Swellnet and politics

Wealthy and connected maybe exaggerating things but traveling half way across the globe and paying thousands to people smugglers is still something only a percentage of the 65 million refugees in this world would be able to do, especially those from countries with very low average incomes.

If your giving priority to a minority purely because they have more resources than others, the reality is you are being unfair and neglecting the majority of refugees, surely that is not something anyone would want is it?

"You mention people spending 7 years in a camp. Where would that camp be then? not in our region. There is no orderly resettlement program in our region from refugee camp to host country so why are we all persisting with this lie?

No camp no queue."

There is hundreds of refugee camps around the world from official UNHCR run to unofficial, refugee camps are used by people to describe and paint a picture but the reality is most refugees aren't in camps, there just stuck in neighbourhoods around the world, these conditions can be just as bad or worst than refugee camps.

Its kind of irrelevant if they are in a camp or neighbourhood is in our region or elsewhere in the world, location is not an important factor, we don't just resettle refugee from refugee camps, or we don't focus on resulting refugees from our region, actually in recent years we have actually done the opposite and decreased the quota of refugees we take who are in Indonesia, we have done this to discourage refugees from coming to Indonesia.

And you 100% wrong THERE IS an orderly resettlement programs globally run by the UNHCR and governments like ours, that's how we resettle the majority of refugees.

IMHO it's should be the only way we resettle refugees, one system for all, treated equally and fairly, only reason for any priority given should be based on a needs basis.

I mean seriously Guy how ridiculous is it to point fingers at Liberals, this is only an issue because of the medivac scam, Xmas island was only reopened in reaction to counteract the aims of medivac scam.

BTW. it's kind of funny all the hype around reopening of Xmas island, I've even read conspiracy theories that the aim is to reignite boats for some strange reason...but most people diont even realise that it only closed in October last year, until then it had still had over 200 people there.

So I'm lying about the africans that made it to oz am I?

Lying about the fact there's a heap of crew in the middle east and africa who cannot afford to make it to Indonesia and still have money to pay people smugglers?

Really?

Facts matter. There are **no camps in our region** where a refugee may wait in some mythical queue while being afforded proper care. But that is precisely the lie propagated by politicians and others to win cheap political points. I have asked for the camps in our region to be identified and none have been put forward. To deny the LNP don't make political capital out of this issue is to deny reality.

Now I accept there are indeed camps in other parts of the world but what is to happen to the thousands of refugees now living in our region. Force them to travel back to Africa or the Middle East ? Is that what you want?

Medivac scam? Xmas Island reopened for pure reasons? Fuck sake, what about addressing all those plane arrivals scam {{ EDIT - content removed}} that the government doesn't talk about. Why are so many apparent refugees allowed to live and work in our community in numbers that exponentially exceed boat arrivals from years ago?

Confected outrage by the nightwatchman doesn't cut it anymore, Australians are seeing through all this shit, I just can't wait for the May election.

Facts matter indeed.

And everything I've said is factual.

I don't think many people dispute that the libs are desperately trying to make crass political mileage out of this issue.

That doesn't change the facts.

Libs are crass opportunists. And labor fucked up with medevac.

I expect nothing less from the liberals.

It's probably fair to expect a little more from labor. They gambled on a cockamany stunt and got caught out. Sucked in. Should have thought it through better.

I don't give a fuck about the election. I'm talking about refugees and the joke of a system that both sides are gaming to the extreme. This is serving no one. Least of all refugees.

Interestingly, some years ago I listened to a group of political scientists discussing trans global refugee movements - at the time the numbers were then around 35-40 million people. (Now about 65-75 million depending on source base information).

The talking heads agreed/postulated that if the west was to somehow absorb the total load immediately that there would be a doubling of refugee numbers again within two years. The reality is the problem is unlikely to ever go away and climate change, like war, famine and failed states, will inevitably spur on the increasing mass movements of people.

There are no easy answers - only more desperate people seeking better lives. Moreover, for better or worse, the digital reach of the internet has ineluctably also given traditional and less materially developed cultures around the globe a potent glimpse into what is perceived as a decidedly better and easier way of living. There is nothing romantic about a life of subsistence when you live it day in day out.

As an aside, Joanna Lumley, speaking to the ABC's 7.30 report this past week, stated that overpopulation is the world's greatest problem.

@Guy No idea why you keep on banging on about refugee camps in our region.

People don't need to be in refugee camps to be resettled...so it's a stupid argument that there is no camp in the region so they can't be resettled is just complete bollocks.

Ive provided direct links to other avenues to be resettled, not to mention even if your view was true any refugee in our region has moved away from camps at some stage.

There is a few different ways offshore resettlement programs work and one of them is governments like ours actually have quotas they agree to take registered refugees from different countries like Malaysia or Indonesia, although the Indonesian intact is only 450 reduced from 600 in 2014 but thats still like resettling all the guys on Manus every year.

I tried looking back at a few media articles for xmas island and i only found one article with scaremongering of criminal refugees, but these are known previously convicted criminals, so under any other circumstance any type of visa they would be allowed in Australia.

It's probably worse now that USA has gone in and had their pick, and rejected the criminal ones and the trouble makers, i mean even NZ don't want the single males from Manus, basically we are scraping the bottom of the barrel now and what is left is often not all that great in regards to character.

If this issue was what decided the election then id be putting money on the libs, but id say Labor will be voted in more just because libs have done their run as we know its all about cycles, its only when governments are killing it that they stay in power for a long time.

BTW. Blindboy and Guy

Im curious and this is a real question.

You both don't seem to care about an equal level playing field for resettlement of refugees (which like Sypkan does my head in) you seem to favour the idea that those with more resources than others should be able to gain priority.

So would you guys favour taking this one step further and taking the money and control out of the people smugglers hands and instead resettling refuges through an auction type system run by the government where the highest paying refugee bidder gets resettlement?

It has been suggested by various people, if you don't care about being fair or moral, then it has advantages, obviously instead of costing money you can make money, takes the profit away from people smugglers and transfers it too the government.

And the people resettled are likely to either bring skills to the country or business and money/tax rather than be a burden on other services like providing housing or skills and education to refugees while transitioning.

Doesn't sound like the 'playing field' is very equal to me.

https://www.refugeecouncil.org.au/less-one-third-refugees-australias-hum...

@Happy

Too be honest first time I've read such an article and i read a lot of stuff on this topic from many different sources including that website (although they can be misleading cherry picking and clearly have agendas), I've actually read before in articles that family reunion doesn't come under our cap.

But that article is from quite a few years ago, problem is they change all the visas and how they juggle thing all the time.

Not saying its no longer true, really don't know and sucks if it is.

And what sucks more is that this stuff is never talked about, refugee advocates jumping up and down and spending so much time and money on those lucky ones on Manus and Nauru but not on these kinds of issues.

Imagine the positive change the could bring if they highlighted these kind of things, just a crying shame, problem is so much of this crap and even organisations are politically driven.

@Blindboy

And like many times before we are back at the root of the problem, the 70 year old outdated refugee convention.

IMHO it's just such a shame our government lacks balls, when Trump got in Australia and USA could have got together and said to the UN, update the refugee convention or we are cutting our refugee intake ( as we know the USA did cut theres)

But we could have gone further and said update it for this day and age and world, and we will lift our refugee intake substantially.

Im not against raising the intake, but if Dutton raises it we are going to lose this opportunity.

Same with Manus and Nauru, could have been closed down years ago, if we had said the centres are being closed down, pick either PNG, Cambodia or return home.

But instead we having weak politicians giving people choices which make a complete mockery of the system, and a complete mockery of any bogus claims of mistreatment..

So so over out all...

Blindboy is fundamentally right on this matter - whether we like it or not we have a moral obligation to take some responsibility and absorb a fair share of those refugees. We seem to have a penchant for getting drawn into conflicts as vassals for the Yanks and the Middle East has been a total fuck up. Still, infuriating is the intransigent Saudi refusal to accept anyone from their region - totally deplorable.

So I ask again, what should happen to the refugees in countries to our north? Do they get to languish there or should they "go back to where you came from?" or do the countries of the region co-operate with each to constructively resolve the problem?

.... and while the ever ending story continues in the pretext we have strong boarders there is no mention of the daily arrivals of tourists by plane claiming refugee status.

Why do politicians and social media ignore what is happening at our airports right now? Clue: no votes in admitting our boarders are leaking like a sive.

No different to refugees anywhere in the world, many will return home when safe to do so, some will end up continuing life's in different countries, and a small percentage will be resettled.

If you don't know why we allow people to enter through official entry points but do our best to deter people to enter in an uncontrolled manner, by now then i don't think you will ever understand, its quite obvious everyone knows why we have official entry points, with customs, immigration, quarantine.

BTW. I have to admit i was wrong about something, i was looking through the onshore visas last night, and in March 2018 they brought back permanent onshore asylum seeker visa's previously there had only been temporary protection visas since 2012. (in 2012 they scraped permanent protection ones)

IMHO thats sucks, its still giving unfair priority, but i guess that is not the governments main concern, their main concern is ensuring people enter Australia through official entry points.

Anyway that explains the rise in numbers, as i said i don't like it because i believe it creates an unfair playing field.

But I'm not exactly sure why you would have an issue with it? seeing you don't care about equality.

Still no direct answers, must be too hard.

Questions:

Why would our political class and social media experts be so tough on people arriving here by boat years ago now, yet turn a blind eye to people arriving here by plane each and every day (today) on tourist visas and immediately claiming refugee status?

Again, why does the government need to reopen Xmas Island to house refugees from Manus and Nauru for medical treatment citing security reasons yet allows refugee applicants who arrive here by plane to self assess their character / security test allowing these people to live and work in Australia until their claim is ultimately assessed by government agencies (months/years later)?

Our boarders are not secure https://www.theage.com.au/national/worst-ever-immigration-minister-asylu...

Ive given clear answers to your questions.

I think i can speak for many Australians here, people like me don't like boat arrivals because they are basically trying to push in front of others just because they are lucky enough to have the $$$ to do so.

Its the typical mentality seen in developing countries, if the official system is going to take too long and you have the cash, then you can bypass everyone else and pay your way to get want you want. (yes i admit I've done this in Indonesia but try not too, because it sucks for everyone else)

What really pisses people off including me about those on Manus and Nauru is the ungratefulness, we take them in feed them, house them spend huge amounts of money on them and try to find resettlement options for them and instead of being thank full we get the exact opposite..

Then to make things worse they will do and say anything to get here, allegations of all kinds of crap, hunger strikes, even sewing lips together, but to be fair a large part of the problem is refugee advocates who encourage these things.

It was no different when they were housed in Australia, remember when they rioted and nearly burnt the centre down, remember the hunger strikes and sewing lips together?....Australians don't like to be played.

Christmas Island wasn't opened for security reasons it was reopened as a clear counter act to make the media vac scam close pointless.

I was trying to find an article i read yesterday but couldn't find it but my google search found Scomo's tewiiter account that said this

"Today I inspected the facilities on Christmas Island to ensure they were ready to go. This is deterrent to people smugglers and to anyone who thinks they can game the system to get to Australia."

Guy, I think you are honestly just trolling me if you think our borders are not secure because of more plane arrivals or visa applications, FFS dude get real border security is about Customs, Migration, Quarantine.

People still pass through all these things, we are one of strictest countries in the world for all these aspects, if you can't understand this then this whole conversation is pointless, you are either trolling or just playing dumb.

.... so everything you said just above must also apply to touri$t$ arriving here by plane and immediately claiming refugee status?

.... so why not the political and public outcry to those ca$hed up touri$t$ enjoying onboard movies and airline food before arrival at Melbourne or Sydney airports?

Those arriving by plane don't have to get their hands dirty in some detention centre, they walk out of immigration and into public life and work, isn't that the ultimate in queue jumping? So where's the outrage?

There is but most just fall into the "we hate all refugees category" or "we hate muslims blah blah blah"

To be honest the last few years to me it wasn't so much of an issue because they were only on able to get temporary protection Visas and had to return home when safe to do so, to me thats a fair system, its a good compromise.

But i think it really really sucks that they have gone back to giving permanent asylum seeker visa's, Id love to know the reasons why?

Yeah for sure the government does influence people, yes they niggle the public on their view on boat arrivals, because the government doesn't want boat arrivals, border entry breaches of any kind refugee or not is a serious issue, and the whole avenue is a can of worms ready to be opened up, so i get why both governments want to nip it in the budd before the problem becomes more than just about refugees.

On the flips side the government don't bring up plane arrivals because the government doesn't really have an issue with plane arrivals, because they pass through official entry points.

"Our borders are not secure"

Geez guysmiley you've gone full circle. Now you're sounding like dutton morrison and co. but picking on, and scaremongering, about a different bunch of people. You're also sounding a bit like your desperately trying to change the focus of the current conversation, as does the article. Good luck with that, seriously, it'd be much more worthwhile, as the article does raise some good points

"...Why would our political class and social media experts be so tough on people arriving here by boat years ago now, yet turn a blind eye to people arriving here by plane each and every day (today) on tourist visas and immediately claiming refugee status?"

For cheap political votes there's no doubt about that. There's no surprise about that either, yet you seem flabbergasted?

Do you wish to close this opportunity for claiming refugee status?

I would have thought you're alright with it as an avenue, considering your past posts regarding refugees.

Personally I think it's a scam and would stop it tommorrow.

"...Again, why does the government need to reopen Xmas Island to house refugees from Manus and Nauru for medical treatment citing security reasons yet allows refugee applicants who arrive here by plane to self assess their character / security test allowing these people to live and work in Australia until their claim is ultimately assessed by government agencies (months/years later)?

They're clearly opening Christmas island purely to stop the people on Manus and narau making it to oz. This is a direct reaction to labors sneak em in the backdoor endeavour. You know that.

As to the second part - passports, airports, immigration, applications, visas - process!

"Our borders are not secure"

Yep, it's taken you a long time to come around (smiley face)

I doubt anyone will watch this especially seeing it's an X Howard immigration minister and a Sky News vid, hence why i didn't share it the other week, but it mirrors much of what I've been saying for years and much of recent conversation, IMHO probably one of the best interviews I've seen on the issue that totally avoids the clichés like drownings at sea etc

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6003092024001?fbclid=IwAR1RHCNOK34vV...

There is no outrage or commentary from the LNP about people claiming refugee status after stepping off a plane nor is it the subject front page news. Why? because there are no votes in it, far better to demonise people who come by boat, historically there has been votes in that cunning political stunt.

My referencing people arriving by plane and claiming refugee status is solely to highlight the stunning hypocrisy of our migration policy and how it is most definitely used for political purposes by the LNP and especially around elections.

Wrap it anyway you like its still a shit sandwich.

Guy your honestly not trolling????

You really don't get the difference between people passing through customs/immigration/quarantine with passports and why the government (any government) has concern about people trying to enter Australia in any manner they feel fit (and all the other criminal elements that would develop if this avenue was allowed), but not concerned about people passing through official entry points on visas they have approved with passports.

Reality is government doesn't have any issue with the refugees themselves I'm sure they would have no issues with the same people going through other avenues for protection or resettlement ,although that said you could probably expect many to be rejected.

Yes political parties use situations to get votes or support, and sure they often dumb down issues to get public support like the saving people from drowning BS.

But end of the day it's not the reason why both Liberal and Labor have similar policy on the issue, even if the Greens magically got to power they would have to deal with the issue, sure they would try all new things, but end of the day they would have to come back to what works and to protect our borders.

"Reality is government doesn't have any issue with the refugees themselves."

Oh come on now. You can't spend this long on the issue and type a statement like that in sincerity.

Refugees aren't people, not since Howard and Tampa. Refugees are stepping stones to power, they provide political expedience, they're easy to demonise and they can't talk back.

If everything were equal, more money would be thrown at plane arrivals because of the sheer number of them, and passport or not, the status of each claimee has to be assessed. But the government throws an inordinate amount of cash at boat arrivals, and it does so very willingly because each spend is an opportunity to grandstand its priority of keeping Australians safe.

Feels like Australia is finally waking up to this cheap and nasty ploy.

No offence but FFS are you people really this stupid???

You don't understand why the government, any government has a huge concern and issue with people trying to enter Australia willy nilly, but doesn't have an issue with people passing migration, quarantine, customs with passports.

If the government had an issues with refugees, then why on earth does Australia have the most generous resettlement programs per cap in the world and provides more resettlement places than any other country bar Canada and USA?

Lets say even if the current government was against refugees, why have we increased our refugee quota in recent years?????

The last few years have seen the highest numbers historically (bar maybe the Vietnam period)

Seriously watch this video link i provided above to educate yourselfs, it deals with pretty much everything discussed here.

The "issue", ID, is the political expedience. If you can't see how politicians have made mileage out of the refugee issue then I wonder what country you've been living in the last two decades.

Here's a clue: why does it always come up around election time?

And you should also be cautious about who you call stupid.

I don't know much about the guy, never allowed politics during the Howard era, but everything he says is 100% true, i read your crappy bias Saturday paper and Guardian links so do your self a favour and educate yourself and watch the video from start to finish.

Complete and utter bollocks, your view is uneducated and naive.

For the one hundredth time, NO ONE is locked up, they are free to go at any time and have rejected resettlement options provided, every single person on Nauru and Manus has it better than millions of displaced people and millions of people in this world.

There has been 12 deaths from thousands on Nauru and Manus, most have been suicides some heart attacks etc s at least one or two accidents involving motorbikes etc

Deaths happen everyday everywhere thats life, imagine the deaths and suicides in places like refuge camps.

I hate the deaths at see bullshit, but how many drowned trying to get to Australia?
according to this link https://theconversation.com/factcheck-did-1200-refugees-die-at-sea-under...

1100 under Labor and between 400 to 760 under liberals (so roughly 1500 to almost 1900) and thats only taking into account the ones we know off, in reality there could be many more.

Not to mention the death in numbers in onshore centres in Australia far greater than offshore, You can see them in detail here https://arts.monash.edu/border-crossing-observatory/research-agenda/aust...

Suicide and mental health is a problem all around the world just in the last 10 years in only a few hundred metres of my house three people have commented suicide, two were middle aged surfers both successful tradies and you would never have guessed they would take their own life's another only a few months back was a daughter of an friends an Indonesian mixed couple she was only 19 and has the best family and a decent job, uni educated had the world to live for, going to her funeral was probably the saddest thing I've ever done especially seeing her parents are friends and it was their only child and they are too old to have another child.

@Stu

Yes politicians use whatever they can to gain support or make the other party look bad, on every single issue there is, no body denies that.

As for timing lets remember its only an issue because of Labor pushing the media vac bill.

Kind of strange really seeing this issue only favours liberals, why risk giving a sliver of hope to the liberals?

Mate, that's just plain incorrect. Up until recently our refugee programs largely had bipartisan support, they were seen as genuine aid and exempt from political point scoring. That all ended with you-know-who.

This coming election was tipped to be about banks and boats long before Dr Kerryn Phelps put her hat in the ring with Medevac. Fairfax, News, and ABC all said the same thing just after ScoMo's August promotion and they were right.

To be fair, it wasn't much of a prediction. Like a dog returning to its vomit, it was plain as day how the Libs would fight this election.

stu, you have multiple times called pretty much anyone who disagrees with you many variations of stupid, naive, gullible, so am surprised (not really ) you take issue with i-d.
the "deaths at sea" is sensitive for stu et al (see previous exchanges) because it doesnt fit with their preferred narrative that they are moral, ethical and upright and anyone who disagrees basically isnt (ie various permutations of greedy, stupid gullible etc). see multiple posts from you know who.
accepting both a responsibility for the deaths due to policies they espouse (open borders essentially) as well as accepting that opponents may actually have a reasoned and reasonable point of view is just not in their make-up

in relation to refugees they love the phrase "dog-whistling" (guysmileys favorite term) to imply people with a contrary view are not really concerned by 1200 plus people dying at sea, but cynically using these dead people to promote their inherent racism. i think this is to satisfy their core belief that they are , well, just right about everything

oh and maybe this issue comes up at election time because, well there is going to be an election? just a thought

Howard tried to shake my hand once around the time of the Tampa. He was walking around the Treasury Gardens in Melbourne followed by 4 or 5 minders and a camera crew looking for some photo ops. With hand moving off his hip he looked up and saw the look on my face and quickly changed direction. Later in the same week I saw him heckled by lots of people as he scurried down Collins St surrounded by his minders, off to lunch he was at the Melbourne Club.

Took this photo of a stencil on a wall in Hobart April 2008.

@LL

Mate, I answered you. You appeared to agree that, yes, genocides were occurring in those countries (Hazara genocide in Afghanistan, Tamil genocide in Sri Lanka, Uighur genocide in China, and Rohinga genocide in Myanmar).

Therefore, if the people weren't able to escape then they wouldn't die at sea, but they'd die via other means - because that's what happens in a genocide.

So what's really your point?

and "bipartisan support for refugees until you-know-who" ?, john howard, devil incarnate for those who dont. thats just bullshit
everyones hero gough whitlam tried everything to block the original vietnamese boat-people coming to australia as he did not want to offend communist north vietnam . look it up and learn something ( i doubt that will happen) mal fraser over-ruled gough.

they made it to indonesia mate, they arent dying there. they die because they get on a boat to australia. are you really that..

They die because they're desperate. Sitting at the bottom rung of a Less Developed nation, suffering racism as ID mentioned in the thread in question, and with zero work propects. You think all Indonesians are as welcoming as the wood carving salesman pulling up next to your $1K a day boat at Maccas?

Note how deaths at sea simply wasn't an issue during the wave of Vietnamese, and later Cambodians, despite many people also dying. It wasn't an issue because no-one had strategised it as the crocodile tears masking blind denial that it currently is.

"At that time the Taliban were controlling most of Afghanistan. There was a genocide against the Hazar population. We believe that 62% of our population has been killed in a systematic genocide."

"I was 18 when my father decided it wasn't safe for me. At that time the Taliban was looking for young males to fight on their side so I did not have much option. I either had to go and fight alongside them or against them, and my father decided it was not safe for me to live in Afghanistan anymore."

where i grew up, it was a western liberal democracy based upon christian values. the most important of these values was christ's teaching that we should treat others as we would like to be treated.
these are basic australian cultural values.

some people like skypan, indo dreaming and loungelizard seem to be reject australia's culture and values. why?

@Chook

(not that i care about religion) But what are true christian values or Australian values? or how would you like to be treated?

Can we agree...these values are equally and fairly as possible?

Thats what i want or support, i support one system for all refugees, where resources or class etc is irrelevant, grab your ticket and hope your number comes up, if it was up to me every single refugee would be resettled in this way.

Do you think the majority of refugees in Somalia or Sudan where the average wave is far less than $100USD a month has the same ability to travel and pay people smugglers as refugees from Iran or Syria where the average wage is much higher?

Off course not..and thats not even taking into account many refugees in any country even countries like Iran or Syria are dirt poor, most have no to little income or savings, they can't travel, they are just surviving. (the people you care happy to see disadvantaged further)

If you look at Manus or Nauru, then how is providing safety, shelter, food, clothing, education, medical care, temporary protection and resettlement options going against Christian or Australian values???

People can kid themselves and think Howard somehow invented this issue but if Howard never got elected and it Labor was elected through the same period.

This issue would still be around today, its a world wide issue, yeah sure our involvement in wars may not help, but its not the cause even without our involvement it would be an issue.

The cause is basically population growth, people fighting over differences, fighting over resources, religion, politics etc

And its going to get worse and worse as time goes on.

IMHO a big factor in that Howard era was the increased ease of sharing information, the internet, mobil phones, the bubbles people lived in are breaking.

I mean its quite obvious people here are still in bubbles, but we still have much pre connections and understandings of the greater world and we receive news and information in real time.

Also the increased ease of travel and in most cases the cost as reduced, remember airline fees in the 80,90s?...crazy enough as expensive as now or even more.

In the 70s we saw a spike with Vietnam but then once it settled down we were around 2 to 5 million displaced people in the world, we are now at over 60 million.

so youd like to get in an indo fishing boat with your kids and land it on the rocks at xmas island chook? good for you champ

@indo, just today you have said you weren't too much aware of Howard at the time, what Howard says is 100% true and now Howard didn't invent the issue. So what is it?

As @stu alluded to today migration policy in Australia was strongly bipartisan right up to Howard's pre election "we will decide who comes to this country here and the circumstances in which they come" speech. This speech and his election changed the political landscape and it has been used by the LNP ever since to wedge Labor.

Focusing on boat arrivals and latterly the medieval issue while ignoring the greater problem on plane arrivals is just part of the same political song-line.

"treat others as we would like to be treated" ie encourage others to get on rickety boats because thats what we would like to do. good for you trying out some big words though blindboy!

ok guy im in a cranky mood, ill say again there was no consensus, alp tried to block vietnamese boatpeople, gough recognised russias annexation of the baltic countries and blocked migration from the regime, and calwell deputy leader of alp in the 60's (and minister for immigration !) espoused alp and union white australia policy with his "2 wongs dont make a white" bon mot

Odd argument. They're hopping on the boats because they're fleeing persecution, and most are found to be genuine. Just because we stopped the boats doesn't make the persecution go away, it just means we've shirked our international duty.

Speaking of simple...

http://www.theshovel.com.au/2019/03/12/barnaby-joyce-says-nationals-not-...

#beetrooter