Billabong Pro Pipeline: Day 4
Modern professional sports - the guys and the gals - exist in the Attention Economy, and the competition for eyeballs in this realm is fierce and unrelenting.
Richie Porta in his morning wrap claimed that for the Womens comp at Pipe, today would be a “day of days for them”.
Using those two statements as framing, let's take a look at the Round of 16 and Quarter-Finals heats from the Women at Pipe today.
Pipe looking inviting (Keoki/WSL)
First up, it wasn't heaving Pipe like we've seen for the Men's contest days. The size ramped down quickly from a glassy/lumpy 6-8 foot to a sedate, user-friendly 4 foot with a few bigger ones. So, the testing of the mettle at proper Pipe didn't happen today. We saw a few lefts being ridden, mostly expertly, by Moana Jones Wong, with a bit of a dabble from Carissa Moore.
Most of the gun waves ridden were Backdoor rights, with some memorable tubes among them, mostly by Carissa Moore and some surprise packets from Isabella Nichols, Lakey Peterson, and Molly Picklum. That standard is rising fast and created some great competition moments.
Molly Picklum (Heff/WSL)
On its own merits, it was a fine day of fun-sized Pipe with a brace of good rides. The reality in the attention economy that modern sports exists in is that it doesn't exist on its own merits. The now seamless integration with the Men's tour means that Women's and Men's Pipe surfing exists within the same attention ecosystem. Comparison is baked in.
Assuming the pro surfing audience is likewise seamlessly integrated that means fans that were thrilled by as, “big as it gets, as good as it gets” Pipe only yesterday could not avoid the contrast with today. It's basic human psychology to have a “recency bias”: we remember and prioritise the last thing we saw.
Which means you can't escape the “huh?” moment when a pocket ride yesterday on an 8 foot wave was scored a 3 and a pocket ride today on a 4 foot wave got a mid-5.
It seems a clear case of what Noel Pearson called the “soft bigotry of low expectations”.
Don't get me wrong. The only way out is through and in the end the Women will rise and drag the next generation into the vortex of competition at Pipeline.
Some are ahead already. Moana has pared the equation down to maximum simplicity and functionality. Sit deep on a big board, get in behind the boil, and pull a perfect Lopez line into the pit. For most of today she was the only surfer interested in going left, despite a legion of spitting barrels sending rainbow spray into the heavens.
Moana Jones Wong (Bielmann/WSL)
Carissa has a functional game going left, but didn't need it today. She sat there for a while in her heat with Beth Hamilton, seemingly content to rack up some reps on the lightly-attended lefts.
However, when she moved over to the rights the results were spectacular. A pair of rides were the highlight of the day. The first, a long traveller that she got clipped on at the exit was a Backdoor special that would have won any heat. Judges did not pay it, awarding a flat 4.
The next was a frothy deep one, accentuated by a behind the peak drop and a huge pump into the wide open section. A clean make for a 9.5.
You'd think every wide-eyed grom girl would have written in capitals Carissa's simple summation in her post-heat presser: “Pipe is the place where you want to surf and prove yourself”.
Carissa's dominant heat created a ballast of belief around which a brace of hot performances eventuated. Isabella Nichols, who commentator Makua Rothman admitted he hadn't heard of, was stellar in her defeat of Bettylou Sakura Johnson, before going down to Moana Jones Wong. Lots of “shimmying” in the tube at Backdoor to find an exit, lots of gritty drops. She was damn impressive.
Carissa (Bielmann/WSL)
Rookie Molly Picklum did not appear in the slightest to be intimidated by the ocassion. There was an intensity in her approach to her heat with Johanne Defay, pulling in and pigdogging lefts and backdooring rights. She lost the heat but will not be disappointed rolling the videotape later on.
It's impossible to know what Tyler Wright will think upon reviewing the day with her team. Her first heat was a walk-through after Steph Gilmore was caught in the COVID net. Her second heat was also a walk-through after rookie India Robinson was scratched due to injury. Contest Director Jessi Miley-Dyer said India was rubbed due to a “pre-existing injury” but Wright in her presser said India was concussed, which does not sound like a pre-existing injury. The secrecy/deception seems bizarre, even if not intended. Pipe is a dangerous spot, injury is expected.
Tyler caught five waves in her walk-through, the lowest a 0.67, the highest a 5.50 for a neat ride at Backdoor. In her campaign at Pipe, which includes winning the Final in late 2020 of the relocated Maui Comp and her QF win against Malia Manuel, she is yet to go left. Six heats at Pipe, two of them totally without pressure of elimination, and she is yet to go left. Wright claimed after her QF win over Manuel which consisted of two rides, a 0.6 and a 5.17, that all these Pipe heats were “data for my brain”, but it's hard to see how much data could be processed at Pipe if she hasn't gone left yet.
Question for Team Wright: Will there ever be a better opportunity to get reps then successive walk-through heats at small, user-friendly Pipe? And, what's the game plan for the next swell out of the W/NW when lefts predominate?
Wright complained loudly in the Sydney Morning Herald that it was a “sausage-fest” out at Pipe and almost impossible to get reps in to practice, yet has now squandered an unrepeatable opportunity to get those reps in during competition, minus the pressure of competing.
Tyler disappearing right (Bielmann/WSL)
The “hard” problem of reps and practice for the Women, which I term the apprenticeship issue was dealt with by Pipe charge Keala Kennelly in the booth.
KK revealed she had agitated for lawmakers to change permitting requirements so women's events were included in permits, but that failed to address inadequacies at the QS level. There's no doubt any increase in women's participation at QS level comps at Pipe would vastly increase the learning curve for women surfing Pipe, and reduce the apprenticeship factor of participants at the elite-level World Tour not having Pipe-ready skill sets.
So they whittled it down to four surfers. The question of how the women can deal with proper Pipe has yet to be asked and the Woz now needs to think hard about whether they will put the rubber on the road, with another solid Pipe swell incoming. They could squib it, write the narrative, hide behind a million historic headlines but the attention economy's brutal judgements will not be avoided.
// STEVE SHEARER
Comments
I tend not to look too deep into things.
They have been asked to surf pipe/ backdoor.
They have with great effort.
Good for them !
"Which means you can't escape the “huh?” moment when a pocket ride yesterday on an 8 foot wave was scored a 3 and a pocket ride today on a 4 foot wave got a mid-5."
By this logic, on a day of 1-2 foot slop, no one should ever get higher than a 2. Of course they're going to adjust the scoring when the conditions are different.
I think the logic of scoring Pipe is slightly more stable.
Get tubed and come out is close to the sum total of it, with rare exceptions.
"Carissa's dominant heat created a ballast of belief around which a brace of hot performances eventuated.". Niiiiice!! And very true. It lifted the whole energy amongst the women. Was fun to watch.
Lakey's buzzer beater and her other tubes were also quite spectacular i thought.
I heard Isabella Nichols in local ABC radio the other week talking about surfing South Straddie as prep for Pipe. Looking at some of her drops & pits today at Backdoor it seems to have paid off.
That's cool insight. When Straddie holds size you need to take off deep or you miss the pit. Was a lot of that in the contest and it was noticeable who had cracked the code, they stood out.
There’s no amount of Wozzle comps will provide enough pipe lineup time to grant experience to an entire crop of women surfers. The girls need to take matters into their own hands and regulate the lineup in their favour. They need to form a loose club to bully chicks onto the best sets until their talent no longer needs the threat of violence to control the peak.
It’s been done before by the Wolf Pac and it could be similarly done by a like minded bunch of hard bitten women.
The only question remaining is what to call this group of anti social female wolves as they take the lineup from an emasculated lineup of male surfers?
Pussy power pack?
I was thinking Bitch Pak was the obvious one.
Female wolves etc
,
Great wrap. For all the bullshit KK was spouting about clearing the lineup so women can practise and learning on the job…. The girls actually have an advantage in that no one has much experience out there. So Molly Picklum or Isabella Nichols are going up against veteran CT surfers who have no wave knowledge out there.
Contrast that with the men, and the rookies have had similarly zero experience but are expected to step up against competitors with years of Pipe experience.
Anyway, hope it pumps for the final and shame Malia didn’t get through cos it was obvious that she wanted the nugs.
I really struggled with the idea that KK was suggesting the line up needs to be cleared so women can compete. The other commentators were like yes yes yes yes. Does anyone on the north shore really want more days where pipe is closed to everyday surfers. I’m all for taking a limited number of comp permits and dividing them between male and female events but that has to mean less mens.
Slightly off topic but I really struggle to understand the smaller number of women on tour. I’d like to see the same number of men and women on the CT - perhaps the number should be slightly higher than the women and slightly less than the mens.
The WSL will have to take the hand break off and throw caution to the winds in the finals and give the girls a bit of slack and let them have the chance to take on real pipe, how else will they progress...im sure that some will rise and some wont but it all comes down to experience ...let em loose and see what happens .....also pipes not the only place to get experience in heavy reef waves and if they think pipes scary at 4-5ft wait till Chopes comes up.....go get the experience else where if you have to .
Totally agree, there's lots of other waves with a similarly heavy drop, where the women could practice getting "their reps in". When it comes down to mentality, a willingness to charge despite the fear. It's at waves of consequence where a lack of good technique, strength and guts-iness are really exposed. At the risk of sounding like a bigot, I think testosterone amounts and male-bravado culture might have alot to do with it.
Great wrap up and very enjoyable reading. A great quote from Noel Pearson. ;)
I really enjoy the way this guy writes, tells the world how it is with no over hyped gloss
or straight out lies. Just wonder how long he will last before the Me2 and other female rights
movements shut him down and want his nuts on a platter. Keep it up sometimes the truth hurts.
Evo, you’re normally a pretty straight up poster but I find this post a little hyperbolic.
Nothing in here or the other articles seems remotely worthy of the attention of the metoo brigade.
Sometimes we can build up things we don’t understand well into ‘boogeymen’ levels. I really don’t think there’s an army of militant women out there policing ‘truth in surf reporting’ articles.
Maybe I’m naive.
Heard Fr mentor was a guy who went by the moniker of 'The Outsider' and then at another site a bloke called Longtom took him under his wing and showed him the ropes........
Steve’s been around forever, his writing chops never in doubt. I and many others contributed on that other website to send Steve over to Chopes to report on a contest one year. Nick Carroll started it.
Yeah, I think his mentor, the outsider, was himself. None other. I recall longtom too.
Is that other website even going still?
BF yes i was just fishing
This Nick Carroll batfink?
Cheers Giovanni and simba, you were way ahead of me, as usual.
But yes, Nick Carroll made the suggestion on that other website to throw some dollars to Steve to go to Chopes, and a whole bunch dropped in.
What he’s done before, or since, I have no comment on.
I remember Nick saying the surf in indo in August is usually flat due to too much ice in Antarctica.
I said, "were did you hear this theory?" He said "its not a theory its scientific fact".
That was wrong, surfed 6-8 foot supersuck in august..that doesnt happen very often.
He also claimed i surfed with my backfoot arched on the rail in the tube as i was scared of having a comitted stance and scared of the barrel.
Do i look scared in this one foot barrel?
I enjoyed what I saw...girls will only get better.
Lol what an on message write up. Truth is, for the first couple of hours, u til it dropped, it was embarrassing. No good waves caught, shoulder hopping, head dips. This is the best of the best. Excuse is they don’t get enough time out there. Laughable, plenty of heavy lefts around the globe to practice on.
Interesting and granular look at Tyler Wright’s Pipe competitive experience thus far. She either can’t pig-dog 6ft lefts (unlikely) or someone in her camp thinks Backdoor offers more scoring possibilities for her.
I find Tyler’s vibe in the presser’s kinda like Kelly’s. She seems to be working from an ironic and distant ‘anywhere but here’ place sometimes. Maybe she just hates the camera in her face?
Her post heat interview was embarrassing
.never looked at a left all heat and only took a small right ,smaller tube followed by 2 turns ,way over scored.at least Malia has a dig
Tyler says more waves I catch I’m getting better at pipe
Think she means backdoor cause she sure ain’t looking to go left
Local girl should wallop her in semi
Tyler's Pipe record is phenomenal.......totally unprecedented in world sport.
She admitted after she won the Finals in the relocated Maui Pro that she had barely surfed it leading up to it, and has made similar claims this year.
She's won $90,000 USD from her Pipe performances so far, and is yet to catch a left.
It's an unbelievable record.
HOLY F$&@!
Again a few of the girls were good, most were not. Carissa and Moana looked great. Not much else to see here.
Some of the styles / approaches to the barrel are pretty awful, with the above exceptions.
I don't understand the lack of willingness to go backhand for some of them? Its easier to drop in late under the lip and set the rail than forehand..!
But it's not easier to keep your body torqued and centre of gravity really low for the duration of a barrel ride compared to frontside.
At least not if you've never done it enough to get it dialled,and in heavier waves it would make things more intimidating.
We know every single guy on tour for a long time now has it wired,some more than others of course,but that's not the case for the women yet.
Even Steph,after 7 world titles,has basically admitted backside tuberiding is the weakest part of her game.
Every guy on tour and every decent surfer at every beach in Australia has worked out how to grab rail and pull in backhand, it’s kind of surfing 101 these days.
Surfers back in the 70s and 80s were doing weird laybacks and other shenanigans to get barrelled backhand, but guys like slater and the irons really showed that it’s actually an advantage at heaving reefs - you get more body on the wave and have more control.
Burzum 100% agree, some of the chicks and their 'style' were downright horrible to watch, they just looked so awkward out there. Was a damn shame Steph couldn't compete as her style is far superior to most of the chicks on tour. Carissa is just a level above the rest though - she's bigger, faster, stronger and more confident. Pretty easy to see that she should take this event out all going well.
Are the girls going to G-Land ?
Cant go right there !
Sama sama at chopes
If they hold the girls comp in anything over 4 foot at chopes there will be nowhere to hide.
Look how exposed Toledo(0.0) has been over there. Not to mention previous iterations of the womens comp at that spot.
And the next Olympics is going to be held there?
before u should climb back into your hole dinosaur, quiet a few of the girls charge chopes, and so vahine wins the comp at any size, quiet a deserved winner..BTW there are probably quiet a few guys who don't want to surf heaving chopes either
yeah, but not the girls on tour eh? And thats what we are talking about. There are totally girls that charge big heavy waves. But they won't be in a CT event will they, exceptions as noted above (Carrissa, et al).
One can only hope a local gets a wild card and shows the tour girls how its done.
And before you accuse me of being a dinosaur, the point is, these are paid athletes that have been exposed to these waves over a long period of time now and have chosen not to improve their skill set. Not being a dinosaur, just pointing out the obvious?
How many are better than Keala Kennelly and Rochelle Ballard were in these type of waves more than 10 years ago? And again, talking about tour surfers, not specialists / locals.
Check out Rochelles form in waves of consequence:
I don't think I've seen any of the current crop in waves like those.
Don't worry @benjisbabe. I can guarantee you that 99.99% of the blokes writing the girls off would be absolute pussies in any sort of waves of consequence. Happy to be proven wrong :)
Anyway, here's Vahine on a nugget that neither myself or most surfers will ever get to experience. And for what it's worth, she missed out on the tour by one measly heat last year, in junky, inconsistent Haleiwa. Same as Bronte MacCauley. The neanderthals, (or common apes), can't quite put two and two together that progression is happening, but it takes time.
Ah dear. What happened?? Where were the girls today? So much credibility lost.
And fuck off with your - yeah but you wouldn’t paddle out bullshit - I’m not a pro and don’t need to/am not paid to. .
They are harping on about equal opportunity, historic day etc. then they get their chance to really step up and show the world they deserve their place at pipe - crickets…
After that disgraceful decision to call it a day after that INSANE men's final, the less said about the women's event the better far as I'm concerned.
Embarrassing.
If Medina isn’t on the inside I reckon he’ll still try and go right.
Angler extraordinaire!!!!!!
Lakey peak at size would be perfect practice but it’s as much a shambles crowd wise as pipe
Loved watching the girls , thought the level of surfing was really good and much better than their first day
When Lakey gets serious, the crowd thins. 1/5th of the crowd. Good option though
Bingo!
There's a perfect spot named after a part of the female anatomy that I can think of which would be perfect pipe training...has been used so in the past by locals on the tour
Dammit Qokka, you beat me to it.
I was hoping they'd rename the G-Land womens comp the G-Spot.
:)
In that case Luke Egan would have been giving it a stiff rub back in '97
I thought it was good to watch. The women's approach to Pipe would be far more relatable to the average recreational surfer than the men's approach. Throw your average Joe Blow out on day 3 and watch them turbo paddle for the horizon.
Perhaps it's best not to get too caught up in the gender hand wringing and just enjoy the fact that they are having a dig. Who is the target audience anyway? Middle aged men who like to be critical or a whole legion of young female surfers who will grow along with their heroes.
I think the WSL commentary is right in that the performance will continue to evolve over the next few years. The sport has been slowly evolving and it wasn't that long ago that the women were sent out to surf horrible conditions during competition, or alternative venues with inferior waves.
Let's just watch and see where it all ends up....and if doesn't excite then you can always tune out.
But they are not average punters, they are the best of the best and it was embarrassing. Stop making excuses and call it how it actually was, otherwise progress won’t happen.
Sorry to get off topic but I just wanted to say that 'Spatchcock' is an awesome user name!
Made me laugh anyway.
And delicious too!
Overpriced and underwhelming from my experience Zen. Like eating a willywagtail.
De-boned, butterflied, marinated and grilled over charcoal. Lightly salted and crisp up the skin.
Deliciously underwhelming.
I agree. I'd love to see a Moana vs Carissa final in pumping conditions. I reckon both would be able to mix it at big Pipe.
I actually just went back at looked at some replays of the 70s-90s mens comps in similar conditions. One thing is to remember - there's literally DECADES of history/experience underpinning dude's comps here. The other is - we'd laugh at what they did at 4ft pipe in the 80s and call them a bunch of barrel dodgers with shocking style, but they were the best of the best then. I trust women's surfing to progress because we can already see how good the leaders are.
I think the article makes a great point about the impossibility of not comparing these days of competition to the men's running in all-time conditions, and that really the WSL needs to front up and give the women's finals a great day to show what they can do.
Owen's injury at Pipe and the trauma that followed might be playing heavily on Tyler. If so, fair enough. Probably best to admit it though...
It would have made a much better PR narrative. Whinging that females don't get enough opportunity at Pipe , then having the entire break to yourself and going Backdoor every single wave makes her downright entitled and completely unlikeable.
That's a good call re Lakey Peak , I remember surfing it at low tide many years ago with an Hawaiian and his words still ring in my ears " Man , this place is like backdoor at low tide ! ' and Steve , how come no mention of Jet Ski Assist ? . the old equal pay for equal play doesn't really stack up when the women get the Skis back out and the blokes have to paddle it ..... ??
Helmets everywhere today. Not a bad idea for everyone and anyone. Surprised no one is giving the soft helmet (like Tom Carrol wares fouling) a try. Has to feel a little more natural and comfortable - more like a winter hood.
That makes me think they will run the Women on a different day to the Men for the Finals.
Unless they will have jetski assist for women and not for men?
The paddle back out is part of the actual sport of surfing Pipe.
…not on the QLD points anymore when the size it up. Step offs and lifts out are done a dozen
Give the last 4 chicks remaining a proper 6ft plus day FFS! They only need a 2 hour window to finish it so there's plenty of opportunity if the forecast's right.
If they don't then the whole exercise has been a waste of time and an admission that they aren't up to 'proper' Pipe.
Last sentence hard to disagree ringmaster. There has to be a middle ground. No one expects the women to run in macking conditions like day 3 for the mens. Let’s hope with time and experience that is the case. However today didn’t do anyone justice. They are suppose to be paid professionals. The finals should be run in solid (6ft) waves otherwise it could be any other barreling break. Takes away from the whole pipe history and ideology of the competition otherwise.
There’s no alternative ringo, Hawaii Friday and Saturday are forecast 6’ +, they’re not going to run the men and then say “ we’re waiting for a smaller day for the women”.
My guess is women out first thing tomorrow. Only question is whether it will be 6’ + early or a bit on the quiet side on a building swell. Also hoping they get some proper Pipe.
Words officially eaten! What a clusterf*ck.
well said, totally agree, surely no excuses now.
If the females and the commentary team didnt push the poor trodden down female banner
and pump them up so hard I could probably stomach the average surfing at Pipe by the girls
a little longer,to be honest I just watch Pipe to see how good it is. I cant watch them for very.
long they do my head in. Tyler Wright to me shes just a sour old queer.
I could have done without the homophobic insult. You can think what you like about her, but her sexual preference has nothing to do with it.
Here here.
Well said dylred, no need for that BS
I actually find Tyler’s frankness pretty refreshing. She seems to say what she is thinking and pretty directly and honestly. Not a lot of that going around.
May I just add,
If she can refine her smoothness verbalising her thoughts when a camera, microphone, post heat reflection are forced upon her while dripping wet. Look out.
Public speaking be a breeze.
Good write up FR. Must be my age, most reporting, reviewing and commentary these days on anything we watch on screens, or live in an interview is always powder coated bullshit. What’s going on? Why can’t anyone tell the truth anymore ? Get very tired of the ‘acceptable dribble’ oozing out of mouths, on any matter regardless of surfing . Moreover what’s wrong with an honest critique of a situation. I hate the way society has developed (or not developed) these days, it’s like we live in permanent fantasy, we have become so defensive on all levels. Sometimes the truth hurts, but as we all know ‘the truth will set you free’. It was not a good look for us or them (WSL).
Nice write up Steve, and good pick up about Tyler not going left. It’s a strange tactic for sure, perfect time for her to get reps in.
Carissa has the best backside pigdog style, imo. She gets low and drags her bum like the better of the men. Haven’t seen too many other women who have shown that.
Will be interesting to see what happens. Bummed to see Johanne lose on a last 10 seconds wave from Lakey. Wasn’t really a tactical error, she had to go but chose the wrong wave.
Carissa has really lifted the level, almost single-handedly.
Learnt to do airs then executed in competition (Newcastle), now learned to backside tube-ride and prepared to do in comps.
And although I didn't mention in wrap, you do have to pay Sally Fitz who is also prepared to go left and pull in.
Yeah, disappointed Sally didn’t get through. I think she would have a dig in bigger Pipe. Can’t say that about many.
I could be wrong though
I thought the women ripped,.
On the scoring scale, you only have to go back 3-4 years and every cover up by the blokes got scored a 5 at pipe or back door too, and 9s were given for every wave where someone got spit out.
Plenty of comments on here remind me of the first season of AFLW, when every overweight, middle aged bloke, 12 beers down at the pub was all too keen to shit-can the girls for playing footy. Granted, the skills weren't up to the standard of the men's game, most players hadn't had the opportunity to play at that level, but what these old fellas couldn't get through their thick heads was that it's about the long game. It's about representation. A women's event at pipe sets a new benchmark, it'll push younger surfers coming up to achieve a higher level of performance in heavier water.
As you mention freeride "You'd think every wide-eyed grom girl would have written in capitals Carissa's simple summation in her post-heat presser: “Pipe is the place where you want to surf and prove yourself”. That'll stick in the minds of Girls worldwide.
No doubt the attention economy is a big deal but fuck me, women have been playing second fiddle in every sporting code since way back when. Not having the same publicity, sponsorship or audience is not new, the doco 'Girls can't surf' is a good reminder of that fact. But an event at surfing's Mecca can, and will grow the sport.
And yes, it doesn't help when commentators try and bullshit the viewers into thinking the conditions or level of surfing is something that it isn't, the majority of viewers can see straight through the hyperbole.
The quality of women's surfing at pipe will improve, just like the standard of AFLW has gone through the roof since it's inauguration. Give it time and support.
Hard to argue with that post..
Just as an aside, maybe Toledo could surf in the women’s Pipe event from now on?
Ouch.
Swellnet really needs an 'upvote' button for the comments section.
I've been enjoying the womens Ashes. Watched the last 20 overs last night and Darcie Brown is awesome, 18yo, pushing 120 kph, great control and doing it all with a smile on her face.
Agree, can watch women's cricket but AFLW...give me curling any day
Curling’s actually sick to watch a bit of. It’s like darts, love watching that every now and then too
Curling is such a technical sport, farkin amazing how good they are at it, and the crazy sliding shit they do. Felt for the Aussies getting torn a new one by the Czechs last night...bunch of fuckin robots
Haha I’ll watch it over a few beers this weekend
Women’s Ashes has been outstanding. Been watching it along with Ash Barty & women at Pipe with my 12yo daughter & wife.
All played in great spirit without the carryon a lot of blokes sport does.
Yeah, nah.
Plenty of women charge. If the girls getting paid top dollar to surf haven’t prioritised proper surfing then they’ve got no one to blame but themselves.
We aren’t expecting them to surf 30 feet Jaws but surely 8 foot pipe is well within the realms of expectation for crew on hundreds of thousands of dollars per year ?
I vacillate on this issue between giving young girls a chance and demanding better of professional athletes. Today I remembered going to G Land over a decade ago. There was only about 12 crew there in all the camps ( early, early season) , amongst them was Silvana Lima. No photographer , just charging for the love of it and when it got big she did charge.
Was she there as a surfing purist chasing big tubes or was she there as a professional athlete looking to expand and consolidate her professional skill set? It doesn’t matter. She was there putting in the effort.
Should we lower the bar to accomodate those who haven’t put in the work to attain the highest level of professionalism or who are not accomplished enough as surfers in the first place?
No!
Fuck that….this is professional sport, not a giggling pleasure cruise. The price of every piece of surf related hardware and software is increased to pay the large salaries of these sportspersons. Let them earn their keep!
If the girls don’t want to paddle out then it’s up to them. Let the market decide their worth if this occurs.
Fuckin aye Blowdog
I turn down the volume and turn on my music...so much more enjoyable
AFLW has been around for 3 or so years, Women's competition surfing has been around for about 60 or 70 years.
Exactly Carmo-dee
Interesting you mention Silva Lima Blowin, I think she was also first in the ladies to pop an air in a comp?
https://m.
She’s an excellent surfer. Very tiny in the flesh.
She looks like someone shrunk one of the hardcore warriors from Apocolypto and taught them to fucken rip. I dig watching her surf and always want her to win.
Pocket superhero.
sick air. I'd argue better than Carissa's air at Newcastle last year.
yeah agree Silva has a sick set of ovaries alright....love watching her surf also
I think Pipe puts holes in professional surfing. Best surfers in the world? Not the best surfers at Pipe. There are some women who surf proper pipe well, look at Da Hui Backdoor shootout. I think if Bethany had been given a chance to surf a solid swell she would have shone. Instead forced to go backdoor, reverse arm pig dog stance mind you. A few less than stellar performances on the mens side too.
I watched a few hours of the comp and was a bit underwhelmed . But I've gotta say after seeing the photo's above put the surf into perspective, the shots of Moana and Molly show a far more critical view. It's as if we get numb to seeing big Pipe and actually forget how challenging the place really is.
'She looks like someone shrunk one of the hardcore warriors from Apocolypto'. With smooth talking like that, blowie, don't be surprised if Silvana wants your number.
That’s a compliment!
I think a lot of the commentary here is reflective of the issue with surfing. Alpha ape on the peak trying to dominate the other chimps. Staring at the chimpettes because it is basically weird to see one in the typical surf line up. The average session would be so much more enjoyable if everyone was out there enjoying the vibes and dropping the competition.
The above fact is also relevant as the pool of women surfers from which the pros are selected is very much shallower than men because so few women actually surf, which is thankfully changing.
We all accept that there are sex differences when it comes to strength and endurance. Ash Barty is going to get towelled by Rafa Nadal every day but we will still enjoy watching her final.
The power of plus size pipe must be phenomenal. I’m guessing there is not a soul on this thread who would actually take a bomb on if given the opportunity. 95% of fit young Australian male surfers wouldn’t even consider it I don’t think. Maybe 99%.
As the father of 3 daughters and 1 son I’m all for bigging up the efforts of the women getting out there. I’ve seen a lot of big talkers on various indo trips suddenly succumb to mysterious injuries as soon as the swell picks up. I’m seeing women take it on but maybe they fear the consequences of huge pipe. Maybe they are stretched on backhand barrels and their inner self is sensibly advising them to go right. Maybe they know if they go left they are going to drift into the lip line and get guillotined into the reef. Probably better to go right than to be dragged up the beach with your head flopping around and end your surfing career on tv.
Men and women are wired differently which is an evolutionary phenomenon. This is particularly the case with risk appetite.
So until all the nay sayers get a better tube out there with documentary evidence give credit where it is due. These are the best women surfers that we have and they are trying their best. They aren’t as good as the men - big deal - but we can still enjoy them going waves which are still probably heavier and better than the rest of us are going.
Pretty sure no commenters here have indicated they would paddle out and take off on macking pipe waves if given the opportunity.
The general vibe is that the women (as professional surfers) should put in the time and effort as well as get out of their comfort zone and expose themselves to those sort of waves to become better equipped to surf them.
But yeah........you spin it your way mate.
Pretty sure the insinuation in a lot of these comments is that the women pros are not worth their status/worth watching because they don’t surf large pipe to warm up for this comp (noting the clear challenges facing them even if they wanted to). I think that attitude is disrespectful, old fashioned and not helpful to the ultimate goal of more women participating in male dominated sports like surfing.
Great name for a band- 'Alpha Ape and the Chimpettes'.
"Maybe they are stretched on backhand barrels" - there is absolutely no excuse at all for that for the Men or Women.
I think people forget these are professional surfers. ALL they do is surf surf surf.
Yeah back hand tube riding is tricky for the average punter but they aren't pro's.
There is seriously no excuse, especially for the top dogs like Tyler Wright and Steph Gilmore, they could easily go to Cloudbreak for extended periods of time and work on it
For what it's worth, I agree with most of the comments regarding men vs women in big challenging surf. Seems we are all on about the same thing - that big macho men are braver/ crazier than women when it comes to doing death defying acts- not anything new really!!
Here's a different perspective that hopefully many of you are already onto - we just need to wake the WSL to it:
Men aren't attracted to and don't do the same things as Women. Women don't want to be men! Thank god for that!!! Otherwise we would all be the same.
So maybe the WSL need to figure out what makes women happy (ie buy more product) and what makes men happy (ie buy more product). It's not the same thing for both camps.
Men seem to think the bravado stuff like catching mega waves and fighting in an octagon gets out juices flowing, but women (look at the marketing of any company chasing the dollar of the female majority) seem to favor the softer side. They aren't interested in mortal combat, seeing fights to the death in an octagon, people risking their lives to ride a wave etc.
Maybe the WSL need to take a good look inwards.
Maybe Women events should be on waves that represent what women are looking for in the sport of surfing? It doesn't have to be throwing yourself over a 15 foot pipeline ledge. It doesn't have to be tackling heaving Teahupoo! It doesn't have to be fighting another human in the ring!
Maybe it's riding a mellow Waikiki wave, or Bells, or restaurants? I don't know! I'm not saying I know what they want, but if the WSL marketing department don't know what their audience want, then they sure are on the wrong track.
I think men and women surfing are very different. The reason any of us surf is because it makes us feel good.
And what makes men feel good is very different to what makes women feel good.
So the powers that be need to work out (by asking the audience a few questions) what excites them, then deliver that to the masses!!!
For blokes its easy - crazy people taking off on waves we would not dare to ride, and pulling off the impossible!
Simple stuff really.
But what do Women want? there lies the million dollar question...
Troppo im pretty sure the women wanted to be treated the same as the men, same waves same money same respect so its what they wanted ..........lets see how it goes down.
Looks like 4 solid days coming up on the forecast, with only 10 heats to run. Maybe the wsl could take the opportunity to give the girls some more time out there, without the constraints of competition. An expression session. Give them 2 hours or something with the line-up cleared. They can take a coach or local expert out to show them where to sit, which ones to go etc.
If they finish the girls tomorrow, and the mens on sunday (sat HI time), they could easily fit it in either after the final tomorrow, or some time sunday. They don't have to broadcast it, just put the event on hold. Tomorrows forecast is 6'+ , sunday (sat in Hawaii) is 8'+.
I reckon there would be a tonne of pissed off locals if they did that. Not everyone loves contests
Yep of course.
Slightly off topic, but if they cut CT numbers by 4 (men), there would be 32 surfers. Cut 16 heats from the draw, there's a whole day less competition right there.
I'm gonna say it.
And I reckon It's born out of jealousy but I reckon quite a few blokes out there want to see someone like Tyler, who makes more money in a couple of days of competition than many of us make working our arses off in a year, get pile driven into the reef.
I think they see it from an unequal standpoint- i.e. you wanna get paid, then you must be prepared to bring a little skin into the game.
I'd like to see Strider pile driven into the reef preferably mid sentence shit dribbling with the mike still in his hand.
Ha ha- me too.
He could take Chris Cote with him as an added bonus.
Would you leave your kids alone with Chris Cote?
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I don’t quite get the hate for the commentators. I see it mostly as white noise, just something to fill the space. Then those same people will argue someone else is great, and, and, I just don’t see it.
And what’s wrong with Rosie. Blimey, they’re going to have to spin the corporate line, whoever they put in. Rosie is ok for mine.
Put on ex-pro surfers and see if they can’t illuminate us.
Chris Cote’s problem is that he looks like he never learnt to swim. I get that, but he makes noise. Seems to be what he’s paid for.
Just saying, don’t mind others having their opinion but wonder what everyone is looking for.
Here's why I don't like the commentary:
1/ They just don't stop talking. I don't feel like I need to always be told what I can plainly see in front of me. Just the sound of the crowd and the waves would be nice some times.
2/ They speak almost entirely in cliches, which grates after a while. Swellnet's WSL commentary bingo hit the nail on the head.
3/ The interviews are pointless. They can't seem to ask any questions any more probing than "how do you feel?"
4/ They are too positive and full of hyperbole. It's just relentless.
5/ Their "expert" analysis is dumbed down. When occasionally they get someone in who actually has something informed and intelligent to say (Like Kelly Slater for example) you really see how inane their day to day commentary is.
I guess there's people out there who enjoy that sort of thing, but I'm not one of them. I'll just put it on mute.
I want Martin 'best human on the planet' Potter back.
Seriously........does anyone know the real story behind why he's no longer part of the commentary team? Really bizarre.......he just disappeared suddenly and never so much as heard his name mentioned by the other commentators since.
Suss.......
Yeah I liked Pottz too. Probably offended someone, somewhere, for saying something insightful that wasn’t completely anodyne.
There’s a Tim Bonython can’t remember the title ‘very big waves’ video from a few years ago, where they were looking at Chopes on a code red day. The pros were all there and not having a bar of it. Local heroes were out taking it on, scary as all get out. Pottz called what he saw, and just nailed it, visceral fear and respect for those who went, just calling it as ‘next level’.
I liked Pottz.
I like Rosie. No hate for any commentators. I don't even mind Turpel- he's good at what he does. Ross Williams is great behind the mic.
I think it's Chris Cote's voice- like fingenails down a blackboard to me.
Edit: Me too regards Pottz- It's like he's just been disappeared, Chinese style. Has anybody done a welfare check?
Bloody oath. I enjoyed Pottz. Didn't beat around the bush. Had alot of experience. Nailed it with Cote's voice Zen. Lacks authenticity. Probably a nice bloke but him and Kaipo make me feel like vomiting when they speak.
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surf check
Wow, holding out for the bigger day. The women will get their test. Should be unreal
Weekend viewership has played a role in this decision
Of course, mad if they didn't.
My problem with Cote is not the nails on chalkboard nasal voice but the way he gets so caught up in sycophancy he forgets to call the action.
Surely that is the one thing that commentators have to do?
I can’t stand the way they go to ads when their are lines piling up in the background, or they have an interview and can’t cut to the action while someone’s getting pitted off their nut. They don’t even have to stop the interview, just cut to the action.
The production is woeful on that score.
The trouble is all the days they push through heats on sub par days just because it’s a Sunday.
100%
Beth charges Mexico at 1.20min mark -
Given the girls have a lower power to weight ratio (not just less strength and mass) what's a fair judgement?
ive got so much respect for Bethany and often think if she had two arms that im sure she would have been a world champ years ago......having dealt with a shoulder injury myself years ago i tried doing what she does with the one arm paddle, well i couldn't do it ,too hard so got into lid riding for 18 months or so just to stay in contact with the ocean.......blows me away how much courage and strength she has in dealing with it ,shame she isn't in the mix at pipe and a bad move by JMD to run the womens in crap waves early when there was no need too ....
wsl forecast
https://www.worldsurfleague.com/posts/495503/forecast-xl-swell-inbound-f...
Ah so the period has increased in the forecast for Saturday now? that's great! Hopefully thats for all day and not just late afternoon
Carrisa's Pipe Quiver
Sexy Double Winged Swallow Tail
Best drone footage ever??
haha, watching the beach footage of this wave I was thinking, 'fuck drones are annoying'
The few times they have been buzzing around while I’m in the water I’ve found them so irritating! Like seriously just fuck off!
But how insane is that footage. What a mad man
PoPs Ho the Bro ...64 yrs young..fuckn Unreal Shit Yew !!!!
Regarding Tyler Wright. I've been reading the comments on here with some interest. I think people's personal grievances with the way Tyler conducts herself have given rise to a bit of a bashing by alot of above commenters.
How quickly people forget....
I'm backing her in. She'll work Pipe out pretty quick. Go Tyler you good thing. Go Aussies. YeW!
PoPs Ho beach angle
10/10 Udo, and Mr Ho.