views and reform. Who knew an online anonymous comment could change someone’s views so effectively!!! Paul we all commend you for your brave work. I know longer hate women thanks to you. Cheers mate.
Throwing in sixty cents here (two isn’t enough).It’s the offhand comments and jokes that women are exhausted by because it’s everyday and everywhere. While some of you might have your Friday night fun - and I don’t tune into the livestream commentary because I’ve read a bit and I find parts pretty offensive sometimes - for women it’s not just Friday night, it’s all the time. We can’t switch it off. You say you are fathers, brothers, sons. How would you feel if Rosie or Laura were your daughter or sister knowing that people are talking about her that way. (Further to that, as with ScoMo and Jenny and the Brittany Higgins case, it shouldn’t take having a female relative for a man to be able to relate to the disrespect that women experience because they are women). I’m certainly not saying that because a guy makes a joke about women that he is going to commit or endorses sexual assault. I don’t think anyone is saying that. However, it is entrenched cultural negative attitudes to women that forms the base for SOME men to assume positions of power over women and commit assault, domestic violence etc. Yes, I’m well aware that women can assault men and same-gender violence also occurs. Anyway, here’s a female point of view. I’m not expecting it to change anything and some of you might wonder why I bother given I’m far from a prolific user of this website, but thought I’d lend support to a side of the argument. Someone is calling out disrespectful behaviour, that it what it is, and I think that deserves some recognition and support. It’s a cliche but change does have to start somewhere. PS. To address the actual article while I’m here, Jbay was the best contest in ages and Tati absolutely ripped on her backhand. Ethan’s surfing is amazing but I’m another Jack fan, the raw surfing is insane and keeps you on your toes as a viewer because you don’t know what he’ll do next.
Thanks for chipping in.
I 100% agree with you, and Paul, regarding the frequent crappy comments from a few posters and the regular sarcastic “should send the women out there now” thinking they’re not capable..
Where I disagree with Paul is that he has pulled people up for criticising performance aspects of the women and saying “they’re all surfing amazing and we should support them all the way”
Yes we should support them, but poor performances aren’t above criticism and we criticise plenty of the men for terrible efforts too.
I’m with you there. Individual performances should be open to critique and if Carissa or Tyler or anyone of the women surf a shocking heat or get overscored for repetitive manoeuvres etc then call it. It’s when underlying sexism shows through in generalisations about the women as a cohort that is really not cool.
Hi Peppa, I'm genuinely stoked that you took the time to chip in and offer a woman's perspective in what is obviously a sea of testosterone. If you would indulge me, I have a few questions and I mean this sincerely, I was hoping you could perhaps share your own perspective and personal experiences without it of course being too personal or making you uncomfortable. As a middle aged man myself and guilty in the past of some of the old tropes that are drawn out from time to time, I'd like to know in order for me to understand and evolve. Also, I know this is probs not the right place, but I brought it up here so will keep it here for now.
You mention that it never 'switches off' for a woman? Can you tell me how so and how it relates to you and in what context? Are men openly harassing you in public and/or in your work-place? Realistically, how constant is it (hourly, daily, weekly)? What is the nature of it? For example, is it men complimenting or commenting on your looks, your body, how you present yourself, how you conduct yourself, your ability to do your work? Do you get wolf whistled or cat-called when you pass job sites or crossing the road? If so, how often would you say this happens to you or your female friends, colleagues or relatives? Have you ever been overlooked for a position at work in favour of a less qualified man? Do you get paid less than your male colleagues? Basically what I'm asking is the nature of the abuse/harassment, the context and the frequency that you personally experience. Do you feel unsafe as a woman living in Australia?
Second, I'd like to know- is it ever ok these days to compliment a woman and is it also ok to criticise? For example, I work with and come into contact with dozens of women every day. Also, and I don't know if it relates to a certain condition that I have, but I notice any and every tiny detail in my world and the slightest change or deviation from it is magnified tenfold to me. So, if a lady I know has been to the hairdressers, within a split second, no matter how subtle the change is, I know. And, because I also have a big mouth, I will say 'Oh you've had your hair done, looks nice' or 'cool shoes, go shopping over the weekend?' etc. I'm not trying to bed them, I'm just being sincere and naturally friendly because I happen to be a sincere and naturally friendly person. What I want to know, is it wrong to compliment a woman these days? Also, is it wrong to deny our basest of base instincts and verbalise that we find a woman attractive? Regarding Friday night and Rosie Hodge, I can't recall anyone saying dirty things about her, but I do recall many of us (me included) saying how beautiful she is, how we loved the way she speaks and generally what a class act she is. Laura too. Is that wrong? Roles reversed, is the opposite ok? In addition, yes I guess we were all in our little virtual chat room but it was a couple of hours and there were a bunch of topics flying around, most of them related to the epic waves and equally epic surfing and the always questionable judging with a tiny portion about other things, mostly during the downtime and an even tinier amount talking about girls. Most of that was cheeky, very little was sexual and none of it even went close to okaying violence. Day to day. I can't say I really know any men obsessed with women in the way you mention above. Most blokes I know co-exist with their wives, daughters, colleagues quite peacefully. I don't know any man thankfully that has ever hit a woman, but I know they're out there and I'll bet every man that I know would feel the same way about any grub that raises a fist to a lady. On the same token, is there such a thing as accountability with a woman? Do you all get a free pass for not having that extra chromosome? I've seen some women do some pretty nasty stuff in my time and I mean cold-blooded nasty shit, stuff that would have a bloke shopping for dentures. Are woman above reproach?
Anyway, I could go on and on but I want to thank you again for you 60 cents but I'm gonna stick with my original post above in that the vast vast majority of men that I know are decent people but also confused. Because I might be blind, I don't see this constant wearing down of women that you mention above and if you can help me be more cognizant of it we can perhaps we can revisit this conversation another day. Thanks once again Peppa.
I'll leave you with something- I was always brought up to respect women and open doors for them, give up my seat on the train for them and generally put them above me and for the most part it has served me well. One thing that sticks with me to this day- I was about 18 years old heading into the bank, nicely dressed lady about 40 I'm guessing behind me. I stopped and held the door open so she could go in before me, I'll never forget this, she hissed at me "don't you patronise me you little twit". I didn't know what to do, I kinda just stuttered I'm sorry. I've never forgotten that.
Hi Zen, I appreciate your response and open approach. Happy to try to answer your questions here and provide some more context around my experience and elaborate on what I meant in my post. To start with, this is only my experience and observations, and obviously other women have different experiences to mine.
When I say never switches off, I mean that it’s all around me everyday. It’s either directly happening to me, impacting me indirectly or I’m witnessing it in society. The directly happening component is not everyday for me, not even weekly I’d say. Some of what I’ll describe probably seems pretty miniscule to be raising, but when it’s compounded with everything else it forms part of a bigger environment. Also, my background possibly positions me to notice and consider some things that happen more than many women? So maybe it bothers me more than others, I don’t know. I have a degree in social science and have been exposed to some fairly unpleasant material in various jobs, including instances of sexual harassment and misogyny in workplaces. To clarify, I was not subjected to these, rather my work bought me in contact with quite a few of these and other incidents. I also consume a lot of news and documentaries on this topic and other social issues and events so I’m tuned in to a lot of what goes on around us.
When I was (quite a bit) younger, yes I was wolfwhistled at. Walking home at night from a train station or pub I have felt the need to walk fast, look behind me constantly and hold my phone in my hand; sit in the front carriage of the train. Do I feel safe in Australia? Yes, definitely. But there are some situations I don’t feel quite as safe in. I’ve been complimented on my looks. Sometimes it makes you feel good about yourself, other times it feels creepy. In one job I was paid less than male colleagues who were in equal or more junior roles. Men and women assuming my husband earns more than me is something I find insulting whether true or not at the time. Being told to smile is awful!! These are some obvious examples.
Next, what do I witness and am impacted by? This is the frequent stuff. Groups of men (all ages) staring together at a good looking young woman as she walks past them in public or walks into a room or similar. I get that men like looking at women, and vice versa. But when all six heads turn and look at the woman at once, and their gaze stays on her, and you can see them discussing what they’re looking at, it can make her feel uncomfortable. I don’t know the answer, perhaps take a quick glance and look away. Didn’t parents all teach us that it’s rude to stare? Frequent jokes or comments about female drivers. I don’t know why this is a thing still given insurance companies clearly think men are a greater risk on the road. Yet it persists. Jokes about periods. Women being labelled as angry and aggressive when simply voicing an opinion. Billboards of women in almost no clothes selling unrelated products. Walking through a shop and seeing bras on sale for 8 year olds. Some schools still forcing girls to wear skirts and dresses to school. These last three aren’t to be blamed on a specific man’s behaviour, but reflect how society sexualises women more than men or sticks to traditions to the detriment of women. The first two don’t impact me directly but they really piss me off. The third impacted me because I’d have to wear bike shorts to school under my dress everyday so I could comfortably play sport at lunchtime. I remember reading surf mags back in the 90s and 2000s with the reef girl ads and not quite knowing how to feel. Angry that women were reduced to that but also thinking, fuck being the girl in the bikini on the beach when you could be surfing instead. (Now we’ve come full circle and all the girls are surfing in skimpy swimwear).
And then cut across to the really sad, tragic part of society - reading about all the instances of domestic violence in the news: x number of women killed by a partner each week. Next you read about how the QLD police force has been found to have a culture of poor responses to domestic violence, eg. Officer giving out a woman’s address to ex-partner. Allegations of sexual harassment and sexual assault against elected MPs. Defence lawyers insinuating that what a woman was wearing when she was raped matters. Do men have an interest in reading or watching news reports on these things? I don’t know.
This is just some of what I mean when I say it’s everywhere and everyday. It’s not the same, in your face, happening to you events everyday but if you can see it, it is everywhere in society and it’s often always happening to a woman somewhere. Sometimes it has happened to me. I’m also comfortable acknowledging that things are improving.
So when I jump on Swellnet and see some comments that objectify women amongst the otherwise harmless fun about how Rosie looks (I agree she does have a lovely voice for commentating, but how she looks doesn’t make her a better commentator) or how Joanne has the best arse, or how waves are wasted on the girls, or how one punter will be logging off to “polish his knob” (that one wasn’t the jbay comp and excuse me if that wasn’t what was said verbatim but it was very close), it’s not ideal. Hopefully what I’ve described above explains why this is the case. Please also know that In no way do I think the comments are okaying violence. Like I said before, other female users may not be bothered and conversely it may also bother some male users. This is my take on it. Its well established that violence against women has a base in negative cultural attitudes towards women. This isn’t saying that every person who expresses a negative or offensive comment towards women is going to commit violence or supports violence, probably far from it. It means that violence against women can often be traced back to negative attitudes towards women so if attitudes can be changed then hopefully the violence is reduced or eliminated. This will take generational change I think. There are some really good ads on tv at the moment that are trying to do this that target teenage boys.
Oddly, some of the aggression on display between swellnet users is intense but I can look past that to a degree. Maybe because it’s not something that affects me as much in my everyday life. I’ve noticed some users calling out the aggression though, which is good. Maybe they have more personal experience with that or have witnessed it more so feel more strongly about it.
Your next questions about what is socially appropriate are really interesting and they’re ones I’ve asked myself too. I don’t have an answer and I think it’s because what may be a compliment to one woman can be a come on or patronising to another. Me, I feel awkward whenever anyone compliments me and usually shrug it off or just say thanks. When I was younger though, it made my blood boil. I understand it must be hard for guys to figure out what to say or not say in the current world. I’ve had conversations with male friends who are terrified that they’ll say something at work to a female colleague that may be misconstrued as sexual harassment. It may sound over the top, but my honest advice would be to look on a Worksafe or Australian human rights commission website or similar to see what the definitions of sexual harassment are and then work backwards from there to judge what May or may not be appropriate. But then it’s hard also when you can have regular banter with a friend or close colleague and now wonder if what you may have said in the past was inappropriate. Maybe ask them what is appropriate to them? At the very least, it could show that you’re thinking about it and are aware.
As for accountability for women, I’d say it goes both ways and I don’t like double standards for anyone. I’ve come across women who have treated men and women terribly and it’s no better or worse because they’re female. And yes if I’m saying I find it offensive when men act towards women in a certain way, I don’t then expect a free pass to display the very same behaviour towards men that I’m condoning. Glad you brought that up because it’s important to acknowledge. I also agree with you that the majority of men are good people and that often no offence is intended by words. Sometimes it does cause offence though.
I love your story about the lady on the train. Sometimes you just cannot win. It’s going to be a really damned annoying response but for me sometimes it is patronising and sometimes it isn’t. Chivalry used to annoy me but I’ve decided to let it go and roll with it. If a guy wants to open the door for me that’s fine. (Sometimes i open a door for a guy and get a really funny look.) It’s like weighing up whether to offer a seat to a lady you think might be pregnant but you’re not quite sure, or to an older person you’re implying is elderly. Now when anyone male or female walks onto a train before letting others exit, that’s a problem.
Wow Peppa, I'm genuinely stoked with your reply and for taking the time to write that. There's a lot to process and digest there.
I guess the takeout from that is that we all have a long way to go. Probs the approximate distance between Venus and Mars. Second, the role and complicity of the media, both positively and negatively.
I hope this conversation doesn't end there, not necessarily in this forum but It's important to keep the channels of communication open. Also, I'm not down on Paul, I admire his stance. The delivery not so much. But, if that's what it takes I guess that's fine.
I'll leave it for now a little more educated but after that and without going in to my background too much, I can confidently say I have a pretty good balance when it comes to women. i; hope I can continue to evolve.
I still think Rosie is beautiful btw. Whether she cares or not we'll never know.
Edit- btw Peppa, hope you drop by more often.
Sounds like a good plan, Zen.
Big ask for Peppa to staple together the cracks in the gender divide but she's had a fair crack and I love the convo, hopefully we all have a think about what she's said.
I stuck up for the girls a while back and got bracketed in 'non binary' lol, so to Paul I say, you can lead a horse to water mate but you can't stick it's big thick skull in there and make it drink.
I think there's many on here who are sick of the "chuck the chicks in Chopes" comments as I think they don't represent the majority. I hope I'm right? Maybe it's just us with daughters.
I'm not ruling it out either, some girls have these skills but dieing shouldn't be a factor in any workplace and if the girls don't like the risk then we should respect the decision. Local breaks are a sausage fest and girls don't get the practice at the top end of the reef on big days without the support of local crew so it's not like they've had the same opportunity to develop critical surf skills like Moana JW has done at Pipe.
I have so much love for the way the girls compete, like the QS at Snapper, the sportwomanship (good grief did I just type that?) is so good, compete hard but at the end have a hug and a laugh, 'I'll get ya next time', like the snowboarding etc at Olympics, so positive, it's just sport after all.
Zen, your crush on Rosie is so relatable. The woman is adorable, like Barton, and if I said 'I'm fully prepared to have Barton's child' you'd maybe think that's pretty funny, wierd, but funny. Couldn't make the same with the female host. It's a minefield.
I got outed somehow on Facebook for having a long standing crush on Livinia Nixon, it was humiliating and I promised myself I wouldn't get sucked in by an alluring tv host ever again (sorry Barton) but Peppa's trying to help us there, it's pervasive and if it seems ok then everyone will think they have permission to objectivise females so we should probs drop that I guess, as innocent and hilarious as it was at the time.
You're clearly a gentleman Zen who respects each individual, surely we can work the rest out from there?
Delighted to read this exchange first thing in the morning. Thanks for taking the time, PB.
You too, Zen.
Yep, good well balanced reasoning in a world gone mad, well written too
That write up is a fitting finish to the most incredible sporting event I think I've ever watched. Nice to see such well spoken talented young Aussies finally stamping their mark in waves that showcase professional surfing at its best.
Thankfully the best surfing prevailed, with the most committed guys and girls on rail getting rewarded. Was so nice to see an event without airs (Yagos makes the only ones from memory?) deciding the result.
One thing I noticed with EE's surfing was the fact his turns and board were going back to the foam a lot of the time, which means he was turning pretty damn hard. He's a pretty special talent and look forward to seeing him destroy Trestles (not guaranteed yet I know).
Well said Zen!
Paul maybe try Inertia.com for your surfing content? Very woke and happy feely.
Or take a look at Beachgrit.com if you really want to see some angry white males to tell off.
If the surfing is shitty or the surfer is a goose (whatever the sex) it is ok to say so. That the point .
As for burly , she just stirs shit and demands attention whatever the topic like all teenage girls do so better to take her comment with a grain of salt.
Great write up as always FR.
Well done
Ethan and Jack
Solid work
That was a great final that topped off a fantastic event. So good to see unreal surfing in top quality waves for a change !
EE surfing was a pleasure to watch and the difference for me over JR is he keeps the flow from rail to rail non stop.
Jack surfed great too but tends to hesitate after each turn as if he’s thinking of the next one he needs to do.
I do believe Jacks air game and approach to heavy waves sets him apart to Ethan though and will get him the nod in shorter, sharper waves.
It’s also fantastic to see 2 Aussies in the top 5 and 4 Aussies in the top 10 !!
Oi Oi Oi !!
Seems it's been a while since there's been a contest with - in addition to red hot surfing in pumping waves - a whole range of additional challenges.. broken boards, snapped leggies, personal injuries - usually par for the course, but at J-Bay exacerbated by the complex entry/exit situation under a relentless 6ft+ swell.
Really added to the spectacle, I reckon.
Wow what I final, I watched it live and had no doubts about the result, big fan of both guys.
TWW absolutely destroyed the final, but I’ve never really like TWs surfing, clearly amazing as a 2x world champ, just those lay back turns off the top…
Fantastic event on another level only one I can recall with that much excitement was
Pipeline 2013 when Slater won JJ won the triple crown and Fanning won the world
title. Then again I was on the beach with my two sons it was electric. Still have my
doubts Fanning won his semi but three winners on the day.
Im a massive Jack fan and without doubt a world champion but can some tell him to
subdue his Brazzo over the top claims, his surfing is a claim in it self.
Ewing WOW that guy is on big time its just insane we have two genuine world title
contenders back to the iconic days of Fanning and Parko.
Watched the whole comp, was pretty good.
Could have been better though I reckon. This mid-year cut and final 5 shoot-out have totally screwed this year up. There's no world title ramifications except for the few fighting for the 5, no re-qualification pressure. I would have loved to have seen some of those chopped by the cut out there. How would Callinan and Chianca performed?
Not much of a Tati fan but that was always going to be an interference with or without a dive. It was a strange one, looked like Riss only took the wave to avoid getting caught inside by the set behind it (after getting caught by a set and snapping her board in her last heat). She looked at Tati, started to fade, then bottom turned straight across in front of her. It was a crap wave so Tati added the dive for extra effect. And Tarti only went cos she had priority and it was an opportunity to get an interference on Riss.
Should have been Happy G in the womens final too dunno why they pushed Tyler so much. WSL appealing to a new market perhaps?
In the mens well fuck me that could be the best surfing I've seen. Ethan, Jack, Yago, Mr O'Leary. Big turns, speed, power, barrels.
Wonder if Toledo goes to Chopes? He doesn't have to, already guaranteed 1st or 2nd seed. And he is injured? Picked up a knee injury or something at J-Bay? If so the logical thing to do would be to rest up for the finals. Which is another reason this top-5 bullshit needs to go.
Pancho got second at 1 - 2ft Trestles one year, Mick also won when small and onshore. Don't discount the bigger rail surfers winning there just yet
Jordy has won twice, if memory serves correctly.
Does Jack Robbo sign shit for the kids? Always seems to brush any fan interaction post heat win or loose.
Yep he does.
how good was it that the guys shredding are Aussies....finally....it was epic to watch Ethan and jack in a final...for me the interference on Carissa was clear cut, she should of straightened out, black and white, straighten out. Tati academy performance was classic and she played it to a tee...why not? I am also puzzled why they push Tyler so much, her scores do not reflect the surfing she is doing
I thought there was more variety in Tyler's turns and scores were reasonable, maybe half a point high here and there. But she was schooled in the final. Tati was eating it up. Also to Ben's comment, I had noted the footage of Riss and Tati entering the water, Tati straight in no worries whilst Riss was flaffing around.
Photo Credits: A+
Ha ha ha...cheers Ed.
Consider me duly chastised after the poor work on Day Two.
I largely agree and approve with the men's final, and result; the quality of the waves, everything.
Just like to share what was the absolute highlight for me. It was Carissa's heat, where she had snapped the board, was on the ski and probably wondering how to get in.
Her hubby, Luke I believe, ran down from the tower with a board and leggie, stripped down to his jeans, and was putting the leggie on, prepared to try to paddle it out to her. Absolutely incredible. No wettie, cold water, 6-8ft and that's before the rock-off - and he was prepared to do it. Well done.
Next bit - Carissa then began to swim in. Jumped off the ski, no board attached (I'd want any float, even a bodyboard worth) then she got worked and swept on the way in. Dunno if any of you have done any swim or board rescues, but swimming in at that size is a challenge in itself, before you add a heat timer. Carissa gets in, runs up the beach (again, this is like the lifesaving requal - any of you tried to swim out, rescue someone, do a run, swim out again when it's solid?), gets the board off her hubby and team, a few breaths, then has to jump off and get out again. And she does, and wins the heat.
Legendary.
Credit to her for the win in that heat and all but I feel like she is one of the less fit (although best surfer or close to) on the women’s side.
She had just been having quite a long breather on the ski before she did the swim in.
And she looked absolutely cooked.
She was lucky Caroline Marks put in an absolute stinker that Carissa didn’t need to perform her best to take it out.
Watch Jack Robbo and Kanoa after their swim ins. They absolutely machined it over the rocks and sprinted up the beach full throttle.
Not saying I could have done better than CM but I reckon a Courtney Conologue would have made it look a bit easier.
Agreed VJ, those kinds of feats and oceanic challenges made me think of the difference between, say, J-Bay and the sterile environment of the wave pool and how boring it is when all those x-factors are stripped out.
Hope this years retirement is permanent.
I know people complain about the waiting between sets when the swell is a bit slow but there is nothing as irritating and mundane as waiting for the train to push the next wave through the wave pool. At least you can watch the ocean as time ticks by
After the Mick incident I think there is one thing I think most of us watch as time ticks by nowadays, but there wasn't much time between sets this comp. If there wasn't someone on a wave I'm sure most of us were mind surfing the unridden ones. Especially those drone shots looking into the wave!!
Looking ahead, if it is 10ft at chopes. We know JR will be into it and there’s a list of US, HAW and BR as well that know the ropes.
But how many of the other aussies have runs in the board?
There’s only 4 others I think?
Ethan
Cal Robson
Connor O’Leary
Jacko Baker
I know Cal and Connor will have a serious dig. Haven’t seen Ethan charge but I’m sure he will, given his standing and fitness. Baker is the one I have the biggest doubts for. He did pull into at least one solid one at pipe this year but looked a bit lost from memory.
My take is Jack mistimed his claims and Ethan didn't
The reason I enjoy your daily breakdown on the comps SS/FR is they fit with my perception.....and the comments you inspire are fun to read
Looking at WSl Men’s final five rankings, post J-Bay, the only real question mark is whether Igarashi makes the final five. Unless the Pupo brothers, Robson, O’Leary, Ibelli, or Florence (in the slim chance he surfs the event) win the Tahiti contest.
The only other scenario is one of top six getting injured, which is why it might be wise for Toledo to sit in lineup and not catch a wave, if he even shows up (due to shoulder injury).
Myself and others are not belittling Ethan’s performance or surfing style, great surfer beautiful to watch, very humble out of the water with manners that many a Brazilian competitor could only hope to acquire. So cool to have them both in the final going wave for wave. Others including myself just prefer JR’s surfing over Ethan’s, nothing derogatory going on here at all. Put simply, its just an OPINION.
Peppa. Great writing, full admiration for your complete honesty. May your voice be heard more often. There’s nothing wrong with admiring women, but it’s how you do it, after all, us males are genetically programmed to look at the opposite sex that’s how the mammalian world has evolved. Key point with us fellas is not to drift into ‘dickhead’ mode. I personally believe men take a very long time to mature and in most cases, never do.
“ us males are genetically programmed to look at the opposite sex”
Except for those that aren’t, of course :)
Andy M. Very true, made me laugh momentarily but its ok to do so if you are that way inclined. A lot of the biological world and way more organisms than we realise operate in the same sex manner.
"There’s nothing wrong with admiring women, but it’s how you do it, after all, us males are genetically programmed to look at the opposite sex that’s how the mammalian world has evolved."
Bingo (To the 'Dickhead' point too). And Peppa, respectfully, this swings both ways; do you think that women, and groups of women, do not stare at men and make comments? 5 decades of experience says heck yes they do.
I am so happy and grateful that I was young in an era when chivalry, flirting and more were enjoyed by both men and women.
Indeed, women do the same. Like I noted, I don’t think women should be excused for behaving in a way that men are criticised for.
Surely there’s still a place for flirting, it just has to adapt with the times like everything else. Maybe something will be lost but there’s possibly also some gains. Now I’m sounding way too philosophical…
Mate of mine works hospo and was serving a group of middle age women the other day.
The started ogling him and making "rowrr" noises at him, and then said they had a hot daughter they could set him up with.
Fella said he felt pretty uncomfortable.
Andy M. Good point. Well, your mate can for a small moment now imagine how uncomfortable most women feel on a daily basis, I for most of my life worked in a male dominated industry and the daily dialogue and vernacular regarding females was flabbergasting. It’s as though most males sadly valued nothing about women or at times gave no creedence to their existence at all, except for if there was a chance of having sex, then they were fully engaged with myopic eyeballs. We still have a long way to go on this matter.
You should try being a male in a predominantly female industry; it's exactly the bloody same. It's the way it works - or doesn't.
Tell me about it
Yeah you gotta watch out for "rowrr".
Applies equally to cats.
I had an older woman tell me a few years ago in a wine bar I was working - 'if you feed me Manchego, i will orgasm for you' ! I had a good chuckle and puffed out my chest a bit more and went home to my wife!
Exactly I.B., it's the way it works.
With regards to "at times gave no creedence to their existence at all, except for if there was a chance of having sex"
Wish I had a dollar for every time I'd been dropped like a hot potato after someone (both male or female) had found out I was not interested/ not single/ straight.
To infer this is a male-only trait is pure sexism.
And
" It’s as though most males sadly valued nothing about women "
Alfred I don't know where you've been but I'm putting this comment in the hysterical hyperbole category.
Sure there're many grubs out there but when you use statements like that we're back to broad subjective statements which easily fall into the category of sexism.
Andy M. Come on mate don’t start, you are the one making the inference. No sexism here in my thought process, I exclaimed I worked with mostly males so therefore can’t make any judgment about any vernacular if I was working in a female dominated work place. Just how it is, of course there are many great men/males who don’t speak disparagingly about or under value women, it was just daily, weekly, monthly and yearly diatribe from men. Men who would finish at 3.30pm, buy a six pack sit in their car until 5.30pm listening to the radio reading the paper and sucking piss. When asked one day why are you still parked outside work, reply, fuck going home now, means I’d have to help around home and the kids, I go home when dinners just rolling out on the table, so therefore you can understand my view. Barley Charlie, no sexism here. Please don’t turn this discussion into something that it’s not. Enjoy and appreciate your comments none the less
Sorry mate it might not be intended but broad stereotyping such as you’ve done is the definition of sexism.
Don’t get me wrong, grubby behaviour should be called out where it exists, and there are plenty of guys who need a wake up.
A bloke wanting quiet time sucking tins in his car after work might not be your scene but it’s not sexism either.
Pretty selective what you got out of that wasn't it.
No. Please excuse me if I didn’t colour between the facts with my own fantasies about spousal abuse. I used to work with a brickie- really nice fella- who’d sit and drink a beer quietly in his car for a while around the corner from his house before going home. His wife stayed at home all day whilst he worked and he’d rather she took care of the kids for a bit as he defragged after a day stacking rocks with the site radio blaring and worksite noise and shit talk going on constantly around him. His wife understood and was happy for him to do so. That is the same story related by Alfred Wallace but without the sub context filled in by personal prejudice.
The only problem my mate the brickie experienced was when a copper came and knocked on his car window and asked him what he was up to as my mate’s convenient resting spot was on the same street as a primary school and hysterical parents had pinned him as a potential sex predator instead of a bloke seeking a moment’s solace.
Haha!
Yes, things are rarely black/white. There's always some other story behind the obvious one we think we're seeing.
Good the hear different opinions.
Can I just apologise to SN in general and to FR in particular if I sounded like a snarky b!tch, and for hijacking another great comp review. Been some very very busy times with not enough sleep, and the old brain is running on fumes.
You'll be happy to know that my lovely wife has not been at the receiving end of any grumpiness - but my colleagues have :-)
I'd like to aplogise too, because I kinda started it. The writeups have been awesome, not only for this contest. but as way to bookend all the contests that begin with the excellent forecasts and synopsis (anybody know the plural of synopsis- synopsi?) by Craig and the post-mortem by Free.
I make no apologies for taking part in the chat. I don't get to talk in English to groups of people that often so when I join in, I really enjoy myself. I reckon the chats really add to the experience and would hate to see it canned.
Not apologising for what I said, either. Just for if it came out sounding snarky. Ran out of patience yesterday.
Great to catch up on an epic all aussie final. Haven't had a chance to watch the final but i thought there were going to be devil winds and had work so didnt watch it. This excellent write up has got me keen to watch the whole day 3. EE and JR both my new favorite Aussie surfers besides Mikey and Rasta.
Jack's scamper across the JB Bricks after he creased his board deserves a mention. A gold medal performance in rock hopping and getting back in the line up in quick time.
Robbo rail game doesn't convince me, but he is the best competitor on tour this year.
Ethan is so good to watch!!!